223 reloading frustration

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DaisyCutter

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I finally got around to setting up my turret press for 223, got the dies, bullets, primers, etc. I was excited to begin, initially. I thought I was ready. I've been reloading 44 Mag, 45 ACP and 30-06 for years. Each specific cartridge had a bit of a learning curve, to master the feel of working it, and dial in my equipment.

But 223 is a cusser like no other. I really hate it. The new dies are very sticky. I'm making a lot of trips to the garage to punch out a stuck case with a stripped rim. In fact, I've separated the decapping and resizing steps to minimize stress. Trimming is a pain in the butt too. The little cases just don't fit any of my equipment well.

Maybe the used brass is "blimped out" from a loose chamber? Maybe the smaller cases take more effort to resize than bigger ones I'm accustomed to dealing with? Maybe new dies need to be "broken in"?

I haven't even tried pouring powder down the skinny neck yet, but I'm sure it will be frustrating.

To top it off, all that extra aggravation is for a cartridge I shoot in higher volume magazine fed rifles, so whereas making 50 30-06s is a stellar day, making 50 223s won't even fill 2 mags.

Is 223 just a nightmare?

The powder I was planning to use can be repurposed to 30-06. I'm just stuck with 1K primers and bullets, dies, etc. I'll trade it for 2 cases of beer. Does anyone have any advise or handy tricks?

Is my experience with 223 just the nature of the beast? This caliber just ain't worth the aggravation.
 
Are you using enough resizing lube? Are you lubing the inside of the neck. Do you have more 1 shell holder, to make sure the one you're using isn't oversized?

Another thing, make sure the neck expander's largest OD isn't passing through the neck at the same time as the case is resized.
 
was considering loading .223 myself. I've heard that the transition from small arms (9mm, .38, .357, 45acp, 45LC, and 454 Casul) to .223 wasnt easy. Wished you lived closer to Medford, OR, I'd bring your favorite beverage and then an extra case or two for the trade.


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The 30-06 Springfield you have been loading is a .223 Remington on steroids. Really the .223 should be no more difficult to load and work with than any other basic bottle neck type cartridge.

OK, so we set the sizing die up according to manufacturers instructions. Generally raise the ram and screw the die down till it bumps the shell holder. Lower the ram and give the die about 1/8 turn more. Just like the 30-06 you need to lube the cases and at this point something is likely going wrong as you should not be getting stuck cases. You do not mention what case lube you are using or how you apply it? I use RCBS case slick which works fine for me. Some people like to roll their own but either way you should not be seeing stuck cases. Lately I have seen people complaining about Hornady One Shot. Some say it works but following directions to the letter is important. I can't say as I don't use the stuff.

Again, I have never had a problem loading .223. Once you get the bugs worked out neither will you. Like I said, a 30-06 is just a .223 on steroids.

Ron
 
I use imperial lube and wipe my finger and slide the case through my fingers and scrape a little into the mouth about every 10th or so. I trim all them in a large batch and done until they start growing. for putting powder in get the grey clear looking lyman funnel and it fits great on the 223 neck or use a powder thrower. I use both with good results.

I use rcbs dies and have stuck a few cause I forgot to lube but I loaded about 200 this week by sizing and primer on the press than throw powder in a case and dump to check on scale and funnel in case and seat the bullet. once I found my load and checked the measure 4 times at 24gr I threw, seated, done. you should try imperial wax and issues will be gone.
 
I'd try cleaning your dies and then use more lube than you have been. Loading .223 isn't necessarily more difficult than anything else.

I too started on 30-06. After loading a bunch of .223 and then going back to -06 it was like handling sections of sewer pipe.

Even One Shot works fine if you use enough and let it dry before you start sizing.

Laphroaig
 
DaisyCutter, what dies do you use and what lube?

I find 223 to be a bit more 'touchy' to reload than 308, i.e. easier to accidentally deform a case. However I have never had a case stick in a die (I'm using RCBS lube).

Are you using OneShot lube by any chance? I have seen many postings with stuck cases and the use of OneShot.
 
What lube are you using? I've used nothing but Lee sizing lube, and have zero problems.
Used brass from an auto does take quite a bit more effort to size, than brass from a nice and tight bolt action.

I use a Lyman universal trimmer, and 5.56 has never give me any grief getting it cut down to length.

For getting powder in there... I dispense (from a uniflow) into the case, and dump it in the scales pan. Trickle the weight up in the pan, then from the pan, back into the case with an rcbs funnel. It's pretty undramatic.
 
Rifle brass is a LOT more labor intensive than pistol. I had a bunch of stuck brass, the majority stuck pulling the neck sizer out. I make sure I spray some lube, (Lee, mixed with alcohol), into the necks, make sure the ENTIRE outside is lubed, (particularly near the head end). Not every case needs this, the lube will last a 'dry' case or two. I'll take an empty ammo tray, fill it with cases, neck side up, spray 'em, making sure some gets into the neck. Slip a second ammo tray on them, flip 'em over, spray the other end, dump into a large container, start over. This is probably more work than most, more than I need but I've had NO more problems with stuck cases and I've loaded a couple thousand. I 'batch' process my 223 brass so I always have a bunch in different 'stages', seems to work and be quite so tedious.
 
Is my experience with 223 just the nature of the beast?
Click to expand...
No, .223 is just as easy to load as any other. You need to clean your dies, use a good lube, get the proper equipment to trim the cases, and get a funnel to fit them if you are pouring powder into them.
 
ohihunter2014 said:
I use imperial lube and wipe my finger and slide the case through my fingers and scrape a little into the mouth about every 10th or so. I trim all them in a large batch and done until they start growing. for putting powder in get the grey clear looking lyman funnel and it fits great on the 223 neck or use a powder thrower. I use both with good results.

I use rcbs dies and have stuck a few cause I forgot to lube but I loaded about 200 this week by sizing and primer on the press than throw powder in a case and dump to check on scale and funnel in case and seat the bullet. once I found my load and checked the measure 4 times at 24gr I threw, seated, done. you should try imperial wax and issues will be gone.
Click to expand...
I just started .223 last week so I feel your pain. I found that significantly increasing the amount of lube I was using did the trick. If I understand you correctly, you are lubing all of the cases but only lubing the inside of the neck on every 10th or so?

I don't think that is going to cut it. I started lubing every case and my problems disappeared. I actually use Lee lube. I dissolve an entire tube of it in about 12-16 oz of alcohol. I put a couple of hundred cases in my wet tumbler (with it dry and clean), spray in a generous amount of the mixture and let them tumble for a couple of minutes. I used to just use a zip-lock bag and roll them around before I got the tumbler.

This seems to get them sufficiently coated both inside and out to do the trick.
 
Schwing said:
I just started .223 last week so I feel your pain. I found that significantly increasing the amount of lube I was using did the trick. If I understand you correctly, you are lubing all of the cases but only lubing the inside of the neck on every 10th or so?

I don't think that is going to cut it. I started lubing every case and my problems disappeared. I actually use Lee lube. I dissolve an entire tube of it in about 12-16 oz of alcohol. I put a couple of hundred cases in my wet tumbler (with it dry and clean), spray in a generous amount of the mixture and let them tumble for a couple of minutes. I used to just use a zip-lock bag and roll them around before I got the tumbler.

This seems to get them sufficiently coated both inside and out to do the trick.
Click to expand...
I take the wax and wipe it with a finger and rub it in my 2 fingers and slide the case between them and scrape the mouth on my finger on about every 10th. never had a problem but I have to make sure I have enough lube on my fingers or I stick one. I only lube the mouth every 10th so its a little smoother for my size button.
 
I too have found .223 (commercial brass and 5.56) to be no more difficult than any other round. Actually 30-30 was my first rifle round followed in a few months by the .223. I've always used Mink Oil Boot Dressing Cream with success and haven't stuck a case yet. The only thing I had trouble with was picking up those skinny bullets and setting them on the case...
 
Hey DaisyCutter,:)
As far as pouring the powder down those "skinny" necks, it's like Ironcaintit said - just use a powder funnel. Mine are RCBS, but I'm sure there are other brands that work well too.
I don't load for a .223 anymore, but I load for a couple of .22-250s. .22-250 necks are just as "skinny.":)
 
Pretty much everything has been already said .... the .223 Rem is no harder to size than any other bottleneck cartridge .... with the correct lube and the correct die set up ....

Handling the smaller bullets and getting power into the case can be trying at times .... that is until you try a .17 caliber cartridge ... then you'll think the .223 is a breeze!!
 
What brand of dies are you using??

What brand and number shell holder.

Personally, I haven't stuck a .223 case in over 40 years.
And you shouldn't be either.

rc
 
You and RC are giving me a mental complex here. The very first .223 case I sized got stuck! In fact, it got stuck so well that I had to use a pipe cutter to cut off the bottom of the case so I could get the decapping pin out. That's when I started lubing them all.

I haven't had any since but I have 40+ years before I can catch up to RC now:)
 
The new dies are very sticky.
Click to expand...

Whose dies?

I'm making a lot of trips to the garage to punch out a stuck case with a stripped rim.
Click to expand...

That sounds like a lubricant issue, not a die or cartridge issue. What are you using for a resizing lubricant? How are you applying it?

I've been reloading .223 Remington since 1980 and I have yet to stick a case in a resizing die. I did rip the neck off a case one time by not getting it adequately lubricated, but never an entire cartridge case. I use Lee's resizing lubricant or Hornady's Unique and they are both good at keeping cases lubricated.
 
Is 223 just a nightmare?
Click to expand...

.223 Remington was the second cartridge that I reloaded after .30 Carbine. It was more of a dream than a nightmare for me.

  • I inspect each case, paying attention to potential stretching of the case.
  • I use a universal decapper die to remove the primer.
  • I then clean and tumble the brass.
  • I resize the brass.
  • I tumble the brass to remove the resizing lubricant.
  • I trim the cases as needed.
  • I prime the brass.
  • I powder the brass (using an RCBS powder funnel)
  • I seat the bullet.
  • I inspect the completed round.

No problem, no nightmare.

There are some caveats. For example, you need to make sure that you don't get too much lubricant on the case shoulder or it will accumulate and dent the neck. But, on the whole it is a pretty straight-forward process.
 
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Not enough case lube.

I put a large handful of .223 cases in a plastic walmart bag and spray 6-8 squirts of RCBS CaseSlick pump spray case lube on the brass and shake/massage the bag for 30-45 seconds to distribute the lube. After sizing I wash the cases in warm water with some Dawn blue dish soap and let them air dry overnight.
 
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You and RC are giving me a mental complex here. The very first .223 case I sized got stuck!
Click to expand...
I didn't make 40 years either. I got careless one day after about 33 years and stuck one.

I read my old Speer manual cover to cover at least three times before ever starting. I over lubed at first. I started with .44 Mag., 9MM, and .45 ACP. Then .223 shortly after that. I hated lubing at first, but got used to it.
 
DaisyCutter said:
I've been reloading 44 Mag, 45 ACP and 30-06 for years... I haven't even tried pouring powder down the skinny neck yet, but I'm sure it will be frustrating.

The new dies are very sticky. I'm making a lot of trips to the garage to punch out a stuck case with a stripped rim.

In fact, I've separated the decapping and resizing steps to minimize stress.

Trimming is a pain in the butt too.
Click to expand...

I hope you haven't been reloading for years without a powder funnel? it makes life much easier.

A proper film of nearly any case lube should never let you stick a case in the die. Motor oil or WD40 is NOT CASE LUBE!!! Sticking one out of 10,000 cases may be the norm. Sticking 5 in the same night? STOP! You are doing something wrong.

How have you separated the decap/sizing process? What brand of dies? Does this mean you removed the decapping pin and the expander ball? Don't do that. You need the expander ball in the sizing die to properly expand the neck.

Yes trimming sucks. It sucks much less with a WFT case trimmer. Set it to you desired length, chuck it in a drill and just push your sized cases into it. Its easy and takes only a couple seconds per case with perfect results every time.
 
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