Anyone reloading (happily) for a bottleneck pistol cartridge?

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PO2Hammer

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Looking at caliber conversions for my 9mm 1911.

38 Super/SC will be first, But I'm thinking about a bottle neck caliber like .30 Mauser, 22 TCM or similar for a fun caliber.

Then I start reading and it seems to be nothing but headaches. Cases only lasting 1 or 2 firings, shoulders blowing way forward, sizing issues...

Since there's no dirt cheap surplus ammo anymore, this would be a reloading first caliber.
Anyone reloading bottleneck pistol calibers successfully?
 
Successfully, or painlessly?
I reload for a tt33. It's annoying to say the least.
 
I do for a few, my 7mm BR XP-100 is more accurate than lots and lots of rifles and is more likely to be shot well from various people than rifles from what I have seen over the years.

Since before the turn of the century, it has been a “reload only” caliber.
 
Any one reloadingvthe 22TCM?. I have the rifle and will be buying the pistol 22TCM/9mm.

I bought some once fired 22TCM brass and will be buying the dies here shirtly.
 
I've had a 38/45 Clerke M1911 for close to 25 years. Added another, a Gold Cup, a year or so ago. Bar-Sto still makes barrels on special order last I looked.

Once the case is formed, loading them is no problem except you cannot get carbide sizing dies for 38/45 Clerke.

I find starting with new 45 ACP cases yield reasonably normal handgun case life. Starting with fired cases, some cases fail early. Of course, you morn greatly when you have a case vanish to the four winds.

I also have a couple 357 SIG pistols but 357 SIG is not a wildcat cartridge.

I have a 14" Contender barrel chambered in 7mm International Rimmed. With it, I shot Unlimited in IHMSA Silhouette competition back in the day. Forming cases is easy, run a 30-30 case into the 7 Int Rimmed forming die then fire form it. Reloading them is just like any bottleneck rifle case.
 
I don’t have any issues with 357 Sig, other than being careful with powder selection to help avoid bullet setback.
 
.32 WCF and .22 TCM. Have to be careful with the 32 thin brass, but no problems. The only problem I had with the .22 TCM was with cut down .223 brass due to case thickness so I switched to the new brass. No more problems. But with 1,000 cases, I might not ever shoot enough to have any splits. And if I do, I will anneal the necks. I have the handgun, full size with a 9 mm barrel. Should make a nice small game round.
 
Also, I have an S&W K-frame built around 1921 chambered for 32-20 WCF. Also, no biggie reloading the cases with bit of care due to the thin cases.

Again, carbide dies are not readily available for bottleneck cartridges. I tumble the cases after sizing to remove the lubricant and then load them later in a separate step.

It is a good combo with an 1890's vintage Winchester 73.

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Any one reloadingvthe 22TCM?. I have the rifle and will be buying the pistol 22TCM/9mm.

I bought some once fired 22TCM brass and will be buying the dies here shirtly.

.32 WCF and .22 TCM. Have to be careful with the 32 thin brass, but no problems. The only problem I had with the .22 TCM was with cut down .223 brass due to case thickness so I switched to the new brass. No more problems. But with 1,000 cases, I might not ever shoot enough to have any splits. And if I do, I will anneal the necks. I have the handgun, full size with a 9 mm barrel. Should make a nice small game round.

I reload 22TCM quite successfully and enjoy shooting it! I have a 4.25" 9mm/22TCM that I take to the range regularly and I always get comments and questions when I shoot the 22TCM.

Here are my thoughts:

I use Armscor fired brass (mine) and occasionally new brass. Making my own brass from .223 was a bridge too far.

You should plan on getting a headspace gauge so you can accurately measure shoulder set back in order to set your sizing die correctly. Factory ammo has excessive headspace (probably to insure feeding/chambering) so you don't want to set your dies up based on factory ammo. I size my cases to .004" headspace and have encountered no chambering issues with regularly cleaning the chamber (cleaned every 150 rds or so). The factory ammo headspaces at approx. .010" so it would be more forgiving of dirty chambers, but would work the brass too much if reloading.

I did quite a bit of research before jumping in to 22TCM reloading and found some info sourced to Fred Craig (inventor of the cartridge). He recommends lubing the cartridges for firing to get best cycling. I use Hornady One-Shot spray case lube for sizing and simply do not clean it off. Works quite well. There is a difference if you don't leave the lube on the cases!

Craig also recommends flaring the case mouth slightly to aid in bullet seating. I use the Lee 22TCM dies so I got a Lee universal flare die which seems to work well. I don't put much flare on the case after sizing--just enough to allow the bullet to sit on top of the case securely.

One note on the dies... the Lee 22TCM dies work really well, but I did need to polish the decapping/expansion stem because it left the necks too loose for securing the bullets consistently. I simply chucked the stem in a drill press and polished with 1500 grit sandpaper and now the bullets are retained quite well, still seating easily. Beforehand, I would have random bullets falling out of the case (or into the case) when I opened up my ammo storage box. No more.

Craig also recommends W296/H110 which is the powder I use. His recommended load is 10gr with a REGULAR small pistol primer (non-magnum). I have never had a load fail to fire or squib with regular SP primers. Brand does not seem to matter, I have used S&B, CCI, & Winchester. All go bang.

W296 works well, but I found 10gr to be on the low side of what's needed to replicate factory performance. After I got a chronograph I worked up, starting at 9.5gr to 11gr. I found the best performance to be at close to 11gr of W296. You will need to find what works for you in your pistol. I get approximately 1900fps with the Armscor 40gr bullet out of my 4.25" barrel (and it is a hoot to shoot with the fireball and report--and NO appreciable recoil!).

Accurate Powders makes a "TCM" powder for this cartridge that I would like to try, but I'm in no rush-- have plenty of W296.

I got a custom case headspace gauge from: https://www.ctstrimmer.com/case-trimmers/8-cts-trimmer.html
He will make a custom headspace gauge for you if you send 3-4 fired cartridges. His case trimmer for.22TCM is great (and you will need a case trimmer). Cases seem to grow for the first 2-3 firings and then not so much. I just use the trimmer chucked in my drill press every time to make sure. Takes very little time to do.

I have experienced few case neck splits (maybe 2-3 in 1000 cases). One of those was with a brand new factory loaded case.

List of needs:
Lee .22TCM 3 die set (sizing, seating, crimping), includes shell holder
Lee small rifle charging die
Lee universal flaring die
CTS .22TCM case trimmer
CTS .22TCM case headspace gauge
Hornady One-Shot case lube spray
Lyman VLD chamfer hand tool
Lee deburring tool (I put mine in a nut driver socket in a drill)

I use the setup on a Lee classic turret press.

Tumble and apply case lube.
I size first, separate from the loading process.
Then trim, chamfer/deburr as needed (chamfer is the most important)
Loading takes place on the LCT: 1) flare & prime, 2) charge, 3) seat bullet, 4) crimp

Once case prep is done, I can load 22TCM almost at the rate of 9mm--but it's a little slower, because I'm extra careful setting and seating those tiny bullets.

There's a learning process, but it's not bad, and I was loading better-than-factory ammo in what seemed like no time at all.

I would be interested in hearing about the 22TCM rifle's performance and how you like it, @Highland Lofts
 
Thanks all, especially drband for a very complete response.
22 TCM is the one that interests me the most since it's up and coming and is designed specifically for 9mm gov't models.

Looks so far like it's Armscor stuff only?
Maybe we'll see conversion barrels, not just complete slides.
 
I would rather remove my tonsils with a rusty fish hook than reload any bottleneck pistol cartridge.

If you ever reloaded handgun cartridges using steel sizing dies, then bottleneck handgun cartridges are no more difficult to load than straight walled cartridges in steel sizing dies.

At least that is my experience with 38/45 Clerke and 357 SIG.
 
Thanks all, especially drband for a very complete response.
22 TCM is the one that interests me the most since it's up and coming and is designed specifically for 9mm gov't models.

Looks so far like it's Armscor stuff only?
Maybe we'll see conversion barrels, not just complete slides.

Yes, only in Armscor stuff, though Armscor does make a conversion barrel/kit for Glock 17/22 if I remember correctly. You have to use their stubby 22tcm9r bullet (38gr) in order to fit in a 9mm mag.

https://advancedtactical.com/index.php/22tcm9r-conversion-for-glock-17-22.html
 
Looks like the 22 TCM is a no-go for my Kimber 1911.
They offer a 1911 conversion with slide, but it's for Para/Clark ramps only, and it's over $400. Kimber uses Wilson/Nowlin ramps.
I was hoping for a conversion barrel, but it doesn't look like that's going to happen.
Guess I'll just stick with the 9mm and the Super and avoid the rusty fish hooks.
 
I don't have a 1911 conversion barrel, but I have them for a couple of Sigs & a Glock.

My P226 & P229 both have conversion barrels to shoot 357 Sig & the Glock 20 will shoot 9X25. Both rounds are great fun at the range.
 
I reload for 357SIG and .30 Luger, (also .300AAC).

Zero issues with either. The 357S I load using Dillon carbide dies without lube. I simply make sure the brass is polished before resizing. The .30Luger I use RCBS steel dies and just lube the cases, resize, then run through a vibrating cleaner to remove the lube. I then load in a separate stage. For both I make sure my powder/expander die uses minimum belling to start a bullet, then taper crimp both after seating.

Neither are what I'd call a PITA to load for....they're just different.
 
I'm pretty new to it, but after some initial challenges I'm very happily reloading .357 SIG.

The only real difference between it and a straight wall cartridge for me, is this tip I got here on THR:

Spray lube in a ziplock bag and roll the brass around in it. Then resize and deprime. Wipe off excess and set brass in loading block.

Everything else is the same.
 
The only one that I have played with was a 7mm TCU in a Contender pistol. Started out as a pain because the headspace had to be nearly perfect and the primers had to be soft. About half of my first loads went bang. I started shooting 223 to fire form for better headspace. Then just ran the expander in enough to expand the next and just barely touch the shoulder. I had tried new brass the first time. Swapped out the CCI primers for Winchester and it worked fine after that. Even took a couple of deer with it. If I were to do it over I would get a 7-30 Waters that headspaces on the rim.
 
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