Uberti 1860 Army ( Civilian )

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RWMC

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image.jpeg image.jpeg image.jpeg image.jpeg image.jpeg image.jpeg Well, I got bit by the black powder revolver bug again today while at the local gun show.

The collector had an 1860 Army Civilian .44 made by Uberti in 1979 ( AE). This particular piece has the full length cylinder flutes and a brass backstrap. The grip is not cut for the shoulder stock, nor are there the shoulder stock screws in the sides of the frame.

There is no importer name on the revolver, only that of "A. Uberti & C. Gardone V.T. Italy" on the top of the barrel, and "A. Uberti & C. Italy on the left side of the frame.

There was no box with the revolver. I believe the revolver may have been fired at one time, but it was properly cleaned and taken care of.

Since the price was right, ( $230 ) I brought it home from the gun show and I am looking forward to seeing how it shoots.
 
Yes, the civie 1860 has no cuts or screws for shoulder stock. You have a nice gun there. I have a civie version, but it has the plain engraved cylinder, and another fluted cylinder version, but it is the army type with the cuts and screws.
I don't know if Uberti makes your version anymore; atleast I've never seen one in any literature from major U. S. distributors. You may have got yourself quite the bargain there!!!!
 
Yes, the civie 1860 has no cuts or screws for shoulder stock. You have a nice gun there. I have a civie version, but it has the plain engraved cylinder, and another fluted cylinder version, but it is the army type with the cuts and screws.
I don't know if Uberti makes your version anymore; atleast I've never seen one in any literature from major U. S. distributors. You may have got yourself quite the bargain there!!!!
Thank you Tommygunn,
As I was looking at it at the gun show, I kept on asking myself "what about this doesn't seem right?" Then the "hamster started turning the wheel again," and I realized it was a civilian model. I myself have never really liked the looks of the fluted cylinders nor the non- military grip and frame, but when I realized it was 40 years old and in such nice shape, I paid the price and brought it home. I was debating over buying this or the little Smith & Wesson 380 EZ pistol Which was a couple of tables down from where the 1860 was for sale. I have always been a fan of the 1860 Army grip.
 
All of the Uberti full fluted versions I have seen were military ones. This is the only civilian one I know of!!!
Great find.
Maybe 40 years ago (when this one here was made), it was a more common model. This one also features the two-step chamber design going from .36 to .44 caliber. It would be nice to locate some type of Uberti production records that showed when they stopped making certain models and finishes there on.
 
Very nice revolver. Buffalo Arms still carries Civilian Models of the 1860 Army and 1861 Navy but I'm not sure if the Civilian Army is available with fluted cylinder.
 
Cimarron still has civilian 1860's. It took 5 or 6 months for them to get me one though. You could get a fluted Army and swap cylinders. Maybe that's what the previous owner of yours did.
 
Mine, which is pretending to be a Colt, also has a shoulder down in each of the chambers-----could it be to reinforce beneath the locking bolt recesses?

414169476.jpg

-----krinko
 
Nice score RWMC, and at a good price too. I have an Uberti Army full fluted as well. Mine was born in 1970 and is the military version with stock provisions. I like the look of the civilian better. It's cleaner looking. Great find.
 
I am at a loss as to the "two-step" chamber design unless you are speaking of the so-called "cavalry cylinder" .

Jim
The original 1860 army's
Probably means rebated ('banded') cylinder.
The model 1851 Colt Navy was used in the developing process of the 1860 Colt Army.

The idea was to fit the .44 caliber into a .36 caliber, 1851 Navy-size revolver.

In order to accomplish this, a "step" was milled into the front section of the extended portion of the revolver frame. Also, the front half of the Navy cylinder was increased in diameter. Doing so would then allow the chamber size to be increased, so that it could accept the larger .44 caliber ball. The front half of the enlarged portion of the cylinder was bored out to .451 while the rear portion of the cylinder was still bored .375. This is why you will see a "step" inside the chamber of some reproduction 1860 Army revolvers, being made like the originals.

This was probably considered a safer design; having the duel-diameter chambers, so that the rear portion of the cylinder could still retain the same amount of metal like the 36 caliber Navy revolvers, and not have the entire chamber to be bored out in .451 diameter.

Metallurgy knowledge has advanced greatly since Civil War times, and the steels are stronger now than then.
Some of the manufactures of current reproduction 1860 Army revolvers have omitted this duel-diameter chamber, ( my guess is to eliminate a machining step, thus saving time and money ) and have bored the .44 caliber cylinders for the entire length of the chamber cut in .451 diameter.
 
That's a big step. My recent production Uberti 1860 Army with regular engraved cylinder does not have any step as far as I can tell. If there is it's almost imperceptible.
 
Here's my 3rd Gen. Signature Series cavalry commemorative.
Very nice . In a magazine article I was recently reading ( The Gun Report, Feb. 1959 ), The 1860 Colt Army revolvers with fluted cylinders were designated the cavalry model. I have never heard of them been called that before, but maybe some of you have.

Thanks to all for all of your input and feedback on this posting regarding my recent purchase of this Uberti 1860 Army / civilian model. I have always enjoyed the information and the sharing of knowledge that the good folks here on THE HIGHROAD offer.
 
The front half of the enlarged portion of the cylinder was bored out to .451 while the rear portion of the cylinder was still bored .375. This is why you will see a "step" inside the chamber of some reproduction 1860 Army revolvers, being made like the originals.

This was probably considered a safer design; having the dual-diameter chambers, so that the rear portion of the cylinder could still retain the same amount of metal like the 36 caliber Navy revolvers, and not have the entire chamber to be bored out in .451 diameter.

Pate's book (pp. 132-135) discusses the "cavalry cylinder' in which the chambers are not "stepped" but are tapered at the rear.

Jim

1860-Army-003.jpg
 
I recently acquired an Armi San Marco 1860 Army [BC] (1993) with 4-screw frame cut for shoulder stock and a round roll-marked cylinder. This thread made me look this morning at the chambers. They are not "stepped" but are conical at the rear, similar to the Pate photo.

I really like the look of the full-fluted cylinder (I am almost drooling at the pics posted by you and others) and would like to obtain one to fit this gun, but finding an ASM full-fluted cylinder is probably impossible. My next best bet is to adapt an Uberti or Pietta cylinder to the gun. I have all of the dimensions of both, need to borrow a dial indicator caliper to measure mine, and then scare up the money for it.

According to Pate there may have been a few early guns made with the 4-screw frame and the full-fluted cylinder, so it may have been historical. With Colt, parts were parts.

RWMC, thanks for the thread!

Jim

Pietta:

Cylinder-inch.jpg

ASM-1860-Army-003.jpg
 
Thank you Jim!

Thank you for a reminder, in a round-about sort of way. I have always meant to order a copy of Pates' book on the 1860 Army for myself.

After seeing your pic of the drawings, it makes me wonder if some of the earliest 1860's had cylinders with "stepped" chambers, which probably took a two-cut operation to make; and so to speed-up production, the machinist at Colt switched and begin to use a " tapered " style cutter, which only required one step to complete each chamber. All this is simply just my speculation, and there is a good chance I am probably wrong!

I too, own an Armi San Marco. Mine is the 1860 Army Richards Type I conversion in caliber .44 Colt. It was assembled and sold through Cimmaron back in 1998.

Once I find the grandkids' Pla-Doh, I will do an unofficial poor-man chamber cast of my Uberti 1860! ( they would be hollering at grandma if they knew I was using it for that purpose! )
 
Thank you for a reminder, in a round-about sort of way. I have always meant to order a copy of Pates' book on the 1860 Army for myself.

Pate's book is the best that I have seen on the 1860 Army, and a good deal at around $60 per copy.

I collect Pietta 1851 Navy .36 "type" pistols and have 8 in various Union and Confederate guns.

My favorite is a "fantasy" 1851 Navy 2nd Model Dragoon .36. Pietta never made one and it is assembled from parts:

Pietta-1851-Navy-Dragoon.jpg

But, that is not what we are discussing here.

The ASM is my first foray into replica 1860 Armies.

After seeing your pic of the drawings, it makes me wonder if some of the earliest 1860's had cylinders with "stepped" chambers, which probably took a two-cut operation to make; and so to speed-up production, the machinist at Colt switched and begin to use a " tapered " style cutter, which only required one step to complete each chamber. All this is simply just my speculation, and there is a good chance I am probably wrong!

I think your speculation may be spot on. If you get Pate's book, it details many of the changes and possibilities that Colt went through when designing the 1860 from the 1851 Navy base. Astounding!

I too, own an Armi San Marco. Mine is the 1860 Army Richards Type I conversion in caliber .44 Colt. It was assembled and sold through Cimmaron back in 1998.

That, sir, would be worth a few pictures and a thread of its own!

Once I find the grandkids' Pla-Doh, I will do an unofficial poor-man chamber cast of my Uberti 1860! (they would be hollering at grandma if they knew I was using it for that purpose! )

Aw, you would easily be able to snitch a big fingerful without them knowing, unless they are Pla-Doh control freaks!

I am curious to see what you come up with.

Thanks for the replies, sir!

Jim
 
image.jpeg I congratulate you Jim on a very nice looking .36 Dragoon- style Navy! I for one, would buy one if someone made them like that.

Well, here is the unofficial, non-Scientific poor-man, Pla-Doh chamber cast, which does show a distinct step and the chamber. There is a taper in the front larger half as it makes its way down to the step. Oh well, it is what it is!
 
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