Magazine Capacity and Hunting

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Everyone settle down...

I've been told they limit capacity so some stupid person doesn't go out and decide to shoot an entire herd of deer (or flock of migratory birds like the did back in the day).
Simple as that.

Do I agree with it? No, but that's their reason, logical or not.

If they want to limit the number of shotshells or rifle catridges then that's fine.
I always pack a sidearm for those "just in case" situations anyway (whether it be two legged or four legged critters that are after me).
 
Where I live I am limited by what my hunting rifles will hold, just because it was built into them, 30.06 holds 4 rounds, and my 300Win only holds 3 rounds. I do hunt Nutria with my AK clone, but their not a game animal. I think a rifle is whatever you use it for, only a tool, and hopefully multipurpose tool at that.
I do carry extra rounds, but I have never needed them. I have also ran into really weird fellows out in the field so I always take along a hand cannon. ;)
 
I use a 20 rounder with my M1A. This is legal where I hunt (MN and ND). I carry copies of the emails I received from those governments that say there is no restriction on the magazine.

I use a 20 rounder for several reasons.

1) I'm an American and everyone has better things to worry about than how many rounds I have in my hunting rifle when I'm miles from civilization.

2) I sometimes like to hold onto the gun with my hand on the magazine.

3) I don't like to have to load magazines in the field.

4) If I run into a Hmong or other dangerous type who wants to kill me, I will be better off.

So far I've never fired more than 2 rounds in one incident. I don't have a 20 rounder to spray and pray.
 
Missing the point? Isn't the real reason for the limit to prevent a militia running around in the woods armed with high cap assualt rifles under the pretense of hunting?
 
Everyone settle down...

I've been told they limit capacity so some stupid person doesn't go out and decide to shoot an entire herd of deer (or flock of migratory birds like the did back in the day).
Simple as that.
This is of course based on the same flawed reasoning that leads to limiting legal ownership of firearms because of criminal activity. Passing laws against owning guns won't keep guns out of the hands of criminals. And passing laws limiting magazine size won't keep an unethical hunter from violating his bag limit.
 
May a non-hunter make a comment? I was never taught to hunt by my father. A great shame. It’s something I would love to learn and will someday when money and ability (I suck with long guns ATM) allow. That said…

It seems to me extra magazine capacity makes sense for no other reason than the great outdoors is not a danger free zone. In the middle of “no where” is not the place to find out that you’ve just horked off a group of moonshiners, drug growers, coyotes (the smuggling kind), drug runners, illegals, or gun runners and you’ve only got 5 rounds on board and a few more rounds in your coat. Ok... Maybe I’ve seen “Deliverance” one too many time.

I know! I know! It’s far fetched. Really far fetched. But I carry a concealed weapon and the chances I will ever have to use it are thankfully very remote.

I think that having 10 - 20 – 30 rounds on tap and one or two more mags in your coat is not a bad investment when you are on your own or in a small group. But that’s just my opinion. I may feel quite different schlepping them around for a couple of days. I know that in the middle of August I feel very different about my CCW than I do in the middle of January.

In all honesty (and much more seriousness), I don’t see how the round count of your gun makes you any more or less likely to behave badly in the wild than it will in civilization. If you are a moron then you will be a moron with 5+1 just as you will be with 30. It doesn’t matter if you are on a deer hunt or in a mall. Neutering a weapon does not take the “stupid” out of its owner.

I think the round count debate is simply another way one group of people can say that they are, “doing it the right way,” and can feel superior to all those who don’t. There is no justification needed (where legally permitted) for hunting with at single shot, 2 shot, 5 shot, or 30 shot gun other than, “I wanted to.” Anything else is elitism no matter which side is arguing it.

I have hunted pigs with a spear

One Man, remind me NEVER to get into a Klingon P**ker Swinging contest with you! :p
 
ClickClickD'oh said:
Everyone settle down...

I've been told they limit capacity so some stupid person doesn't go out and decide to shoot an entire herd of deer (or flock of migratory birds like the did back in the day).
Simple as that.

This is of course based on the same flawed reasoning that leads to limiting legal ownership of firearms because of criminal activity. Passing laws against owning guns won't keep guns out of the hands of criminals. And passing laws limiting magazine size won't keep an unethical hunter from violating his bag limit.

The 3 round limit with regards to migratory birds stems from the beginning of the twentieth century. Semi auto shotguns like the Browning Auto-5 were just becoming popular, and there was a popular method of hunting called "skybusting" that simply involved pointing the gun at a bunch of birds and shooting as fast as possible, hoping to fill the air with shot and taking out as many birds as possible. This was deemed "unsportsmanlike" and hence the capacity ban.
I have no doubt other similar bans were passed for like reasons.
 
This is of course based on the same flawed reasoning that leads to limiting legal ownership of firearms because of criminal activity. Passing laws against owning guns won't keep guns out of the hands of criminals. And passing laws limiting magazine size won't keep an unethical hunter from violating his bag limit.

Right, hence the:
that's their reason, logical or not
 
(Warning Sarcasm) Sounds like a good law while we are at it might as well write off all 10+ round Mags completely you don't need that many to protect yourself(End Sarcasm).

And that is how hi-caps get banned right there, If I could I would carry a 30 rounder only need one to take game but a lot of insurance is better than a little......They never did confirm mountain lions were here or not, remember all these hunters who got attacked by lions,bears,ect most had bolt actions 1 shot and then the animal is there, is one case an older gentleman was mauled by a Kodiak 1 shot wounded it, he ended up killing it with his knife and crawling for help, he lived but I would rather put 12 or so in the agressing animal and stop it than go toe to toe.

Just because wolf packs have not killed anyone doesnt mean the wont try.
 
+1 Fumbler

I'm thinking the DNR is more concerned with wildlife management than they are with "sportsmanlike" hunting. They limit magazine capacities for the same reason they regulate season dates, shooting hours, and a myriad of other aspects of hunting.

I suppose they limit magazine capacity to 6 because that covers most hunter's rifles. More capacity= more advantage = more wildlife killed. I know the waterfowling 3 round limit has saved a lot of duck's lives just from my own experience.

And passing laws limiting magazine size won't keep an unethical hunter from violating his bag limit.

That's true, but it makes it possible for wardens to bust a poacher who may be planning that before he commits the act.
 
We're required to wear orange during deer season in Missouri. This is not because of the smart, ethical, reasonable, experienced people who hunt. It's because of the others. As much as we like to decry government regulation based on the lowest common denominator, fatal shootings declined immediately after the implementation of the regulation. Sometimes they help. Likewise, we have hunter safety education required for people born after a certain date. There was an individual who previously hunted on the same property I did who had an episode that would serve as an example. He shot a deer and broke the front leg, low. So he gets out of his stand and goes running after the deer with one windmill leg, working the lever action on his gun and firing round after round, bleeding from a semicircle cut above his eye where the scope hit his forehead. It was hilarious except for all the wild shots being fired in an area where there were other hunters and the thought of what happened to the deer. I wish he had a single shot rifle loaded with blanks. I got a better deal than that. He doesn't hunt with us anymore. It only takes a few idiots spraying lead to get everybody restricted.
We had some goose hunting areas where you were only allowed to bring 10 shells to the goose pit. The idea was to reduce crippling from people shooting at geese out of range. Otherwise I'm sure there would be people shooting up a couple of boxes of shells for one or two geese (bagged) and maybe a dozen crippled. It also ruined the hunting for other hunters when the geese would be shot at out of range and scared into the stratosphere.
 
Accepting magazine capacity bans from the .govs for hunting ethics really doesn't bother me much. I've seen too many morons go into spray and pray mode to quibble with limits during game hunting. However, in regards to the .gov telling me that I have to abide by a limited magazine capacity while every damn .gov JBT can carry a beta mag on his weapon, well, I have a problem with that. If they can have a beta mag on their firearm, well, by golly, so can I. The .gov is going to be the end of our firearms if they have their druthers and we all know that. Does that mean they'll give up theirs? Think about that. Historically, what have governments who created AWBs, magazine restricitons, firearms restrictions and registration done to their people. They've murdered them,
 
I have enjoyed this dialogue, and have confronted these questions with the US Military who only lets you hunt with 5 rounds in a rifle on military installations. I tried to explain my M1 Garand held 8 with the clip and 5 would not not work right. The hunt control manager smiled and wished me good luck. I brought back a nice buck plus 7 bullets left. He since retired and now my hunting area is shotgun only, no limit on how many shells in the tube. I do agree that you have to be prepared for life's surprises. My nephew who does hog eradication for the county, took his mini 14 and proceed to cull the herd. He did real good, until hogzilla ran his butt up a small tree and then proceeded to take three hours to die. The sheriff pays a bounty for the carcasses and my nephew got extra for the big hog. My nephew told me " Uncle Jay, sometimes 5 bullets is not enough to get the job done".
 
Interesting.

I'm not a hunter but sometime when I was younger I follow a friend of my father for hunting.

Just for fun, because you have not very strict limit for mag in USA.

In France where I live.
It's 2 shoots for shootgun rifle.
If you have a semi-automatique it's 2 (in mag)+1 (in chamber).
So maximum is 3 shoot for a shoot gun.
Riot gun are forbidden.:cuss:

For a carbine I dont remenber, but I believe it's 10 shoots maximum.

Have a nice day :)
 
Quite frankly, I don't know a single person who doesn't utilize a full size magazine to its fullest. And having the extra ammunition on hand makes one less likely to concentrate on accuracy, as they know that they have a hell of a lot more in the mag should the first shot miss. This contributes to people making unethical shots. Hence the reason many states have banned high caps for use with game hunting.

Then you should get a better class of aquaintances...I often load fewer than the the max, even in 5-round mags, and I never dink around with the 'one in the chamber' routine. That's for SD pistols. If I need more than 1 or 2 rounds, I shouldn't be shooting. My ol' grandpa used to load 2 rounds into his M-71 Winchester, saying the darn rounds were too heavy to fully load the magazine of what was already a fairly heavy rifle, when he'd never even required the second round, let alone the whole magfull...
 
Why limits are and how they stay.

Capacity limits were put in place because of unethical behavior. They remain in place because we're better at quibbling amongst ourselves than policing ourselves.

Just a few years ago, Ohio went to a 3 round limit in slug guns for deer (shotgun or muzzleloader only here in the Buckeye State) because of folks just shooting the place up. Now those same folks do the same, but do it three rounds at a time. The rest of us carry on as before. If we were better at keeping the stupid and dangerous among us in check, the limit would have never happened.
 
I personally know some people who have been surrounded by a pack of coyotes here in Missouri. Both of them had semiauto .30-06 rifles of some sort, and shot several of the coyotes as they moved in closer before the rest ran off. They said the coyotes surrounded them and closed in to within 20 feet or so before they started shooting. I believe they were 5 round mags, and both guys (both incidents were last year, and both in Mark Twain national forest) were quite shaken up as they were out of ammo, and would have had to drop the mag, reload the mag, reinsert the mag, and work the charging handle before they could shoot any more coyotes.

That's why I believe magazine capacity should not be restricted for hunting. Or at least a sidearm with no restrictions.
 
Actually the reasoning behind the 6 round limit for Semi's in Michigan is based on a 5 round mag plus one in the chamber.

The number six was based on what the vast majority of "sporting" semi's would hold, and was felt to limit the capacity without imposing unnecessarily on the hunter.

When High cap mags first started to show up on milsurps, there was a brief spat of Moron hunters carting around 20 and 30 round magazines and just hosing down the woods in a spray and pray manner as soon as brown was seen. I witnessed this with a guy who dumped a full 30 round mag out of a AK at two small does running across a river ford, which was followed by the words, "dammit I missed"

Now I am no Zumbo and I have my own EBR's Which I use for HD and prairie dog hunting, but I find that most of the guys who have Semi's for big game hunting seem to often fire a lot more than guys who have a lever or a bolt. JMHO

Andrewsky, I have a M1A and although it is not my hunting rifle, I would hate to carry it with a 20 rounder stuck in it for hunting. If you're worried about running into bad things in the woods, then stick the 20 rounder in your pocket, as you will really like how much easier it is to carry a M1A around with just the five rounder in the hole.

RE the idea that double rifles were the "traditional" arm for africa. Only until PP Mauser got the bolt action to work right, then the Double died off pretty fast. The 9.3x57 in a 98 mauser pretty much killed the sales of double rifles, except to the rich folk.

Pretty much the same way that the 93 winchester pump pretty much killed off the american double.

My favorite Deer Rifle is a 5 down one up model 99 savage, its light, easy to carry and what ever I aim at dies fast. I can not fathom needing more than that for Deer. If tyranny comes and I need to fight people that fight back, then my collection of 30 round La belle mags will come in handy.
 
If every gun owner was responsible, moral, and humane would it not be concievable that there would indeed be no limits on mag cap, type and style of weapons we hunt with and own?

After all it seem that gun laws and restriction always get passed because some idiot misused the weapon! Oure fellow "irresponsible" hunters and gun owner are the reason we face restrictions. How many closed gates and no tresspassing signs do you come across hunting becuase of illegal dumping and vandalism??

A single shot or a gatling gun are equal.. The operator is the issue.
 
Hunting, Not a Right?

I keep seeing this remark, that "hunting is not a right," because it's not enumerated.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

I understand, now, why the founders were so reluctant to write the Bill Of Rights at all.

Reminds me of raising kids. "Billy, don't walk in the mud puddles." Billy comes in covered with mud. :eek: "Billy . . ." :mad: "But Dad there was no puddle, Bobby and I were playing in the empty lot!" (And the "empty lot" is, of course, one big mud pit.)

You spend the next few minutes trying to formulate a way of saying "don't do stuff that results in your being covered in mud," but then you have to define "covered" and "mud" and . . . you find that your kid is really a lawyer who's not been to law school yet.

So, you write a Bill Of Rights that plainly states a few of the rights that may never be abridged, and the people whose goal is the control of others do exactly what the founders feared: they go, "well, you didn't SAY hunting was a right."

That's right, we didn't. It was too obvious. We never enumerated breathing, eating, drinkng, or procreating either. It never occurred to us that Americans would ever get to the point where their whole take on liberty was what we normally expect from a six-year-old child: "but you didn't SAY I couldn't."​

*Sigh*

Here, let's try this: Where in the constitution is hunting specifically limited?

Nowhere? Then . . . and I could be wrong here . . . that would mean it's one of those ". . . certain rights . . . retained by the people."

Or is it just me?
 
After all it seem that gun laws and restriction always get passed because some idiot misused the weapon!

Typical dumbing down of society. Instead of removing said idiot, they have to regulate everything to account for the lowest common denominator so they don't hurt the idiot's feelings.
 
In Pennsylvania you may not use ANY semi-auto for big game hunting. Most bolt action rifles have a capacity of 5. Just my opinion, and I don't mean to sound harsh, but any good hunter shouldn't need more than 2 shots unless the game is big and dangerous.
 
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