38 Special - 357 vs 38

I want something in a 4" that's pleasant to shoot and as accurate as a 4" can be.

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Weel, as others have stated here, the S&W M15 Combat Masterpiece is about as accurate as you will get in a budget off the shelf revolver. If you have a more to spend, you might look for a used shooter quality Colt Diamondback or S&W M14 K-38 Masterpiece.

I was lucky about 5 years ago and scored a 4" Colt Python that showed holster wear and very little signs of being shot for $1,120. I also have a S&W M15-7 that I bought new in the mid '90's. Both shoot very well and I love shooting them both. I had a trigger job done by a reputable gunsmith on the M15 and it is actually slightly better than the Python in double action. The Python still has a bit of an edge in SA, tho.

To address some issues brought up:

Accuracy- you're probably going to have to shoot that revolver in a Ransom Rest to see a difference, if any, between 38 and 357 loads.

Carbon ring- unless you're shooting crappy ammo this isn't an issue. I've shot hundreds of 38s in a 357 aND found no issue with this. Any issue is easily avoided by something I realize many don't practice...just clean your revolver regularly. I've never found a need to load 38 levels in a 357.

I've got a 44 magnum for full power loads- no doubt anything a 357 can do can be done with a 44 magnum. But you have to have the gun with you. If you've got 38s in the gun all you need do is swap them out for 357s, same as you wold do with the 44.

rduchateau2954,

You seem to be all over the map. First, it's this or this, then well maybe this or that. Sit yourself down and do some self-examination as to what you really want/need, then come back with some specific questions. Just trying to be helpful.

Don

rduchateau2954 said:

So.. I've stumbled upon something I've forgotten about. Seems to be right between the two. 327 Federal Magnum in a SP101

The S&W 67 is a nice looking 38, the colt police isn't my cup of tea though.

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You're overthinking this. Which I do all of the time. There are some great suggestions here already. Any Ruger or S&W will serve you well be it new or used. 357 or 38spl.

It's nice to have the ability to shoot 357, but a hot .38spl is nothing to sneeze at either. If I were loading a revolver for SD/HD, it would be a +p 38spl.

Just wanted to mention something. Nowadays, the desirable "old school", pre-lock S&W .38 special guns bring a premium. Oftentimes they will actually go for more than something like a common-as-dirt used GP100.



So there's that. Anyone saying that the dedicated .38 will always cost less might be mistaken. Often true... but not always.

MAKster said:

I bought a S&W 66 357 magnum because I thought the ability to shoot both loads would be a good idea. I shot a few boxes of 357 magnum when I first bought the revolver but didn't care for the recoil. I have been shooting only 38 special ever since. At that time you could still buy 4 inch 38 specials so I regret not buying a lighter 38 special model. But now I think the only new 38 specials sold are the 2 inch snub nose models so you probably have no choice but to buy a 357.

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I got my first handgun, a 4 inch S&W 686, back in the 90's because I wanted a .357. I did not know it at the time but later I was glad that I got the L frame as it soaks up the recoils really well with a set of Pachmyer grip. Recently I bought a used Model 10 (4 inch) from a LGS hosting a S&W day for a little over $200. It will be my .38 spcl range gun. It's trigger pull is just as smooth as my 686.

I think S&W still makes the Model 10. I've seen the new ones on sale and it is still shown at S&W website.

Let me put it like this; say I had two identical revolvers. One in 38 and one in 357 and I shot identical 38 round out of both. Which would perform better?

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In theory 38 Special ammunition will be more accurate from a handgun chambered for the 38 Special. The reason is the bullet doesn't have to jump the extra 1/10" longer chamber of the 357 cylinder.

So the theory goes....

Personally I think there are way too many other variables that affect accuracy.

In terms of ease of resell the 357 magnum will attract a higher price.

For practical use it depends on the size of the gun. My personal favorite size revolver is the S&W Model 10 4" heavy barrel (38 Special of course). With a Tyler T-Grip it just is about perfect packing pistol.

With that said I am considering getting a Ruger SP101 .357 with 4" barrel. Rugers are way overbuilt in strength and rugged. For use on the farm the stainless steel is a real plus and with the eyes not as good as they once were fiber optic front sight seems desirable.

However my pre-lock Model 10 heavy barrel is one of the last (quite possibly THE last) handguns I will part with.

I used to be a big proponent of the "357 versatility" thing (and kinda still am), but I've been swayed by some arguments for just sticking with the .38 pistol.
First, just like with 9mm ammo, they've really figured out the technology and are making some very effective 38 ammo these days.
For hunting, obviously the 357 is the way to go, but I'm personally not much of a hunter (and especially not with no danged pistol!), but for home defense, where you'd likely be shooting inside the house, with no ear protection, the 357 is gonna be like a concussion grenade going off in your lap. The 38 is more forgiving, while still being very effective. I have a pistol in the house loaded with 38's, and have no desire to upgrade to 357's.
Also, 95% of the times I've shot any 357 revolvers, it's been with the significantly cheaper 38 rounds in it. I don't get enough joy out of the bigger 'boom' to justify tossing the more expensive rounds downrange.
Another point, the .38 pistol itself is cheaper, and typically much easier to find a real deal on (old Model 10's, etc.) than anything chambered in 357.
So, if you really need a 357, then that's cool, but I'm starting to feel that the economy and acceptable effectiveness of the 38 pistol/round, often make it more practical than a pistol chambered in 357, particularly in self-defense, or general plinking applications.

Either one will work

I am guilty of going by the numbers meaning looking at the ballistics and .357 is pretty impressive and .38 seems kind of wimpy. The .38 is fine but the bells and whistles don't go off if you only look at the numbers.

Since you already have a full house magnum, it sounds to me like the .38 would be the ticket. I have both and shoot both but my .357 is a 6 inch 686 so recoil seems to be a non-issue. My .38 is a two inch 64 so it is not an accuracy gun.

If I were buying a new revolver, I would get a 3 inch .357 but admit the 4 inch would be a better shooter.

I bought the spacer for my dies so I can easily switch between .38 and .357. I have never loaded +P for the .38 and never loaded a light or max load for the .357 so I enjoy shooting both guns. Cleaning the cylinder of the .357 after shooting .38 is a non-issue for me as well.

Depending on the powder used, you probably would need small pistol and magnum primers. Going from memory which is scary, I don't remember any of my powders being listed for both. I am sure that is not always true but consider you might need two powders.

I would just look around and try to find the gun you like. There is no right or wrong answer and there is also the possibility that you will buy a second gun later on in the other caliber.

I had the same question in my mind when I bought my 3" SP101; .38 or .357..?
I got the revolver in .357 because of the versatility. Shooting the magnums in this small pistol is certainly an experience, but not unmanageable. Shootng .38s is a pure joy. I'm currently working up to find a suitable .38+P load using the .357 cases.

In my view, the 357 is the way to go. Even if you don't think you'll use the magnum ammo, you may find yourself someday needing it. You may decide on going on a hike, fishing, camping trip or a cross country trip in your car. In these situations a .38 would be a bit anemic. Most cops I've known for years don't worry a bit about any loss of accuracy. They shoot by far more 38s in them than 357s and they just don't worry about it. Being able to crank up the horsepower makes the 357 incredibly more versatile without adversely affecting accuracy.

I am probably going to offend some in this thread by saying I do not enjoy firing the SP-101 with 357 magnum loads.

I fired it in a indoor range with "double" ear protection, bugs in my ear with muff cover both ears. It was a 2.5 - 3 inch 101. When I pulled the trigger I saw 3 flame throwers coming out of the gun, the barrel and two from the cylinder gap, one from each side. The recoil was stout but not unmanageable. The kicker was that night when I go to sleep ~midnight my ears still ring from the shots. I kept hearing bang, bang, BANG!

I don't see the purpose of this gun because I don't enjoy shooting it. I know many people buy this gun for concealed carry and pray that they never have to use it. If I need to carry a 357 in the woods I'd carry my 4 inch 686 as the extra weight will be "comforting".

Sorry in advance for offending the SP-101 fans. Just want to offer my 2 cents.

If the OP has his mind set on getting just a .38 Special then a S&W Model 15 would be a perfect way to go in that regard.

rduchateau2954 said:

Something that has been bugging me for a while. One of the next guns on my list is a 4" revolver. I'm thinking in 38 special.

In your opinion which is better? Buy a 357 and shoot 38 or buy a 38?

I already have a 7 1/2" Ruger Super Black Hawk in 44mag so I've got my big gun fix. I also reload.

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Unless you're talking specific features (I'd always shoot a Smith 14 for bullseye revolver over almost any .357), I'd go with the .357 since it gives you more versatility.

I seldom have any use for a .357 Magnum, and if I do I'm far more likely to go to a larger bore .44 or .45.

A .38 Special revolver is usually lighter to carry, and you don't have to worry about getting lead fouling out of the front of the longer Magnum chamber lest it make extraction of fired .357 cases difficult.

In smaller/lighter/short-barreled guns the Magnum offers muzzle blast and a level of recoil that makes fast but accurate follow-up shots difficult if not impossible, especially if you are shooting one-handed on you're weak side.

Why not use both hands? Because sometimes for various reasons you can't.

If you are looking for a practical all-around non-magnum revolver seriously consider a S&W K-38 Combat Masterpiece (aka Model 15).

Ease your mind and conscience...get one of each.

I scratched this itch with a very inexpensive NYPD Model 10 .38. It is astoundingly accurate and has a great trigger.


If I were the OP, buy the cheapest nice 4" revolver you can find - which is usually going to be a Model 10. After you get it and shoot it, if you feel you need something more, sell it for what you bought it for and buy exactly what you need.

I don't think it ever works to buy the "ultimate" gun out of the gate. Sometimes it works out, but often it ends up being the expensive gun that you wished you had a better idea about before you chose it. Buying quality on the cheap is rarely disappointing.


After you've fired your basic S&W .38 for awhile, maybe its actually a 3" .357 that you'll ultimately want, or an 8 shot cylinder, or one with adjustable sights.

I think I'd get a 357. Because, why not be able to fire both?

If you have no desire to shoot .357 loads get the 38 special. I have a 6" S&W K 38 and would not give it up for anything. The stainless .357 3" is another matter.

Would be hard to beat a 4" gp100 for your purposes. You can find them second hand for under 500 and will never wear them out. Hope this will be my next purchase but in the 5" or 6" flavor as I may try to take a deer with it. I own a 3" sp 101 that is a joy to shoot and carry, the 4" may suit your fancy of you like something smaller then the GP.


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What is all the hand wringing and drama of a buildup of gunk from firing a shorter cartridge in a longer chamber? Just get out the brass brush and clean it like my dad taught me when I was 7 or 8. His theory was if you are old enough to shoot it, you are old enough to clean it. As a kid growing up in the depression he had his Winchester 06 .22 his dad bought used for him(it was a couple of years older than he was). Being the Great Depression he often had to scrounge for ammunition to shoot in it. He cleaned the gun as well as he could in those days. He came into possession of a bunch of .22 shorts around 1937-38 when he was 14-15. He shot most of them up, but he said the few .22 longs & LR's he had would no longer chamber(you could buy ammo by the round at hardware stores and other places well into the 50's and still a lot of places in the 60's). By that time shooting his old .22 was less relevant in 1941 as he graduated from HS and got his first real job as a shoe salesman. Then came Dec 7, 1941. The next day he joined the USMC and didn't see his .22 until after Nov 1945. He told me that during basic training when in firearms cleaning he had an "Ah Ha" moment relating to his .22. The shorts had made a ring in the chamber and patches with cleaner were not going to clean that out. A bristled brass brush and aggressive cleaning was the only thing to get rid of it. When he came home he cleaned it as his military training and never had problems afterwards. It is the way I was taught to clean a gun even today I still clean as I was taught. No halfhearted swipes with a bore snake for me Never owned one yet and never will. I have the gun which he gave me when I was 12(1963) and still shoot .22 shorts in it occasionally, I just clean it good afterwards and have no problems shooting Longs or LR's afterwards. The same would apply to .32, .38 & .44 caliber chamberings.

The 38 will be more consistently accurate compared to the 357 shooting 38 loads. This is my experience testing loads at 50 yards. A model 15 is great advice. 38 special is a wonderful and very, very accurate caliber.

I love 38 special and I shoot hand loads with 158 gr lead at around 890 fps. I shoot a 642 the most in this caliber, but I have blackhawks in 357 and 45. I thought about some 357 brass, but I think anytime the 38 wouldn't do, the 357 wouldn't do either (hogs.) Just my thoughts. I guess I could try 357 on hogs, but I don't see any benefit to me and a lot of possible consequence. I've always thought those that do probably handgun deer. Just not sure what problem I have that it would solve for me.

I know some people will ask, but what if you don't reload? Reloading revolver ammo is so easy even with a simple $40 hand press kit that I think that argument is not very powerful.

I have several of each. If I could only have one centerfire handgun it would be a 4" medium-framed 357.

I mildly prefer my 357's to my 38's. I can shoot 357 if I want to (which is rare). They shoot 38's just as accurately as they do 357's, as far as I can tell. I see them as more heavy-duty, being made to withstand a more powerful cartridge, so I figure I can shoot 38's out of them forever without wearing them out or putting any strain on them.

Either one is a good choice, IMHO.