Cowhide Cliff
Member
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2015
- Messages
- 1,090
There is no such thing. Best one for plinking is far from best for hunting.
Right. What I said was an example to illustrate a point. Lever guns are just as effective as they've always been. The problem is that your opponent is very likely to have a weapon that is more effective.But the subject is lever guns, not flintlocks.
35W
I sorry but you lack context and situational awareness.Only in movies and on TV. In the real world there are several disadvantages to using a lever action.
The military evaluated lever guns but briefly chose a single shot before quickly moving to bolt rifles. Lever guns were issued to some National Guard units but were never used as a front-line military rifle.
If for some reason a semi-auto was not an option, I'd choose a compact "scout style" bolt rifle for exactly the same reasons the military chose bolt guns over levers.
Comparing bolt guns to levers a bolt rifle is:
Cheaper
Lighter, if in the same barrel length
More accurate
More reliable
Shoots more powerful cartridges
Greater effective range
Can be reloaded faster
Can easily be shot prone, supported and from behind cover. To operate a lever action requires the shooter to expose himself to return fire
The only minor edge a lever gun has is rate of fire. If you're goal is to simply fire 5 or 6 rounds in a hurry, you can do that faster with a lever action. But if there is a requirement that all 5 or 6 rounds actually hit a target it is a draw.
But between a lever in 44 mag or 30-30 my 1st choice is one of the Marlins made with a straight grip. Those are somewhat hard to come by so my 2nd choice is a Winchester. Those tend to be lighter and more compact than the pistol gripped Marlins.
Compared to 44 mag recoil is about the same. The 44 usually holds a few more rounds, but it isn't worth giving up the better accuracy and longer range capability of 30-30 to me. Rifles in 30-30 are a lot more common and at better prices too.
Right. What I said was an example to illustrate a point. Lever guns are just as effective as they've always been. The problem is that your opponent is very likely to have a weapon that is more effective.
I never said or implied anything of the sort.Thinking that having a defensive that is as effective as your opponents makes you their equal is naive to say the least.
First, I never mentioned AR's. Second, "high" capacity magazines and fast reloads do make a weapon more effective. That's why all modern small arms that are built for combat, (other than those intended for long range use) have those capabilities. Third, why are you comparing someone who is highly competent with their weapon system with someone else who is incompetent with theirs? The fact is, all else being equal, lever actions are less effective combat weapons than semi or full auto actions.A man who knows how to use a lever action effectively is far more effective than someone with an AR who relies on high capacity magazines and fast reloads. 35W
I never said or implied anything of the sort.
First, I never mentioned AR's. Second, "high" capacity magazines and fast reloads do make a weapon more effective. That's why all modern small arms that are built for combat, (other than those intended for long range use) have those capabilities. Third, why are you comparing someone who is highly competent with their weapon system with someone else who is incompetent with theirs? The fact is, all else being equal, lever actions are less effective combat weapons than semi or full auto actions.
Re-read the last sentence in my post that you quoted.You very much implied that when you stated that it's a problem if your opponent has a weapon that's more effective.
No, you never mentioned AR's specifically, but the implication is definitely there, especially now that you've said "...high" capacity magazines and fast reloads do make a weapon more effective.".
High capacity magazines and fast reloads only matter if 1) One is a poor marksman and tends to miss their target, thus requiring more ammunition 2) One is playing a video game or 3) One really believes that they can fend off hordes bad guys with whatever semi-auto rifle it is you're not talking about and plenty of extra "mags".
Why am I comparing a competent rifleman to an incompetent one? EASY, competence with a firearm that is deemed "less effective" will always trump incompetence with a firearm deemed "more effective". Are you getting it?? It's the Indian, not the arrow.
35W
What's wrong with a lever gun for self defense? They've been in continuous use in that role since approximately 1860. Has something changed, rendering them ineffective?
35W
My Rossi R92 in 44 is not the ideal gun in any situation, but probably tops the list in terms of do-it-all versatility. I installed a Marbles bullseye rear peep and a leather carry strap. For around $600, it is a workhorse:
White-tail deer and hogs within 100 yards -> 270 better
44 spl can dispatch coyotes -> 223 better
Can stop a charging black bear -> 45-70 better
44 spl an okay choice for home defense -> won’t start an argument, but many rounds better
44 spl borderline cheap enough for plinking -> 38 spl, 22 better
Iron sighted scout rifle / practical rifle set-up -> 308/7mm-08 better
Lightweight walkabout woods or backcountry rifle
Truck gun
only significant weakness is lack of long range options, not an option as a lightweight all weather mountain rifle.
Warrants serious consideration if I could only own one firearm for non-sentimental utilitarian purposes.
Comparing bolt guns to levers a bolt rifle is:
Can easily be shot prone, supported and from behind cover. To operate a lever action requires the shooter to expose himself to return fire.
What do you prefer for a do it all lever action rifle?
There is no such thing. Best one for plinking is far from best for hunting.