What Happened to the Small Frame 22 Revolvers?

Ratshooter said:

And 20 years down the road when that "expensive" gun is still doing its job you won't remember what it cost.

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Heck on just 20 years... I have seen people whine and gripe when a 120+ year old gun doesn't work right.. There are not many things that people expect to keep working after a century.

I bought a NIB model 19 with TT,TH and TG in 1982 for around $250 from a police supply house. Actually my uncle the cop got it for me. At the time the real price would have been closer to $300. I looked on GB and that same gun except in stainless with 4" barrel runs $659 now. Per the inflation calculator that same gun would be $663.00 now. So S&W guns have not increased in price over the years if you allow for the drop in money value. Some people just want to live in the days of 10 cent cokes, 5 cent candy bars and .35 cent gallons of gas.

Over the years have picked up a bunch of those German 22 revolvers,,,,mostly less than $100, decent shooter,,, look pretty cheesy, but they are pointers and work just fine,

Ratshooter said:

Good point. Some people think they can buy a Cadillac on a Kia budget and get first class performance from a 3rd class gun. Yes some guns cost a lot but buy quality and you only have to buy once. And 20 years down the road when that "expensive" gun is still doing its job you won't remember what it cost.

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That has been my approach after a bad experience with a H&R 999. The H&R was supposed to be their top of the line DA 22 revolver. I really liked the top break function but the sights worked loose after only a few rounds, the timing was way way off.... after shooting it for a couple years and getting a Colt Diamondback in 22, I just couldn't stomach that revolver any more. I gave it to my Dad. He wanted a "snake gun" which he would shoot little but carry fishing or hiking up in the mountains. Never bought a 3rd tier handgun after that point in time and won't consider things like Charter Arms, Rossi and so forth for a DA 22 revolver.

22-rimfire I have owned 3 of the 999 and my bud has one and its one of his favorite guns to shoot. We have never had an issue with them. But then again even at the top of the H&R line it was still an inexpensive gun compared to a Colt or S&W. And now there isn't much in the way of parts or service for them. Thats why a better quality (more expensive) gun is almost never a mistake.

WheelGunMan said:

You can get a softer spring kit for the .22 caliber SP101 (2011 and later) from THIS guy

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After factoring in the price of the spring, what makes the .22 SP101 worth $300 more than the Charter?

22-rimfire said:

That has been my approach after a bad experience with a H&R 999. The H&R was supposed to be their top of the line DA 22 revolver. I really liked the top break function but the sights worked loose after only a few rounds, the timing was way way off.... after shooting it for a couple years and getting a Colt Diamondback in 22, I just couldn't stomach that revolver any more. I gave it to my Dad. He wanted a "snake gun" which he would shoot little but carry fishing or hiking up in the mountains. Never bought a 3rd tier handgun after that point in time and won't consider things like Charter Arms, Rossi and so forth for a DA 22 revolver.

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I think you need to buy a Charter before you pass judgement on them, but having said that the modern, non Bridgeport/Stratford .22 Charter's I've seen look cheaply made, but I'm sure the performance is good.

The H&R I fully agree with you on, while some may have good luck with theirs, the first one I ever bought was out of time and with no H&R factory anymore, they're just not worth any price that's north of $100. The 999 Sportsman is probably the most overrated H&R revolver spoken of on forums. I would never pay the money others apparently are willing to pay for them. I was a big fan of the .32 Long H&R's, but after my experience with one, I can't stomach any of them and I'm resisting the temptation for a .38 S&W 925 when I see them go for under $200.

Firstly, I think you need to look at more than Bud's when you look for a gun.

As for .22 revolvers in general, specifically .22 DA's, I just don't think people are getting what they pay for with most of them, not modern made ones at least. The Charter's by all I've heard and read are really good for the money, and if they had 8 shot models, then I would say that is the best .22 DA revolver to buy for the money because I don't see how any S&W or Ruger that costs $250+ more is worth that extra money. .22 is not a stressful cartridge for a gun to shoot, I mean the ring of fire companies have made .22's for decades with pot metal and they're still floating around after all this time. I'm a stickler on the 8 shot cylinder becuase, well, if the cylinder can hold 8 rds it should, otherwise there's no point in buying a rimfire revolver with the heavy, poopy trigger when you could get a .32 centerfire with a better trigger that shoots a bullet twice as heavy.

This is why I get ticked off when people ask about the .22 Mag LCR. It's not as good as the .327 loaded with .32 Long ammo, don't buy it.

There are cheaper, used .22 DA revolvers out there... as I said in my last post, not worth it. H&R may not be junk, but they're not trustworthy. Rossi... IDK. They're probably better than H&R, but unless you score one cheap, I wouldn't bother, not unless you fancy trying your gunsmithing skills. Looking at the ones on GB right now, I would say given how tiny they are, they may be worth trying.

IDK, I'm gonna have to look into Rossi .22's and see what the consensus is.

When we talk single actions, that's where things change and leaving Freedom Arms out of the conversation, Heritage and Ruger are battling it out now and that means good things for the consumer. I have a Heritage .22 9 shot, it's good, I like it. Ruger is the standard of the single action .22, you can't go wrong if you have the money to burn, but do get an adjustable sight model as I find fixed sight SA revolvers never shoot to POA.

North American Arms is also an option, but after a recent range trip the results on paper were poor, yet when I shoot at steel from 50 yards, I can get hits a majority of the time with my Minimaster. NAA is as small as you can get too.

So, when it comes to .22 revolvers, it depends on what you're looking for. For years I've had the belief that .32 is the best, smallest caliber in a revolver and with the 7 shot .32 Charter Arms Professional now available, I have a VERY hard time paying for any DA .22 revolver, while for single action .22's, Heritage's are so cheap, you can't go wrong buying one with adjustable sights.

TTv2 said:

After factoring in the price of the spring, what makes the .22 SP101 worth $300 more than the Charter?

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I don't know...I have never owned a Charter. I was informing poster where he could get a softer spring for the SP101.

Here's another J-frame sized .22 revolver,,,
They made it in 2" snubbie, 4", and 6" versions.

Rossi R98 Plinker.


Shown side-by side with my S&W Model 63.


It has an 8-round cylinder and has gone "bang" every time I've pulled the trigger,,,
Unfortunately, they have discontinued this model as well,,,
Which is a shame as I would also like a 6" model.

It has an aluminum alloy frame so it's very lightweight,,,
The fiber optic front sight is very visible.

Used might be the only option for these,,,
Although your LGS might still find some at the major distributor warehouse.

Aarond

.

cry when you buy and laugh when it lasts, goes with just about any thing you may buy 90 percent of the time. case in point, I bought a browning BT-100 used over 10 years ago( I didn,t know the round count then). but I have fired over 47,000 rounds thru it so far with out any repairs or FTF-FTE,s and have only cleaned it after fireing it. and can sell it today for more than I paid for it over 10 years ago.

eastbank said:

cry when you buy and laugh when it lasts, goes with just about any thing you may buy 90 percent of the time. case in point, I bought a browning BT-100 used over 10 years ago( I didn,t know the round count then). but I have fired over 47,000 rounds thru it so far with out any repairs or FTF-FTE,s and have only cleaned it after firing it. and can sell it today for more than I paid for it over 10 years ago.

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Thats the whole reason I don't mind spending good money for a good gun. You get what you pay for is certainly true when it comes to guns. I am glad that dads, granpaw's and great granpaw's felt that way when they spent hard earned money on all the old Colts, S&W's, Remingtons and Winchesters that come up for sale these days still in perfect working order.

TTv2 said:

After factoring in the price of the spring, what makes the .22 SP101 worth $300 more than the Charter?

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Quality.

Old Stumpy said:

Quality.

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Someone hasn't bought an SP101 lately.

Cool little gun! Amazing story too. Hey, just curious- did you give back the same $ that he gave you?

TTv2 said:

Someone hasn't bought an SP101 lately.

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You honestly believe that a cheap foreign-made revolver is superior to a quality American-made revolver?

I think that in my 40 odd years of shooting that I have owned enough Rossi, Taurus, Astra, Star and other foreign guns to last the rest of my life.
They were always lacking in fit, finish, and function. Amusing, but not worth the trouble of making them work properly. I sold them all.
These days I prefer superior American quality to a cheap foreign quantity.
Life is too short for less than the best.
You get what you pay for.

Old Stumpy said:

You honestly believe that a cheap foreign-made revolver is superior to a quality American-made revolver?

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Charter revolvers are not made in America? Stumpy, if you know something we don't, you're the Edward R. Murrow of the gun journalist world!

I bought a Charter Arms Pathfinder .22 from Kentucky Gun Company two years ago. It has functioned fine for me.

TTv2 said:

Charter revolvers are not made in America? Stumpy, if you know something we don't, you're the Edward R. Murrow of the gun journalist world!

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Where did I mention Charter Arms in my post #69 about foreign-made revolvers? I only spoke about Rossi, Taurus, Astra, Star and other FOREIGN guns.

Where did I mention a Charter Arms revolver in my post #68 in reference to your criticism of an SP101?
You seem to be confused.

However, while we are about it, I did make reference to SUPERIOR American quality in my post #69.
While U.S. made, Charters don't make that list IMHO.
Life is too short.
You get what you pay for.

In case everyone missed it Old Stumpy has all of his retirement investments in Ruger stocks.

Just jerking your chain OS. But you seem to despise anything that doesn't have a Ruger rollmark.

ontarget said:

In case everyone missed it Old Stumpy has all of his retirement investments in Ruger stocks.

Just jerking your chain OS. But you seem to despise anything that doesn't have a Ruger rollmark.

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Frankly I resent the accusation. I don't accuse other members of having a financial interest in Charter Arms or Taurus or Heritage Arms just because they have launched a staunch defense of these brands. I don't claim that they own stock in these companies or that they have a business that sells these guns. While you claim that you are just jerking my chain, I don't buy it.

I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them.

Old Stumpy said:

Where did I mention Charter Arms in my post #69 about foreign-made revolvers? I only spoke about Rossi, Taurus, Astra, Star and other FOREIGN guns.

Where did I mention a Charter Arms revolver in my post #68 in reference to your criticism of an SP101?
You seem to be confused.

However, while we are about it, I did make reference to SUPERIOR American quality in my post #69.
While U.S. made, Charters don't make that list IMHO.
Life is too short.
You get what you pay for.

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Post 63 you said "Quality" in response to me asking

After factoring in the price of the spring, what makes the .22 SP101 worth $300 more than the Charter?

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To which I said that you haven't bought a brand new, current production SP101 lately, then you went on a rant about "American made revolvers."

All I hear from those who have owned or shot both the Charter .22 vs the .22 SP101 is the Charter was worth the price it sells for and the Ruger is not.

Stumpy, it's clear you're a gun elitist who only cares what the sticker price is on your guns vs their real world use and longevity. Flat springs in a Heritage are a quality death hazard to you, yet I've never heard of any Heritage owners having their mainsprings break. I don't want to go down that rabbit hole with you again tho, so I leave that there.

Good day, sir.