Why are gun forums so vitriolic?

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...my money would be on the person with experience.

as an example, on this forum and others, 10 years ago, i posted a lot and gave a lot of advice on ARs because i shot every day, attended several classes a year, competed in 3gun and high power, and built several ARs per year. (I also was active in improving gun laws in my state) in the past few years, i mostly keep my mouth shut unless i'm asking a question because my experience is dated and i there's no reason for anyone to value my opinion on, for example, why one mfg is better than another. i think the crux of the problem described in the OP is that most people think their opinion is worth a lot more than it really is, and they should listen more and post less.

My experience with AR style guns is limited to my M-16 while in the Army. Oddly, it was made by GM's Turbo-Hydromatic Division. That explained the selector switch saying Park Neutral and Drive instead of Safe Semi and Auto. But I digress.
I'd never voice an opinion on which AR components were superior to whose. All I'd be doing is parroting someone else's opinion. Who is probably parroting som..... Well, you get the idea.
 
I really need to learn to split these posts...

Copy the bracket/QUOTEclosebracket. Paste it twice after each comment you wish to split off. Remove the slash from the second pasting. Hit enter in between the two and type your comment there. The second pasting, the one without the slash, will restart the quote of the person to whom you are replying.

To the second, I don’t discredit experience at all, but I think experience has it’s limitations. Just because someone has expertise in some areas (shooting sports, reloading, whatever) doesn’t make them an expert on all things gun.

All knowledge and experience have their limitations as a human doesn't have infinite time to experience and learn all. But reading several responses can give a clearer picture. And, as I said before, what is someone with zero direct experience basing their opinion on but the writing or speaking of other people? One can be knowledgeable about something or about some areas of something but not others and have the self realization to know where their expertise lies and where it doesn't.

Even if it did, using an appeal to authority is a poor tactic when debating a topic. People should argue the facts, not their opinions and expertise or the opinions and expertise of others.

Not quite sure where the appealing to authority comes in or where it applies, but how can one argue facts, they either are or aren't, one really can only argue opinion. An M-1 Garand is 43.6 inches long. That's a fact. One can argue that is too long for a combat rifle in today's world, that is an opinion.
 
Copy the bracket/QUOTEclosebracket. Paste it twice after each comment you wish to split off. Remove the slash from the second pasting. Hit enter in between the two and type your comment there. The second pasting, the one without the slash, will restart the quote of the person to whom you are replying.

Thank you!!


All knowledge and experience have their limitations as a human doesn't have infinite time to experience and learn all. But reading several responses can give a clearer picture. And, as I said before, what is someone with zero direct experience basing their opinion on but the writing or speaking of other people? One can be knowledgeable about something or about some areas of something but not others and have the self realization to know where their expertise lies and where it doesn't.

As I was referring to it, someone doesn’t need to be knowledgeable about how to use guns or have any experience with them to have an educated, fact based opinion as it related to politics and policy. Contrarily, having a lot of experience with shooting guns doesn’t make someone an expert on those topics.

Of course people can know their limits, but a lot of people also don’t know what they don’t know as well. The old “just enough knowledge to be dangerous” situation.

Not quite sure where the appealing to authority comes in or where it applies, but how can one argue facts, they either are or aren't, one really can only argue opinion. An M-1 Garand is 43.6 inches long. That's a fact. One can argue that is too long for a combat rifle in today's world, that is an opinion.
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If they’re arguing facts it’s not an appeal to authority. I’m sure this isn’t news, but not everyone on this site (or in general) argues facts, which is frustrating at times. Hell many people have trouble discerning fact from opinion.
 
you should probably practice in the "testing...testing..." forum at the bottom of the main page.

in short, quotes are surrounded by tags. the tags are in brackets [ and ]. you open with the word QUOTE and you close with the same word with a / in front of it.
 
These here things are open forums with rules. My take on the trolls is different. These people are stooges no doubt about it. However, these stooges are to stir up the base. For example, in this forum, there was a piece on the NRA. No doubt, a hot button topic. A case could be made that this would energize the base with everybody talking about the 2020 election. His point was how rotten it was to tear the NRA down with all the good works. He and other did not see the disconnect between dealing with problem people and tearing down the NRA. How many of the NRA nobility are shooters? Who got stirred up by these posts.

Also, there is a term called projection. That is, where a person acts out his "stuff" on another person or group . If I get on a rant about somebody being stupid what's going on. Is it their stupid or mine that is the real issue. That projection shows up in rants and sense of humor etc. If you are a good listener you can figure what drives these characters inside. Promise.
 
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Why are gun forums so vitriolic?

Could it be the personality of the average gun owner is a tad more vitriolic than non-gun owners? Could it be the testosterone that attracts us to guns, that also makes us confrontational? Could it be the persona that makes us so adamant about our guns, also gives us strong opinions and convictions? Where's Joyce Brothers when you need her, eh?

Being an old fart, I grew up in a time when shooting guns and hunting was considered a "manly" thing. Criticizing someone's choice of guns or how they hunted was like questioning their "manliness". Seems like this is what I see here on these types of forums. Folks want to take any difference of opinion and/or constructive criticism as a personal insult to their character.
 
Could it be the personality of the average gun owner is a tad more vitriolic than non-gun owners?
Don't think so, I want to be left alone minding my own business. I do not think this is unique.
My favorite about making blanket statements is a local doc. We were together in meeting not related to firearms. He asked me to go shooting with him at the local club. Sure enough here I went with a Yellow Dog Democrat. Figured he had his Grand Dad's Owlhead. Not hardly, he produced thousands of dollars of top end handguns and commenced to shoot competently. These were his handloads.

His main interest was a single payer for medical services. Not a single issue voter. This is America where you can have your own opinion-right or wrong.
 
Could it be the personality of the average gun owner is a tad more vitriolic than non-gun owners? Could it be the testosterone that attracts us to guns, that also makes us confrontational? Could it be the persona that makes us so adamant about our guns, also gives us strong opinions and convictions? Where's Joyce Brothers when you need her, eh?

Being an old fart, I grew up in a time when shooting guns and hunting was considered a "manly" thing. Criticizing someone's choice of guns or how they hunted was like questioning their "manliness". Seems like this is what I see here on these types of forums. Folks want to take any difference of opinion and/or constructive criticism as a personal insult to their character.
I guess Jack O'Connor and Elmer Keith showed us how to do it through the years. Being vitriolic, that is. :)
 
I'm picking up on what your laying down.
I've noticed that Ford, AR15 and Glock owners are much more vitriolic than other folks.
Think it has something to do with their obvious poor taste.:p
Thanks for teaching me a new word today, even though I have no idea how to pronounce it. :rofl:
 
I remember Jeff Cooper's method of discussion.

MY calibre is right.
My choice of gun is right.
My targets are right.
My drills are right.
My antiquated use of the language is right.
And if you disagree with ME about anything, you're not only ignorant, but stupid as well.

Unfortunately, he still had followers today.
 
Don't think so, I want to be left alone minding my own business.

Yet, here you are, on Social Media, stating your business for the whole world to hear......and according to your post count, you do it daily. Just sayin'........;)

The line you quoted was said "tongue in cheek". As is the above statement. One thing that is very difficult if not impossible to distinguish on Social Media Forums. One reason they get argumentative. Another reason Gun Forums get so vitriolic is because so much of what is discussed there is controversial to begin with. Then you add a myriad of ethics and backgrounds and you get disagreement.

Besides.......no one on Gun Forums is average. One only has to read a few posts to realize that folks that are regulars on them are above average at everything. Their shooting abilities, their hunting techniques, Their choices of guns and ammo always the best. They also generally claim to know more about guns and what the public really wants than R&D and marketing experts of major gun manufacturers, and CEOs of major big box stores.......and the good Lord forbid, they are much more informed than those infamous "dumb guy behind the counter" at WalMart!

Again......just sayin'.
 
Yet, here you are, on Social Media, stating your business for the whole world to hear......and according to your post count, you do it daily. Just sayin'........;)

I love it. Thanks for the info. I know this is a nice place. I had no idea this place has the readership of Facebook:). Left alone means not fiddled with and allowed to go about our perfectly legal business. We are more or less anonymous here. That is the double edged sword that often leads up to the vitriol.
Would I say this thing to the person face to face. If not, don't send.

On the knowledge thing. Buck460, how long does it take for you to recognize the short term fly by's can be seriously FOS? Anybody can be wrong.
Having lost my cool once or twice :cuss:discovered a basic truth. That, after my rant, that person is just as wrong or as stupid as before I have made a fool of myself.

Sarcasm, an anger symptom, is a poor way to communicate. The meaning, to others, is uncertain. Frequently, sarcastic people are seriously passive aggressive. Honestly, I rather keep this a personal secret. Otherwise, I will not be alone long. Thanks sincerely for your comments.
 
I have stayed away from this.....as well it is me.

Personally their forum they can run it like they see fit....here however (I) think they shut stuff down too quick....to (ME) some of the things killed seem to be giving out good info, and having good debate......there are people out there that can have a good "argument" and not get personal.......a statement can be said to be stupid, or dumb......that has to be the most stupid thing I have ever read is not an insult to the poster but to his statement.

Time is short....too short to pussyfoot around......but I do enjoy this forum, there is good info here.....all I can do is try not to cross the line....all anyone can do.

Their forum their rules, free speech does not exist in places like this.....it is a private forum so their rules....I am good with that.
 
Like the OP, most of thr gun forums I've been apart of are full of jerks (mods included). They're also full of snobs as well. I believe many gun forum types tend to be on the far right extremist part of the spectrum when it comes to politics and firearms. On many of these forums, the mods even take part in the "fun", will say and will even allow other members to do and say what they want, but will ban, give warnings, or otherwise silence or get rid of members who defend themselves or who don't share similar beliefs..
 
Like the OP, most of thr gun forums I've been apart of are full of jerks (mods included).
THR seems to me to be populated by a higher percentage of people with liberal/leftist views than any other gun forum that I've frequented. This includes the members and the moderators. I wouldn't say it's a high percentage of the members, but higher than other gun forums.
 
On another forum there is one guru who is outspoken. His post frequently uses name dropping to validate his BS. His post tend to be self-promoting with little factual information. When somebody calls his hand he reaches out to his pet moderators who come to his rescue. This dance goes on and on. On several forums I visit moderators have ruled out some words and certain topics to avoid a series of rants. Right wing true believers sound like true believers. These people have the right to post as I do. They may be poster children for the gun control forces.
 
THR seems to me to be populated by a higher percentage of people with liberal/leftist views than any other gun forum that I've frequented. This includes the members and the moderators. I wouldn't say it's a high percentage of the members, but higher than other gun forums.
I doubt that. From my experience, many on the far right believe that anyone who isn't just as extreme as them are "leftist" and "liberal." For one example, I've been referred to leftist/liberal recently on another forum for believing that 20 year old who played dress up and carried an AR into Walmart got what he deserved.

I'd say that many here are more realist, mature, older, old school Conservatives/Libertarians than they are anywhere close to being liberal.
 
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I'm picking up on what your laying down.
I've noticed that Ford, AR15 and Glock owners are much more vitriolic than other folks.
Think it has something to do with their obvious poor taste.:p
I don't own any of those three. I am content with my choices of vehicle.

Thanks for teaching me a new word today, even though I have no idea how to pronounce it. :rofl:

Vit tree ah lick. Means overly sensitive self doubter. :neener:
 
I doubt that. From my experience, many on the far right believe that anyone who isn't just as extreme as them are "leftist" and "liberal." For one example, I've been referred to leftist/liberal recently on another forum for believing that 20 year old who played dress up and carried an AR into Walmart got what he deserved.

I'd say that many here are more realist, mature, older, old school Conservatives/Libertarians than they are anywhere close to being liberal.

we have a few actual liberals here (not me). i'm not aware of any "leftists". it's certainly possible to have a liberal worldview and still be pro-gun.
we have tried to eschew some topics and attitudes that would alienate potential pro-gun voters. over the years, this has become somewhat more difficult.

while i may not agree with most of their choices, anyone who votes pro-gun should certainly feel welcome in the gun community. God knows there are too many half-value knuckleheads in the gun culture that can't be bothered to vote
 
THR seems to me to be populated by a higher percentage of people with liberal/leftist views than any other gun forum that I've frequented.

I doubt that. From my experience, many on the far right believe that anyone who isn't just as extreme as them are "leftist" and "liberal." For one example, I've been referred to leftist/liberal recently on another forum for believing that 20 year old who played dress up and carried an AR into Walmart got what he deserved.
I'd say that many here are more realist, mature, older, old school Conservatives/Libertarians than they are anywhere close to being liberal.

I am not a fan of labels, because I believe most thinking people transcend a one word description, which is, of course, what a label is. That said, I'm more comfortable with the Libertarian label than any other, although that depends on who is describing and what their definition of any given word is. Words morph with usage. I believe in Liberty, but not to the ultimate point of anarchy. Living in a society with others means there are certain concessions, compromises, and deals that have to be worked out so that there isn't chaos. I have liberal friends who are appalled that I own guns. Especially the s part at the end of the word gun. Implies plurality. Actually, yeah, means, not implies, plurality. I know. You're shocked.

Left alone means not fiddled with and allowed to go about our perfectly legal business. Would I say this thing to the person face to face. If not, don't send.

Spot on. I try to maintain civility and humor in my posts. I treat others with respect, hoping to get the same in return. If not, I have found in my years of dealing with people, it's easier to walk away, to let someone else's words and rudeness stand for itself. The whole thing about arguing with an idiot and bystanders not knowing to whom the term applies. I engage in debate and discussion, but I'm different than most in that I can discuss and debate without getting, to use an old term, my dander up. If a good discussion starts deteriorating into inciviility

We are more or less anonymous here. That is the double edged sword that often leads up to the vitriol.
(I) discovered a basic truth. That, after my rant, that person is just as wrong or as stupid as before I have made a fool of myself.

People feel empowered by anonymity. They are behind the armor of obscurity. They feel able to post things and say things that, as you said you won't post or say to someone's face. Just not worth the extra blood pressure points.
 
we have a few actual liberals here (not me). i'm not aware of any "leftists". it's certainly possible to have a liberal worldview and still be pro-gun.
we have tried to eschew some topics and attitudes that would alienate potential pro-gun voters. over the years, this has become somewhat more difficult.

while i may not agree with most of their choices, anyone who votes pro-gun should certainly feel welcome in the gun community. God knows there are too many half-value knuckleheads in the gun culture that can't be bothered to vote
That maybe. Probably because IMHO this forum is accepting of anyone who supports gun ownership regaurdless of political views... Just about all other gun forums including the NRA are not IMHO... I'm am curious though, with none firearm related political discussions being forbidden, how did you come to the conclusion about who's a liberal and who's not?
 
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