Varget vs. H4350

Rockdoc173 said:

I'm still just a pup at this reloading game and on top of that I haven't had my 6.5 Cr. very long. Put the two together and ignorance abounds so I'm hoping I can fix some of that. Ive been loading 308 for a while with Varget and have seen very good results. I assumed that it could be used on my 6.5C load but then I saw someone talking about it not performing well in that application, suggesting instead H-4350 is more appropriate. Would someone explain this to me? Is it the burn rates, bullet size, type of power granule?

BTW: This is my first post here. I've learned a lot from stalking you guys for some time.

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All of the above. Experience is the best teacher when it comes to powder.if not your own then get a leg up and benefit from others.

I've loaded for .308 for 40 years, but have no experience with 6.5 Cr. Varget is quite a bit faster burning than H-4350, and H-4350 is too slow for optimum velocities in .308 Win. That's probably why you are reading that it is not ideal in 6.5 Cr., you need a slower powder burn rate.

Welcome to the forum.

Which load manuals do you own? Most will have a section in the front which explains powders, powders speeds and most everything else about reloading better than I can. Many reloaders use manuals for load data alone but they are much more.

Agreed, READ the first half of the book/books. You can pick up some great info, and a few things that might get you going quicker.

Personally Ive just started on the 6.5, and im looking toward the slower end of the spectrum. Id suggest h-4350, or something a little slower than varget at least.

How long is your barrel?

While most folks choose powders for a given bullet that give highest velocity for a given peak pressure, seldom do they produce best accuracy. I don't think ball powders produce accuracy as good as stick/extruded powders.

If 1/4 to 1/3 MOA improvement in accuracy is more important than 100 fps more velocity, use powders about 3/4 down the burn rate scale (fastest to slowest) of all extruded powders listed for that bullet for the cartridge.

http://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/Burn Rates - 2015-2016.pdf

Varget is a very versatile powder, and I suspect it would be a good choice for 6.5 Creedmoor. Until you test it and compare to 4350 its all speculation.

Varget is my go to for 260 Rem, which is a very similar cartridge to the CM.

Laphroaig

I think the general concensus is H4350 ,RL17, and IMR 4451 in that order, are the go to powders for 140 class bullets with the Creedmoor.
Varget is used in the 120 and lower gr bullets though. Varget should work with 140's but is probably not optimal.

I use H4350 and RL 17 with 140's in my Savage 12lrp. The RL 17 produces slightly faster speeds than H4350 with the same charge but H4350 "should" be more temp stable. I haven't shot it enough to verify.
Josh

Rockdoc173 said:

It's a 24" RPR

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My sons have a .308 and a .243 and both shoot real well with varget. Barrels are 22" and 24". Not max loads either one.

I would think the low end of 4350 would do well

With my Savage 10 with a 24" barrel, I run a fast powder (IMR4895) and get awesome accuracy (~1/2 moa) and descent velocity (2850) with 123 Nosler CC.

This may not be perfectly applicable to the creedmoor, but based on the load data for my 6.5x55, it appears that Varget is better for bullet weights of 120gn and lower, and H4350 is better for bullet weights over 120gn. I have both powders and bullets from 95gn to 143gn (and 147gn soon) and will be testing this.

I have a CM with a 28" barrel and Varget works wonders....with 95 gr Vmax bullets to 140 gr ELDs.....just do your home work with good modern load manuals and work up your loads....

Best powder for any of the 6 and 6.5mm cartridges is probably H4350, followed by Varget. Go look at the PRS standings On Precision Rifle Blog, more specifically, the What the Pros Use section.

Worst part about H4350? Its hard to get, to the point I put off building a rifle either chambered in 6.5 CM or 6.5X47. Sure, I could use IMR 4451, or IMR 4350, RL 17, but Im the type that feels the need to use the most proven combinations to avoid a bunch of screwing around.

Welcome to the wonderfully intriguing, frustrating, mystifying, and rewarding world of internet discussions of reloading.

As per above, first, always use published data for loading.

While the voices of experience here and on lesser fora ;-) can definitely help inform your opinions, provided you stick to rule number 1, developing your own experience by trying things is ideal. I load 308 for use in a PTR-91 and use IMR 4064 because it works well in that application and is readily available. I don't load 6.5 Creedmoor but do load for 6.5x55 and use Varget exclusively, but my Swede is an 18.5" barrel and not well suited to 4350. As others have suggested, my experience is that 4350 excels as one gets towards the top end of bullet weights for caliber, but with a 24" barrel, you may find 4350 works well from 120grs up. Worth trying if you can lay hands on a pound of H4350 and having a shoot-off Varget vs H4350 with the same bullets.

A nice thing about Sierra and Nosler manuals is that they specify which powder and charge yielded the best accuracy for a given bullet weight. I generally try to acquire the power they specify for a starting point. If I can't find it, I look for the powders closest to the "best" powders burn rate.
Testing ladder loading with different powders is another way to get a direction as to which powder your particular rifle likes best.