The best handgun stopping power!

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wally

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I wish these incidents were more widely publicised.
Based on the goblin's demeanour it's a safe bet he would have continued to assault the woman, possibly her co-worker too, had he not been shown the business end of the pistol.
 
I wish we had stats on these "no-fire" defensive use of firearms. I suspect a lot of them aren't reported.
I have stropped dangerous home intruders by producing a pistol without firing it three times. I never reported any of them.

For the one where calling the police was possible and possibly useful, I elected to leave out one little detail....
 
I wish we had stats on these "no-fire" defensive use of firearms. I suspect a lot of them aren't reported.

You’re right.

I saw a friend get carjacked in the middle of the afternoon in quiet Salem Va. An older guy jumped into my buddies car (I was in front of him) and pulled a knife on him. My buddy pulled his 45 and drove him into Roanoke and left him miles from Salem. When he got back we asked why he didn’t take him to the police. He said he didn’t want to ruin our lunch as he already wasted some of our time.

I know of cases where others have pulled a gun to stop an attacker. So yea, the stats are not there as they’re not reported.
 
I have stropped dangerous home intruders by producing a pistol without firing it three times. I never reported any of them.

For the one where calling the police was possible and possibly useful, I elected to leave out one little detail....
Move. Sounds like you live in Sadr City. ;)
 
Move. Sounds like you live in Sadr City
No. Two occurred in a great neighborhood in an upscale suburban city, and one in a cabin on the edge of Rocky Mountain National Park.

If you base your assessments on such naive assumptions, your risk management planning ts likely to be badly flawed. Do you not realize that bad guys are mobile, and that they like to hunt were the game fields are rich?
 
If you base your assessments on such naive assumptions, your risk management planning ts likely to be badly flawed. Do you not realize that bad guys are mobile, and that they like to hunt were the game fields are rich?

I realize "bad guys are mobile". But one area can be worse than the next. Besides I was saying it more jokingly, like having to stop 3 home intruders sounds like a rough area. I didn't think you'd get all upset.
 
Scads and scads of "no-shoot" defensive displays go unreported. I'b bet money that, for a significant number of them, the reason is that the defenders fear prosecution and/or persecution. More than a few may even have been carrying their firearm(s) unlawfully (a lot of people in high-crime neighborhoods of cities with strong gun-control laws do this.)

In my book, any incident in which a crime is stopped because the actor(s) becomes afraid of being shot becomes a DGU. This would even include cases in which someone who has made their presence known to an actor who does not cease and desist then announces he or she is armed (even if not) and the actor then flees.

The MSM likes to include as DGUs only incidents in which a criminal actor is killed (this is where their narrative about "a gun in the home being 43 times more likely to be used on a household occupant than to kill an intruder" comes from.) I guess the MSM and the gun-control lobby is more bloodthirsty than are we, since they seem to believe the only "good" DGU is a fatal one.
 
No. Two occurred in a great neighborhood in an upscale suburban city, and one in a cabin on the edge of Rocky Mountain National Park.

If you base your assessments on such naive assumptions, your risk management planning ts likely to be badly flawed. Do you not realize that bad guys are mobile, and that they like to hunt were the game fields are rich?


Pretty harsh for somebody with the title of moderator
 
I realize "bad guys are mobile". But one area can be worse than the next. Besides I was saying it more jokingly, like having to stop 3 home intruders sounds like a rough area. I didn't think you'd get all upset.
Not upset at all.

When it come to street and parking lot crime and muggings in the front yard, "bad" neighborhoods are worse. When it come to people breaking in to houses to enrich themselves. "good" neighborhoods are likely worse.

Three? The first occurred fifty years ago next month.
 
Not upset at all.

When it come to street and parking lot crime and muggings in the front yard, "bad" neighborhoods are worse.
Ok. Coming from the guy who told me bad guys are mobile and none of that matters.
[/QUOTE] When it come to people breaking in to houses to enrich themselves. "good" neighborhoods are likely worse.[/QUOTE]
Really? Give stats then. Beverley Hills has more break ins than Compton? First off, everyone breaking in to a home is trying to "enrich themselves".

An expensive home/neighborhood often has more security. Hence less break ins.

You calling my "assumption naive" is ironic.
 
An expensive home/neighborhood often has more security. Hence less break ins.
But there is more to take, and people who have ATM cards who can taken for rides.

In our fair city, the windows in the "bad" neighborhood are often barred. Not so in the suburbs.

A rash of burglaries in a county farther out earlier this year led the sheriff to hold meetings emphasizing that the assumed presence of valuables was attracting criminals. People I know who live in the area have been awakened often by police cars and helicopters with lights,
In the rougher neighborhood, there is little wealth to attract people to break into houses, but auto theft is rampant.

People have been taking the light rail system in from Illinois, stealing cars in the city, and driving them out to where the pickings are good.

On the news often these days.
 
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I have stropped dangerous home intruders by producing a pistol without firing it three times. I never reported any of them.

For the one where calling the police was possible and possibly useful, I elected to leave out one little detail....
Guns are good, but a good Blackmouth cur is better when it comes to home defense. They are there 24-7 and have the attitude of a pitbull without the bad rap.
I do agree on the unreported incidents. I have 1 of my own involving a tweaker trying to open my gate because he wanted to fight someone.
 
I understand there is "more to take" in a wealthy neighborhood. That doesn't make it a target. On paper, I can see that. But the real reality of rich folks with their gated communities, (even not gated) their cashmere sweaters and little lap dogs don't get broken in as much as modular home Joe. Why? Its easier for a crook to steal a TV out of modular Joe's home than it is to risk getting busted on million dollar Mel's security system.

If I'm wrong, post the stats.
 
But the real reality of rich folks with their gated communities, (even not gated) their cashmere sweaters and little lap dogs don't get broken in as much as modular home Joe. Why? Its easier for a crook to steal a TV out of modular Joe's home than it is to risk getting busted on million dollar Mel's security system.
I won't argue with that, but our upscale suburbs are not gated, and while some people do have systems, most do not. And I would not refer to any of us as "rich folks".

If I'm wrong, post the stats
Only a small number of the neighborhoods in our metropolitan area use the centralized reporting system. The ones in the city do, and the most common crimes reported are muggings, assaults, auto theft, street robbery, and the like.

I can tell you what the police tell us, and what we hear on the news.

The "move to a better neighborhood" myth has been discussed here often in the last several years.

If your local police advise that your risk of a bak-in is higher or lower than that in another neighbotrjood, I would listen to them, but I would not rely on averages.
 
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I believe that there are as many if not more of what I call "ambiguous" incidents. Mine occurred this way.

I was working as the assistant manager of a family owned furniture store in Houston Tx many years ago. One day two men came through the front door. One came in to the office (There were glass windows on the front of the office and the office door ) and asked for a drink of water from our water cooler that could be seen from the street. A not unusual occurrence during the hot Houston summers. Instead of gulping down the water like all the others did before leaving he just sipped the water looking around in a very suspicious manner. His buddy just stayed outside watching us. My alarm bells went off in my head and I got my satchel with my gun in it and sat down behind my desk on our left and then took out the pistol so that they could not see it. I then stood up with the pistol behind my back and with my left hand called the police. Then the phone on the other desk on our right began to ring so I crabbed my way over to it and answered it. To this day I do not remember any of that conversation. As I stood there with my pistol behind my back the lady who worked with us got frightened as well and left the store. My boss tried to talk the men into leaving when the one on the outside looked at me then whispered something in the ear of his companion. They both left. After an indeterminate amount of time a police officer showed up. The lady had come back in and we both did our best to explain what had happened. The officer then immediately went outside. The next think I remember I looked out the front door and saw the police car parked in front with the two men in back. As I looked the police car drove away. We never made any complaint and the officer never came back to ask us any questions. The officer must have found some good reason to arrest them. He took them away and we never heard of them again. Hallelujah!

The reason I did not threatened them with my pistol is because the two men never did anything overtly illegal or threatening so I would not have been justified to do so. So why did they leave? I believe that the one on the outside of the office saw me standing behind that desk with my hand behind my back and put two and two together.

I am at least 80 to 90 percent certain that had I not had that pistol these two delitos ( they were Hispanic ) would have tried to commit some sort of crime against us.

I have heard of others being in "ambiguous" incidents like this as well. Here is one recently posted in a blog; https://booksbikesboomsticks.blogspot.com/2018/07/i-dont-know-what-it-was.html She may have been the target of thieves before they realized she was armed.

There are probably lots of similar "ambiguous" incidents like these that will never become part of any official stats. So who knows how many crimes are not even attempted because of "ambiguous" incidents like these. Guns are a lot more useful for civilian use to deter crime that any official stats will ever indicate.

You don't have to actually "use" a gun for it to be "useful" in protecting innocent people from criminals!
 
Some studies indicate that as many as 9 out of 10 successful self-defense gun uses do not even involve firing the gun. It stands to reason that many of these incidents are not reported and that even when they are, short of there being video of the event, they do not get a lot of coverage.

As far as what neighborhoods are targeted for crime, I recall reading a study awhile back that suggested those who break into houses tend to go one "level" up from where they live. They tend not to target neighborhoods similar to theirs, nor do they go all the way up to the richest neighborhoods. Instead, they target neighborhoods that they perceive are somewhat better than theirs, but not a LOT better.
 
Here’s a wayback one. When I was 16 I was young and dumb. I spent a small fortune on car audio accessories (to which I still have tinnitus). One night I was legitimately cleaning a shotgun from the afternoons hunt when I heard a noise outside. I reloaded that old pump and figured one way I was armed, the other way the gun was back in the vehicle. So I ease out the back door and see a guy from school peeking into the vehicle. I called out his full name and he about lost his mind. He did lose control of his urinary tract when he spun around and saw me standing there in the driveway with a shotgun in my hands (not even remotely aimed at him). He found an excuse as to why he was snooping, I think it was to see what radio I had put in because he “heard it was a nice one”. I was one of a very few in the school that never got their cars broken into. I got questioned pretty seriously on that point, and he got caught a few days later with stolen equipment, stolen tools, a stolen ATV, and drugs.

Same car, same shotgun... I was still young and dumb... I ran my mouth at school to a guy who was younger than me. I had just turned 18 and he was 16 I think. He and a few of his buddies caught me out one night alone while I was waiting for a few other guys to go do something dumb. They parked inches in front and behind me blocking me in, and piled out into a circle around me. Young guy gets in my face with brass knuckles on. He was very clearly shown the shotgun. His brother asked what I would do for the other 10 people and he had a metal bat. I asked him how bad he wanted to find out. About that time the cops pulled up and all the weapons on all sides went back into vehicles quickly. I was detained for a few minutes and the cops told me they saw it but couldn’t do anything until a weapon was produced. They said they saw the bat before they saw my gun so I was not arrested. They just called my dad to make sure he was ok with me being armed...his response “he is 18 and it’s legal. F off or read rights. Otherwise my boy is headed home and I expect there won’t be any more trouble.” That wouldn’t happen that way now. I’m suprised it did then. That town is a cesspool of drug and gang activity.

I really was an idiot as a teenager. If I had it all to do over I probably would still be an idiot, but I would have taken some opportunities that I now realize that I missed...
 
Myth? Ok. But I will always believe one neighborhood can be worse than the next
Certainly. For the standpoint of street robbery, mugging, auto theft, and many such violent crimes, there are places in which you should know that do not want to spend your time.

When it comes to the likelihood of home invasion, there are some cases that may attract criminals more than others. They aren't necessarily the same places.

Or moving for safety is a myth.
It isn't--if by "safety" we mean how dangerous it is once we leave the house or before we are in it.

My examples, which evoked the suggestion to move, occurred in places where not one would think twice about going out to get the newspaper, back in the days where when we had newspapers.

Most of the hime invasions in our metropolitan area in the last several years have been in similar areas.

Many of them are thought o have resulted from information regarding contents passed on by persons who had been in the house on legitimate business.

Most, but not all, have occurred in areas that are easy to access and depart from on Interstate highways. Homes in other areas may contain movable, tangible property of similar value, but there's a lot more risk if the perps have t get away on stop and go traffic.

Then there's this one:

https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/violence-myth-safe-havens/

Never go by averages. My three experiences occurred at night--they often happen during the day time. And in my examples, all occurred when there were cars at home. That happens rarely.
 
Guns are good, but a good Blackmouth cur is better when it comes to home defense. They are there 24-7 and have the attitude of a pitbull without the bad rap.
I do agree on the unreported incidents. I have 1 of my own involving a tweaker trying to open my gate because he wanted to fight someone.

I have a peacock, I don't care for mauling machines that have their own brain. I'll take care of whatever is there, and that damn bird can wake you up when he feels the need
I do have to replace him or her when the coyotes get em.
 
Only read remarks by the OP.

Everybody says "Don't pull a gun unless you are going to use it." I'm sometimes doubtful of their sincerity, but realize that when they know that We are fairly new as "CCW" people (and they feel like Non-LEO experts in all situations), they seriously underestimate us. We're not always as dumb as we look.
They seem too assume that we can only calculate One solution to a perceived threat, vs. but the ability to see two or three solutions. Things can immed. change within a half second.

If pulling a gun makes the (possibly) unarmed --but still potentially dangerous-- threat Stop, at a distance, then it might be best Not to put the finger inside the trigger guard.
 
Only read remarks by the OP.

Everybody says "Don't pull a gun unless you are going to use it." I'm sometimes doubtful of their sincerity, but realize that when they know that We are fairly new as "CCW" people (and they feel like Non-LEO experts in all situations), they seriously underestimate us. We're not always as dumb as we look.
They seem too assume that we can only calculate One solution to a perceived threat, vs. but the ability to see two or three solutions. Things can immed. change within a half second.

If pulling a gun makes the (possibly) unarmed --but still potentially dangerous-- threat Stop, at a distance, then it might be best Not to put the finger inside the trigger guard.


I always heard it as "don't pull a gun unless you are willing to use it"
 
True. I would not carry a handgun if I were afraid to use it.
My point was that being willing to use it (the threat now Sees the gun) can frequently Also result in situations where things change, whereby the threat has stopped, or backed off.

I've met a few people who were in this situation.
 
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