Cold weather practice

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HPCadm17

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I've only shot my rifles in warm weather outdoors, and during the Winter months I focus solely on pistols indoors. My son and I are talking about hitting the outdoor range this coming weekend, when it's supposed to be in the high 20's/low 30's. His reasoning is that police and military are called upon to perform in all kinds of weather, and as long as the range is open, we should go. I tend to agree with him.

Besides bundling up, any tips for cold weather outdoor shooting practice? Any guns or ammo that should not be subjected to freezing temperatures? We plan on bringing the G21, M17, Mini-14 and possibly the 686+, if that matters.

Sure wish the Spring teaser weather we had last week was still here!
 
(I'm going to move this into General, as Rally Point is mostly for people looking to meet up with other shooters)

I'm not in the mil or popo but if shooting is practical for you and not just a fair weather hobby, then you for sure need to shoot in all kinds of weather. i used to shoot in the snow any chance I got because it doesn't snow much here. i even drove to shoot in a hurricane once.

For Rifles:
Shooting in inclement weather definitely makes a big difference with rifles. There are a lot of things you will figure out really quick. For example, you probably never noticed but you're breathing all over your rifle all the time. Exhale once on your scope and the lens will be covered with moisture from your lungs which will freeze instantly when it hits the ocular lens, and you're done for the day, or at least until you can bring the temp of the gun up above freezing and then clean the lens.

little things like your hot spent brass ejecting into the snow. melts everything it touches for a few seconds and then all that water freezes and keeps it from going back in it's proper hole in the ammo box. if you can find it under the snow...

the cold affects your ballistics a couple ways. cold powder has less energy, and cold air is more dense. at distance, you will hit significantly lower than in hot weather. most ballistic calculators compensate for it, but pay attention if you're shooting past 400 yards or so.

figuring out how to wear gloves and keep your trigger pull consistent can be a challenge. most people wind up modifying their glove.
and gloves are important because cold metal will suck the warmth out of you fast.

most of cold weather shooting is just managing your gear when everything is more awkward. like you can't set your range finder or binos down, or
ammo box, etc.

if you get REALLY cold, you may need to change your lube.

my recommendation is to keep the gear at ambient temp as well. You may be tempted to bring the rifles in to keep them warm and then take them out in the cold when you go out to shoot. that's usually a mistake. the scopes will fog, and if you set the rifle down in the snow, it will melt and then refreeze and could lock your action up with ice. leave them outside overnight and you won't have a problem with the scopes fogging, unless you breathe on them...

if you shoot prone in the snow
-shooting a muzzle brake will create a mini blizzard
-you'll need more bipod than you usually use
-try to keep snow out of your magazines

For Pistols, it was never really much different for me, other than my fav cold weather clothes interferes with my fav holster, but maybe someone else has different experience
oh, and practice mag changes with retention lol
 
I like fair weather practice because it is more comfortable for concentration of shooting rather than (say) shivering. However, I do hunt a lot in very cold weather (sometimes with snow) and I have never noted an equipment or personal hiccup - when a target presents itself, things tend to run very smoothly. I think that the weather has little effect on shooting talent and good/ maintained equipment. But I must say that any visit to a range is a good thing.
 
Depending upon the particulars of your environment ON THAT DAY.... you need to know to attend to the issue of temperature-variable condensation.

Often times, you may have seen on a TV show, reality TV or a movie where they leave their firearms outside upon returning home or to a cabin. This is to stay ahead of condensation flash-forming on the gun when brought into a warm environment from a considerably colder one.

Note that the warmer environment does not necessarily have to be significantly more humid than the cold for this to happen.

Your next concern with this is VERY IMPORTANT. In these scenarios, *soft cases* are your greatest enemy as they will wick the moisture from the metal and then hold it directly against the metal for some of the worst rust you will ever see. All the while, you're thinking the firearms are protected.

This goes for warm cars&trucks as well.

So, back & forth is bad. Ignored soft cases is bad.

Slow warming and immediate attention and letting the interior of soft cases fully dry before re-using is good.

Todd.
 
I like fair weather practice because it is more comfortable for concentration of shooting rather than (say) shivering. However, I do hunt a lot in very cold weather (sometimes with snow) and I have never noted an equipment or personal hiccup - when a target presents itself, things tend to run very smoothly. I think that the weather has little effect on shooting talent and good/ maintained equipment. But I must say that any visit to a range is a good thing.

Seriously, it depends on your distance. Average big game distance 50-300 yards, I agree. Stretch the distance then as taliv pointed out a combination of less MV due to temp and denser air increases your drop. For instance, my favorite .270 Nosler 130 grain AB load using H4813 (a relatively temp stable powder) at 65 degrees zero'd at 200 is:

6.5" down at 300
11.5' down at 350
18.1" down at 400
26.5" down at 450
36.8' down at 500

at 25 degrees"

6.8" down at 300
12.2' down at 350
19.1" down at 400
28.0" down at 450
38.8" down at 500

at 10 degrees:

7.2" down at 300
12.8" down at 350
20.0" down at 400
29.2" down at 450
40.4" down at 500

So effectively from 65 degrees to 10 degrees (a temp swing that can happen in KS), I've lost about 4" at 500 or about 1/2 of my deer's kill zone. Add in changes in pressure and humidity and the deltas get larger. All of which is why I run multiple chronograph sessions to sort out my loads temp variance, and verify my zero as close to the ambient conditions as I'll get.
 
IMHO finding gloves compatible with trigger operation and firearm manipulation that are still effective at temperature is one of *the* biggest challenges for cold weather shooting. You can get general cold weather clothing advice from all sorts of sources including in-store sales staff at specialty stores. Polypro base layer, PolarFleece mid-layers and Thinsulate outer later (w/GoreTex) are my choices.

When handloading for rifles I try to pick propellants that are temperature insensitive so that I don't need a "summer" and "winter" loading. Hodgdon's Extreme series is an example of such.
 
Yup - gloves, at LEAST anti-contact because having your buddies free your stuck hand by peeing on it is just handing them a lifetime of rewarding anecdotes at your expense.;) Pun intended!

One doesn't want to be *thtuck* to one's gun like Flick to a flagpole.:D

G'head.... I triple-dog-dare ya!


Todd.
 
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I usually open up a hand warmer on the way to the range. If it's real cold, below 10 or so, I have a hard time keeping my fingers warm when reloading magazines or setting up targets or doing anything that I need dexterity with bare hands. It's a nice treat to have a toasty glove to put numb fingers into!
 
Being in one of the few cold weather Army units, this is something we practiced religiously. Never saw a unit SOP that included a primary and alternate means of starting a fire to be in the uniform at all times until I came to the mountain community. Being a contributing source to FM 3-97.61 revision was one of my favorite military perks.

I have trained in temperatures where plastic can become brittle and wood outright splits in half. Between 0 and 32 degrees F, you won't run into many practical differences in shooting. A big, overlooked area is lubrication. Pick a lube that will work for your firearms in cold weather. I have seen CLP freeze in a bottle to where it couldn't even be sprayed on a firearm. I happen to like Militec-1 synthetic. Apply a light coat at room temperature and shoot some rounds and relube. When cold, periodically put a lighter coat on and heavier if you are shooting. This is one of those lubes that use sparingly is better than soaking a firearm in CLP or similar.

Clothing. There does not exist a glove that can keep your hands warm at -40 but still have the dexterity to let you pull a trigger in a small trigger guard. So go to the classic and foolproof method: light layers. A light fleece or synthetic fiber base glove will retain most of the dexterity in your trigger finger. Then add bulky, warm layers on top of that. Add enough layer to keep your hands warm, but not enough it takes you 5 minutes to get the excess layers off enough to shoot. For the rest of your body you need 3 basic components to keep your core warm. A base, wicking layer, insulating layers, and a shell. The wicking layer wicks sweat away from the skin to the insulation layer(s). Insulation layers circulate warm air to evaporate sweat away from your body and retain heat. Shell layer keeps you dry, that is it. The rule of thumb is to be "comfortably cool" if you plan on moving around a lot, like doing drills at the range. If you are being still in the prone for a while, layer up.
 
I considered the condensation aspect and really don't know what to do other than try not to go instantly from warm house to cold vehicle trunk, or vice-versa. Not sure how best to "acclimate" my equipment, though. I was more curious about how the ammunition would react to the temperature changes.

I have dry fired my pistols in several different gloves to see if it was physically possible, but dry firing in a warm house is not the same as shooting outdoors in the cold with a recoiling weapon while shivering. That should prove interesting, not to mention reloading magazines.

We'll probably not spend all day out there, either. It's likely the young lad will wimp out before too long, LOL.
 
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Beware of very light triggers.

I recently took my Super Blackhawk out for some chronograph work. I've made a lot of changes to this gun and part of the last round of improvements was to eliminate the trigger creep.

Well, my fingers got cold enough testing another load in another gun that by the time I got around to the SBH, I couldn't feel the trigger. And whilst attempting to locate it by touch as I usually do, the gun went off. Fortunately I did not shoot my chrono and did get a velocity reading. But after that, I was very careful.

I'm not sure I consider it a safe winter hiking gun any more. But the trigger is really nice.
 
While focusing on the shoot in this discussion do not forget ice cleats if there has been ANY rain/snow recently. Can't shoot from the range bench or check targets if you cannot walk straight:p to them!

Strange, water freezes on the firing line. Right under the shooting tables:scrutiny:
 
Hi...
I have done a lot of cold weather hunting and shooting in my life.
I still hunt in the cold weather but target shooting when it is nasty cold and windy are no longer on my list of activities.
I pretty much draw the line at sub freezing, high winds and rain/snow for range trips.
The weather today in South Central Pennsylvania is 22°F and 1-3" of snow. My son just loaded up his Suburban for a trip to the gun club.
This old guy(65) is going to stay home and tend to the Labrador Retrievers. There will be other days to shoot this winter that won't require me to be outside in the wind, snow and cold.
 
I like fair weather practice because it is more comfortable for concentration of shooting rather than (say) shivering. However, I do hunt a lot in very cold weather (sometimes with snow) and I have never noted an equipment or personal hiccup - when a target presents itself, things tend to run very smoothly. I think that the weather has little effect on shooting talent and good/ maintained equipment. But I must say that any visit to a range is a good thing.
I agree that cold doesn't really effect skills unless you're cold.
If your shivering, your dressed wrong. When I'm up North, I dress for sitting still and start opening zippers as soon as I'm moving.
I have good circulation in my hands, so I like those cheap knit ski gloves. You can keep extras in your pocket in case you get them wet.
 
My son just told me he's in a "pew pew" mood and wants to hit the range Sunday instead of Monday. It's supposed to be partly sunny and about 38-40 degrees tomorrow, which shouldn't have too much of a detrimental effect. Should be fun. He uses army surplus dual-layer gloves when playing airsoft, sometimes only uses the knit inner gloves. Not sure how well that will translate to shooting real firearms, but I don't think it will be cold enough tomorrow to need them while shooting.

I keep desiccant packs in my range bag and the firearms ride in breathable pouches. I wipe them down with a dry soft cloth before packing for the range and after I'm finished shooting, and I plan on cleaning them as soon as I return home to help alleviate any effects of condensation. Hopefully at 40 degrees it shouldn't be too much of an issue.
 
I, go to the range to enjoy the time there. 30's no wind. on up to say 80 maybe. Do not care to get cooked in the sun either. I, much prefer cooler weather.
 
I remember late 60s (early 70s?) the solid fuel stick hand warmers. I think it was, John-E brand. If the reader hasn't ever seen one, they resemble shape & size of a very large zippo lighter. How did we EVER shoot any deer putting off all those fumes LoL...

FF to modern, hand warmer & toe warmers are your friend:) . A disabled Vet buddy of mine is considering a electric vest or coat, whereas it's plugged in to charge, and radiates heat via wires throughout the article. Battery operated gloves, moved up in technology I guess...

The hand warmers are a Godsend IMHO. Oh another cold weather trick...mittens with finger slots MUCH warmer IMO...
 
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I considered the condensation aspect and really don't know what to do other than try not to go instantly from warm house to cold vehicle trunk, or vice-versa. Not sure how best to "acclimate" my equipment, though. I was more curious about how the ammunition would react to the temperature changes.
If you bring your cases along, or at least leave one outside at the house, so its at the ambient outside temps, just put the gun in and close it before you go in. Let the case sit and come to room temps, and you wont have any condensation problems.

Temperature doesnt really affect the ammo all that much, but there are usually some changes in velocity. Heat up, cold down. Shoot all year round and keep track. Thats about the only way youre going to know.

While focusing on the shoot in this discussion do not forget ice cleats if there has been ANY rain/snow recently. Can't shoot from the range bench or check targets if you cannot walk straight:p to them!

Strange, water freezes on the firing line. Right under the shooting tables:scrutiny:
Our club only plows the road in, and doesnt do anything else. Even then, sometimes its a bit hairy even getting in.

Ive shot in 12"-18" of snow in snowshoes more than a few times, with both rifle and handgun. Fun stuff actually, and good experience.


I think the biggest thing is being properly dressed to be outdoors, and staying comfortable. Ive worked (and played) outdoors year round most of my life, and I just dress like Im going to work. Dress in light layers with a 1/4 or full zip hooded fleece under a hooded windproof on top. On the colder days, I wear a pair of Carhart bibs too. Proper boots for the temps, and mittens for your hands.

I like mittens because they are warm. Warmer than anything else. They are a bit of a PITA until you get used to them, but youll also get used to having warm hands pretty quick too.

Another advantage is, you can drop one of the heat pacs in each one, and youre really toasty for the day. Almost to toasty sometimes, but its great if your going to have your hands out a lot.

I just shake the mitts off when I need my hands, and always have full feel and dexterity that way too. If my hands get cold, I just pop them back in for a little while.

And, like anything else, your attitude and mood can have a lot to do with things, and go a long way in making things go better. If you convince yourself youre cold, its going to be a long, miserable day. :thumbup:
 
I've had a lever action rifle fall to fire during a sub zero deer hunt, not enough hammer force to set off the cartridge. Luckily, the buck stood there and looked at me, silly boy, while I thumbed the hammer back again, second time there was venison on the ground.

I blamed it on lubricant on the firing pin and channel gumming up due to low temperature. You might want to spray the pin and area around it with a brake cleaner to de-grease it.
 
Glad you had fun!

The only thing about cold weather that usually keeps me inside is lots of snow, as I hate losing brass and shoveling a path to the target. It's kept me off the range this month so far, sadly. Well, that and I'm required to be home shoveling and snowblowing instead of farting around on the range.

But yes, decent gloves are useful, hand warmers in the pockets is how I usually go over gloves, only using them while loading mags.

Pre loading lots of mags helps.

I learned on the tundra in AK that leaving loaded mags out in the -15 wind-chill can have negative effects on reliability, not sure why but jamming them back in my parka after loading and keeping the ammo box covered seemed to work much better.
 
I hate losing brass and shoveling a path to the target

I was reminded of this last winter.......
Just shootin' revolvers now in the Winter....... :) unless I don't give a beaver's blockade about losing brass.

BTW, I live where it can get cold!!!
Those hand and foot/toe warmers are the cat's meow! Luv 'em. Shake and bake! Gotta love the science in the world we now live in!

Use care, B.L.
 
My experience at cold temps (below zero) has been similar to others here. I essentially gave up on lubricant for semi auto guns in winter. I just run them dry.

One thing I've noticed, in regards to gloves is that the fabric often bunches up behind the trigger, preventing it from traveling all the way rearward. This prevents the gun from firing. I have to reset the trigger and pull again. I've experienced this in revolvers and semis-mostly handguns.

Practicing in inclement weather, especially cold weather, is really good training. If you do enough of it, you'll discover that a lot of stuff that works in summer, doesn't work in winter. Anything requiring any level of dexterity is going to be a real challenge. (Reloading a revolver, for example, become a serious challenge.) Just today, my glove fabric got in between my magazine and the grip. The gun loaded the first round from an open bolt just fine, but as soon as pulled my support hand away, the magazine dropped out. Happened a number of times. You may also have difficulty seeing your target or your hole through your breath or through fogged safety glasses.

Just make safety your number one priority. Cold fingers loose their grip and let hammers fall hard. Ammo can hang fire. Wear ice cleats or grippers and move slowly to keep on your feet. Watch your finger and muzzle direction if/when you fall. Protect exposed skin. I keep a thermos of hot chocolate and another of chicken noodle soup in the truck. Hand/toe warmers help. A propane heater makes a nice warm-up station. (Be careful of synthetic clothing, which will melt if too close to the heater element.) It's training. Don't induce an injury. Know your limit.
 
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