First Long-gun?

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grand inquisitor: hmm, someone likes Kalishnikov's...

not my first rifle, but sometime, maybe.

Magnum88cc: thanks for the warning. i'll probably get a rulebook of somesort when i get my hunting liscence. Grampa has a 20 gauge ithaca, and is getting a 20g. double-barrel aswell. with slugs, i *might* be able to get a deer. if not, i'll borrow my friend's 12g. =) or, i'll get my own 12g. i'm looking at a Mossy 500 feild/deer, with a smoothbore and a rifled bore, for shot and slugs, respectively.
i ***might*** get a levergun, but i think i'm going to get an autochucker.

kreighund: what's wrong with the 20/30 rnd mag SKS's? jamming?
i like the 20/30 rnd SKS's, the 10rnd stipperclipped ones i don't like as much, but i think i can accept it. i guess the stripper clip is used in the SKS alike to how the en-bloc clips are used in the Garand?
and, are you from theringlord.com? guess you didn't see when i asked last time.

~TMM
...liking the Garands because of thier historical value, aesthetic value, and usefelness..

PS: i will be moving to New Mexico when i'm older, which will change the game and also the laws...just an fyi.
 
Yep,, from TRL.

The reason not to get 20 rnd mags is that from everyone whos ever said a word about them, its always been a bad word, along the line os "Waste of money" "Falls out" "Doesnt feed" "put the 10 rnder back in"

Not sure how the stripper clip works...
 
The stripper clip is an easy mechanism. Since 7.62x39 is unrimmed, the stripper clip "clips" (imagine that) to the base of the cartridge (i.e., where the primer sits). The strip itself is a metal band that grips 10 rounds in a single-stack (one column). For the SKS, when the clip is empty and the bolt is pulled back, there is an automatic stop. The bolt face has a guide for the stripper clips to allow them alignment into the integral magazine. The whole strip is pushed to just above the upper lip of the magazine well, and then the thumb is used to push the rounds out of the clip (which is held in place) and into the magazine into a double-stack (which is why if you've seen pictures of the stripper clip next to an SKS, the SKS's magazine seems short in comparison, is because it's doubling up the rounds). After the rounds are in the mag, the stripper clip is removed by hand (you reuse the things), the bolt moved, and a round chambered, and you can fire. Think of the en bloc clip of a garand, except the metal piece sticks up when the ammo goes in, and you take the metal piece out (no classic PING!). That's how a stripper clip works, at least for the SKS.
 
+1 on the 10/22.

There are so many accessories for it you'll have a blast.
Keep it simple and it'll be even better.
The idea to keep it bone-stock has much merit, though. :)
Buy a LOT of .22LR and shoot, shoot, shoot!

You can start with this one and find another rifle to move up to later.
NEVER sell your first gun. EVER.

Have FUN!
 
TMM said:
jenfnvk: thanks for the pics. i had the same basic idea in my head of how it went in. in understand you gotta push it in real fast unless you want your thumb mashed by the bolt?(ow..)
Click to expand...

No, there's a proper way of doing it that prevents the dreaded "M1 Thumb." It involves holding the oprod back with the heel of your hand while you push the clip into the receiver.

TMM said:
Eightball: yea, i'd love a Garand, however it would probably kick hard. an army friend of mine (maybe about ~175-200 pounds) said it "kicked something aweful", or something to that effect. i guess i could make reloads if it really is hard for me to take, but i think i can acclimate.
Click to expand...

M1s are not hard kickers. They're fairly heavy and they are gas operated. Both of these factors help reduce felt recoil. The rifle's recoil doesn't bother me at all, and I'm not a big guy.
 
kreighund: ah, i see.
yea, i'm The Mad Mailler, if you didn't figure that out. =)

eightball: hmm, that seems kinda... stupid. as in, slow reloading. i'll probably still get a sks, but the order of my purchases might be changed. i was picturing a spring on the bottom of the mag well, and the stripperclip is pushed in there. the spring pushed the ammo up, and pops it out when it's empty. oh well.

busmaster: yea, i have no intention to sell my first boltie. it's a nice rifle. i might sell the .22 hornet or .222, because they have no sentimental value and i have never even used them.

i'm still thinking "no" for the 10/22, though, even though it's a great rifle. i've got a .22, and i think it's time for something different. 7.62x39 is quite cheap, and milsurp/wolf .30-06 aint that bad either. if/when i get into reloading, it'll probably be even cheaper. only problem with my .22 boltie is that it has no iron/open sights.

matt-man: hold the [oprod?] with which hand, and push the en-bloc clip in with thumb or fingers? i couldn't quite figure out how to do it from your description.
and, good point about the softened recoil from the Garand. never thought about the gas system softening it, even though i know it does do that.

~TMM
 
Stripper clips are actually quite fast after a little practice. They are also a lot cheaper than detachable magazines. Somewhere I saw a pack of 20 SKS stripper clips for $10.00 I think. That's 200 rounds of ammo that can be preloaded and ready to go. Try doing that with detachable mags for $10.00.
 
Stripper clips are actually faste for the SKS than any of the detachable mags. For something like the M16, it is my uinderstanding that the ammo is still shipped on clips, and teh mags are charged off of the clip.

For the M1, it is kinda hard to take pictures in that position, but here is kinda sorta how you do it to not lose your thumbnail. You hold the oprod with the side of your hand, fingers pointed down by the bottom of the gun. You shove the en-bloc down until you hear the click, and the oprod moves just the slightest bit forward. Remove your thumb, remove you whole hand. Most of the time, the oprod will move forward and hit the first round, stopping it. Then, just give it a tap forward, and it will close right up.
 

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hmm, i think i see what you mean, Jef.

bucket: i can see how they can get fast after a bit of practice, but at first it just struck me as a bit "Untactical".

so, after consideration, i'm thinking of getting the M1 Garand first from CMP. there are only so many antiques out there. after that, i'm thinking about getting a 12g. Mossy 500 with both rifled and smoothbore barrels, for deer and birds. then i'd like a Ruger mini-14 with preban 20-rounders (what the hell was Ruger thinking with 5+1 rotary mags...?). nice rifle, good company, looks good too. then i'd look at an SKS. by then, i'll probably be old enough to get the pistols i have my eyes on. =)

what do you guys think about my order of purchases?
 
Sounds good. Just know that there are some special requirements to buy from CMP, but the benefit is that they can send the rifle right to your doorstep. You will need to join an affiliated club (Garand collectors association costs like $20 a year, and you get a nice magazine), show some proof of marksmanship ability (there is a whole list on their site, if nothing else, they have a form you can print and take to a gun range, and have the RO sign off that you can do basic things like load a gun safely), and be able to prove your US citizenship.
 
Sounds like a pretty good shopping list!

The M1 is pretty comfortable to shoot, especially if you use a sling. With a sling supported position, you're left hand will take up about half the recoil.

Back to the M1 thumb for a second; as long as you keep pressing down on the clip, the bolt isn't going to go forward. You have to be pretty lethargic to get bit. Besides, Most M1's need a bump on the oprod to get that first round in.

The big hazard comes when you're cleaning or inspecting the rifle. If you don't pull the oprod far enough back to latch, the bolt will rest against the follower like a bear trap, awaiting your curious but tender digits.

Ty
 
10/22.

The 10/22 is an awesome gun. I built one (Yes built one) from the ground up and I love it. It totally fits me and, and there is kind of a good feeling when you go to the range to sight it in, and you have like 6 guys standing behind you while you get 1/2" groups at 50 yards. When one asks, "MAN! What kind of gun is that?!?!?"

"10/22. I built it."
and seeing the amazed look on their face as it fuctions flawlessly even with this plastic magazines. :p

I know, a stock 10/22 is definitely not going to shoot groups like that, but with time, practice, and money, you will be like, "Wow. why didnt I get a 10/22 earlier?"

Right it is a .22. BUT. A big BUT. It can be converted easily to the new .17 calibers. 17HM2 on a LR reciever and 17HMR on a magnum reciever. Both of which are dynamite rounds, totally surpassing the ol' .22 LR.

Have you visited www.rimfirecentral.com yet? Its a great website with a wealth of knowledge.

Here is my 10/22. I know its "tactical" and its really starting to get old with me, but thats the great thing about 10/22s. You change them to a totally different look



This is what's under the hood:

Whistlepig 18" fluted ALUMINUM .920 barrel very light at 15 oz.
Choate Dragunov stock for .920 barrel
factory 10/22 reciever
weaponkraft bolt buffer
weaponkraft hex-head action screw
Volquartsen Exact edge extractor
Hornet TGA-VC trigger group
-volquartsen straight trigger
-volquartsen magazine release
-2 lb. trigger pull with no creep
Simmons 44 mag 6.5-20x44AO with target turrets
Power Custom weaver base
Weaver 4x4 rings
Harris Benchrest bipod

And yes, im 15 too.
 
I suggest investing in something with which you can compete in rifle shooting.

Through your Grandfather (realize that you are "standing on the shoulders of giants"), you have all the 'plinking' guns you need.

Get an M1 Garand, a competitive .22 (I don't know the match .22 brands) or an AR15.

Do not be intimidated. Get a good rifle, bring your grandfather and a friend or two, tell everyone you are new and join a local match. You will have the time of your life.

There are plenty of folks here on THR who can answer any other questions on competitive shooting.
 
TMM--Just to make you think......you said your budget was preferrably $400 or less? Just thought you might want to be reminded of what you originally said in your post before you get carried away with some of the awesome ideas being put forth. Ready's logic is pretty good with the "all the plinking guns you need" and a suggestion of an M1 or competition .22. If you can up your budget a bit from $400, you can do yourself very well; if not, I might stick a plug back in for an SKS again :D , or a nice 10/22 like texasguy's. Keep in mind, though--you've got a lot of time on your side to decide, but you should remember that within your rifle-budget, you need to allocate some of it for ammo :what: ! Get an awesome rifle with nothing for it to shoot, and you'll be doing one of these numbers: :banghead:
 
Quote:
a competitive .22 (I don't know the match .22 brands)



All the true competition .22's I have seen are all bolt guns, FWIW. I am sure there are some competitive 10/22's out there, though.

yeah heres one.
BlueRFull2.jpg


see what I mean about 10/22's? you cant go wrong with one. And look how much different that is than the factory carbine! :what:
 
That is a totally awesome rifle, Texasguy. If that specimen is yours, you did a fine job with it, and the stock is like "I didn't know they could do that, with those colors :what: !" But, for TMM--look at the beautiful rifle, and realize--with some time, money, and TLC, you could make a 10/22 turn out like that one.
 
My first was a Ruger 10/22 when I was about 13. It was my only rifle until I turned 22, and then I bought a Colt AR-15A2. Now, I have a little bit of everything. :D
 
Jefnvk: hmm, might have to jump through a hoop or two to get a CMP, but i like it getting shipped to my doorstep. and getting a gun magazine dosn't seem too bad either. =)

30cal: how is the sling position used? i assume the sling is over the neck/shoulder to take some of the weight off your left hand, or...?

and... what exactly is the oprod? is it the bolt handle?

texasguy: nice rifle, i'm suprised the barrel's Aluminum! i'd have thought that it'd be too soft and the rifling would get ruined.

i'll probably get a 10/22, but not as my first rifle. a little bit farther down the line.

readyontheright: yea, i realize i am "standing on the shoulders of giants" (needed a bit of googling to find out what that meant, i forgot. :eek: )...

i don't really know what specifically is used for competitive shooting... i have a Ruger MkII pistol, and a scoped boltie .22 (no iron sights). i'd like an ar-15 but they're a bit pricey.

eightball: thanks for the reminder :D i was actually considering a service grade Garand, with runs $500 from CMP. i figure that it would be better quality and shoot more accurately. and, if i run low on $$$ for ammo, i think grampa or dad would be nice enough to get me a box or two. :)

i'm going to get an SKS, but not right away.

thebucket: haha, good one. (i wish...) i'm considering a single-shot, but not anytime soon.


ah, texasguy, the colors, the colors! my eyes!! :neener:

too bright for me. i like wood stocks...

~TMM

i'm thinking that even if i get a Garand but can't afford that much ammo, i can just use the .22 to tide me over. but i think i'll be able to afford ammo.
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ctd/...gid=&mscssid=WP1RNR0FP0P98J2B7415X2SWPTHQ34FB
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ctd/...gid=&mscssid=WP1RNR0FP0P98J2B7415X2SWPTHQ34FB
 
Jefnvk: hmm, might have to jump through a hoop or two to get a CMP, but i like it getting shipped to my doorstep. and getting a gun magazine dosn't seem too bad either. =)
Click to expand...

You need Proof of Citizenship and Proof of Age. This is easy. Photocopy your birth certificate or a passport.

You need Proof of CMP affiliation. This is simple as $25 annual membership in the GCA as someone mentioned.

You need Proof of Firearms activity. The CMP site has a list of various qualifications. I used my C&R license.

30cal: how is the sling position used? i assume the sling is over the neck/shoulder to take some of the weight off your left hand, or...?
Click to expand...

The basic use of the sling can be seen on the following pages:

http://www.fulton-armory.com/slinguse.htm
http://www.rifleslings.com/Garand_Sling.htm

I recommend the web sling for first time use. It's the easiest one to use. A lot of people prefer the web sling over the leather even in competition.

and... what exactly is the oprod? is it the bolt handle?
Click to expand...

The op rod is basically the long rod that is used to operate the bolt. The operating rod has a handle that is used to open the bolt. The rod is vital to the operation because it is the gases from the fired round that force the oprod back to move the bolt back to chamber a new round.
 
texasguy: nice rifle, i'm suprised the barrel's Aluminum! i'd have thought that it'd be too soft and the rifling would get ruined.

Yeah I was suprised too, but the barrel has a steel sleeve inside of the 7075 aluminum tube. I dont know if its really necessary, but it even has a compensator cut in the end.

ah, texasguy, the colors, the colors! my eyes!! too bright for me. i like wood stocks...

This isn't my 10/22 but it's a very sweet one. And it has a wood stock that looks like was finshed with molten glass ;)

 
ocabj: hmm, dosn't seem too tough. if i were to get it before i was 18, what would i do for the proof of firearm activity? maybe it's on CMP's site, i'll go look.

thanks for the sling site... the first ome shows how to use it while lying on the ground. is it the same for standing?

yea, i thougth that's what the oprod was. well, more or less.

texasguy: that's some shiny stock... i wouldn't want to use it for fear of scratching it!

~TMM
 
thanks for the sling site... the first ome shows how to use it while lying on the ground. is it the same for standing?
Click to expand...

Using a sling doesn't buy you a heck of a lot for standing. In competition, you aren't allowed to use it during the offhand (standing) strings. In real world situations, if you're taking a shot offhand, you're probably in too much of a hurry to mess with the sling much anyways.

It comes into play in the prone, sitting and kneeling positions. Instead of supporting the weight of the rifle with the muscles of your left arm, you can relax it and the sling supports the load.

Ty
 
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