Ruger blackhawk firelapping

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if you seat those bullets upside down, you could eliminate the belling part, imo. pushing on the flat base of the bullet and all.

murf
 
Murf, you know I did it that way with the first batch of 20, I don't why I retrogressed and did it the other way with the 2nd batch? :banghead:
I'M C0NFUSED, NO WAIT MAYBE I'M NOT!
Keep me straight Murf! Well get there!
 
yugorpk,

would that be a "taylor" throat chamfer tool?

murf
Its the 11 degree Brownells 080479451 kit. Ive used it on several .45 guns and it works like a champ in about 3 seconds . It works down to .357 . Ive got a 45 plug gauge. None of this stuff costs all that much. Not using it right now and if someone wanted to pay shipping and a deposit they could borrow it
 
yugorpk,

that's a forcing cone cutter. catpop is trying to get rid of a barrel restriction about an inch down the barrel. thx for the offer, though.

murf
 
20 firelaps

Test Observation Procedure: 10 passes with bronze bristle bore brush and Hoppes #9. Followed by clean dry patch. Observe leading left in bore.
Deleading Procedure: One application=10 strokes of Chore Boy on bronze bristle brush with Hoppes #9.
Accuracy: 5+ 5 shot targets, 50', average group size
Target Load: 158 gr Missouri LSWC (12br) over 4.0 gr Win 231
# Rounds/ test: 50
Prior accuracy: 2.55" 4.0 gr, 2.73" 4.5 gr, 2.10" 5.0 gr

Test 1 After 20 firelaps:
Leading: reduced by 25% +/-, 0100 to 0500 no leading, balance leading.
Cleaning: one deleading application
Accuracy: 2.45", 1 3/8 to 3 1/2

Results of next 20 firelaps next week!
There has been an improvement as it used to take 2-4 deleading applications.
 
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I fire-lapped an old Rossi 44 Special snubby years ago who's barrel looked like it was made with a file. About half of each 240 cast bullet was stuck to the walls after firing. Well, that was maybe an exaggeration but it really leaded up badly.

Took the lube out of 10 bullets and packed them with valve lapping compound and after two cylinders worth the thing was amazing! Shined it up and the leading pretty much stopped plus the accuracy (which before saying it was accurate was laughable) really improved enough that we could hit things with it.

But...it shined up the whole length of the barrel. If you're just attacking the first inch...is firelapping not going to do the same thing to the whole tube? If you get that first inch cleaned up will it not also open up down the barrel which might hurt your accuracy.

Have you considered manually lapping just that troublesome spot? Wouldn't be too tough to just concentrate your efforts on where it's needed and leave the rest of the tube alone.

Also..isn't a tendency to lead the first bit of barrel referred to 'pressure leading' or something along those lines? Means the bullet is maybe a bit too hard to obturate enough and seal which lets gas past which melts and deposits on the tube. Leading at the end means it's running out of lube...which you aren't. Just wondering if you''ve played with different lead compositions to see if that has any affect on the leading.
 
I used the Wheeler kit on a Ruger Blackhawk and it worked well. Accuracy improved and no leading.
 
Kelbro,
Was your leading in the first inch or down entire bore?

RecoilRob,
Very good point. Do you have any personal experience with manual lapping you could share with those following this thread?

Also, I have tried Oregon Trail, my ww home cast, my friends ww home cast, Sierra lead, all prior to my current use of Missouri. All leaded! Even a few gas checked boolits leaded!:what: Only thing that didn't lead was jhp, but then there was copper fouling!:neener:

I've done some sandblasting in my day, probably more than I cared to, and found the sand lost a percentage of its cutting efficiency after the first use (recycling sand, like in a cabinet blaster). I figured the most aggressive cutting would occur at the point of first contact and demenish progressively from there. So the later part of bore would not lap as much as first inch.

Anyway, I feel with 20 more this weekend I should start seeing some real results. Like I said leading has already been reduced from the normal manual chore. Another 25% would be great and accuracy does not seem to have suffered.

The testing continues!
 
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that is why i recommended cleaning after each shot. maybe take the chorboy and patches to the range and scrape the lead out after each shot. i was wasting my time shooting 5, or 10 then cleaning as the first shot firelaps the barrel and the next 4, or 9 firelap the lead left in the barrel after the first shot.

it took about fifty rounds down the barrel to get the restriction out, as i recall. lookin good so far!

murf
 
not a waste. depends on the situation. i would check and see how much the first firelap bullet leads the barrel and proceed accordingly. in my case, the first bullet leaded the barrel enough that i decided to clean after each shot, ymmv.

luck,

murf
 
another reason to clean after every shot: you are firelapping to remove a restriction that is about an inch down the front of the barrel. each shot puts more and more lapping compound in and farther down the barrel. so, the excess lapping compound farther down isn't lapping the restriction, but is lapping the rest of the barrel. i'm not sure if that is a good idea because that part of the barrel is already the correct diameter.

i also think some are trying to sell bullets and lapping compound. cleaning after every shot will probably use a lot less bullets and compound. my opinion

murf
 
Very good point. Do you have any personal experience with manual lapping you could share with those following this thread?

Actually no, I've never lapped a barrel. Polished a bunch with JB Paste but I don't believe it actually removed much metal though they did shine a lot nicer afterwards and didn't foul nearly so bad as they had from the factory.

I've seen video's of people lapping barrels, and I believe they had a lead slug impregnated with compound though I can't remember just what they used. If you used Cerrosafe http://www.midwayusa.com/product/462291/cerrosafe-chamber-casting-alloy-1-2-lb you could cast a slug in the end of the barrel. Thread it so you can affix a cleaning rod then push it up the barrel. It should stick in the tight area, which you could then work on with abrasives painted from the forcing cone area. I'm thinking this would let you open it up a bit if you just worked the slug in that area. Of course, this is all conjecture and might be totally back-assward but might jog a thought for you. There's got to be a way to do it!:)
 
The area of constriction should swage down the bullet as it passes through, so the lapping effect would be more there than in the rest of the barrel. I wouldn't worry a lot about it as long as you're going slow and monitoring the effect.
 
Test 2

TEST 2 today with more improvement!!!!!!
10 more fire laps, this time as murf suggested - fire one, clean the barrel, repeat, 10 times.
Total laps now at 30 (10 correctly, 20 maybe not so effective)
Results: after standard cleaning barrel only a minute amount of lead at 6 and 7 o'clock! Wow! This was easily removed with Chore boy.
Accuracy: 2.75" (note ran out of 4.0 grains universal and had to finish test with 4.5 grains universal, Dillon SD still at factory)
Never had so little leading from this gun! I'm getting excited!
More next week!

Note: I did not seem to be getting any leading during the actual fire lappimg.
 
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Test 3

10 more fire laps and still reducing the leading problem.
Finished up the last of the 4.0 gr. Win 231 with 4 groups producing a 3.06" average group.
Then fired 4 groups of older 3.0 Red Dot producing a 2.44" average group.
Total lead only rounds fired 50 as in all test.
Leading was confined to two very small dabs just past the forcing cone at 4 and 7 oclock after the standard cleaning. This was easily removed with Chore Boy. I was hoping for none, but I still have more work to do. But it is improving with each test.
With warmer weather, my work load is imcreasing, but I'll try to get another lapping in by next week. I hope to finish up this project by summer.
 
good deal, catpop. looks like you are almost there. you might want to slug your barrel after you are done. that is the real test to see if the restriction is gone.

murf
 
Murf,
Thanks for reminding me to reslug. I hope to finish this quest before I get to busy with work. So far I've been able to get a test each week.
I've run out of bbwc so it looks like I will be using miss 158 gr lswc put in upside down. Or does it even matter since I have a bevel on the base of these.
Thanks for help
Cat
 
i don't think it matters because you are running them backwards. the key is to keep the velocity below 600 fps.

murf
 
I had to fire-lap a Ruger New Vaquero 45 Colt. I bought the Wheeler kit and used the bullet with the longest bearing surface I could find. I fired 65 rounds through before there was any meaningful difference. My MO was to load 5 over 3.0 grs. of Red Dot fire them, clean, repeat. I never saw any need to clean after each shot. Anyhow, after I was finished, the bore was slicker than goose excrement and once started, a lead ball could easily be pushed through the barrel with only hand pressure.
The bullets I used were some SWC's I cast and I even allowed a little compound on the front of the driving band figuring a little extra couldn't hurt.

35W
 
35 Whelan,
What was br of bullets you cast for firelapping? Pure lead, 8, 12, 18? Just curious, as I may have to case some. I do have a 158 lswc mold.
Catpop
 
If you're asking about hardness, they're somewhere around 10Bhn, but I wouldn't hesitate to use 14 if that was all I had.

35W
 
You guys have a lot more patients than I have. That revolver would have been on the way back to Ruger as soon as I figured out the problem with the barrel restriction.;) That is in reality a manufacturers defect that they should fix at no charge. Firelapping is useful but should not need to have to be done to make up for a factory mistake IMHO.
 
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