STI Stops Sales to CA: "Enough is enough"

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Kind of Blued

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I haven't seen this noted, but wanted to post it purely for the political aspect of it. The paragraph is a part of the "NEWS IN BRIEF" section (pg. 38) in the March edition of Guns & Ammo.

I typed it out, so forgive any potential typos.

No More California Sales

STI International, manufacturer of competition and law enforcement handguns, has stopped sales in California over a new state law requiring that handguns sold here come with technology to "microstamp" identification numbers onto spent shell casings. "We as a company have decided enough is enough," STI explained in a press release. "[We] feel it is necessary to take a stand against irresponsible legislation designed solely to inhibit the American citizen's right to keep arms."


Obviously STI is going to hurt alot more on this one than the California economy; its nice to see a company take a blow like this for no reason other than to make a point that money is nice, but freedom ain't... well, you know.

What do you guys think? Any other benefits than to keep a clean conscience?
 
I wonder are the cops going to be required to have this technology on their guns ? What about the California Guard?
 
Exactly how?
Because Mr. Law-Abiding will go to the range, have some fun with his micro-stamped pistol, and leave. Then Mr. Law-Breaker will dive into the trash can, retrieve Mr. Law-Abiding's brass, and then dump it at a crime scene. Then Officer Unfriendly will arrest Mr. Law-Abiding since the brass will be traced back to his gun. Mr. Law-Abiding will then have to pay an arm and a leg for legal defense all because he disposed of his brass at the range (or perhaps missed 3 or 4 pieces).

Additionally, depending on who you ask, micro-stamping will increase the cost of a gun by $5-$200 dollars. The higher the price of guns, the fewer people can afford them. Lower-income folks deserve the tools to defend themselves too.
 
Well if that did happen Strat81, woudn't they just use case matching? Fire a round through the suspect's gun and see if the markings/scratches on the cases are the same. They say its like a fingerprint, every gun has its own. But if the suspect throws his gun away. This case stamping could just trace the serial number through state/federal records back to the owner... Sounds like common sense to me.
 
"common sense".

Ahh..where have I heard that one being used before?

"They" are the same people that try to argue ballistic fingerprinting techniques are 100% and infallible, like the TV shows say. I guess they must all be right.
 
They probably wouldn't be able to do case-matching, since the criminal would have gotten rid of the actual murder-weapon. I'm told that one of the reasons that criminals carry such cheap guns is that they know they'll need to get rid of it in the event of their usage.
 
Hi NWdude83,

woudn't they just use case matching? Fire a round through the suspect's gun and see if the markings/scratches on the cases are the same.

"Common sense" and the State of California are on two very different planes of existence and never the twain shall meet. The state would have the casings at the crime scene, enough prima facie evidence for an arrest. Any further testing would be an unnecessary added expense. It would be up to the owner to provide and prove an alternate theory of the crime at his own expense.

Despite what they say on the TV, criminal investigation is about finding a conviction, finding the truth is not a consideration.

Selena
 
California will suffer

California will suffer for this I think.

It won't show quickly, but California is showing that it is unfriendly to business, and attitude says something.

What's the Terminator doing there, anyway?
 
I realize that foreign gun companies would step in to fill in the gap, but if all U.S. gun makers - all guns, not just handguns - declined to sell to CA police and other state agencies, that would send a much stronger message. No Remington 870, no Mossberg 500, AR15, Remington 700 . . .

Exactly how?

Why do courts so strictly prohibit laws that inhibit speech in violation of the 1st Amendment? Because they inhibit speech.
Now change the word 1st to 2nd in the second paragraph. If it's an individual right, ineffectual rules to inhibit gun sales will be like rules requiring that printing presses have systems that prevent printing obscenities. Not really, but hopefully you take my meaning.
 
Ar15s are already illegal in CA

And i beleive, as a part of CA's gun owners, that this will either screw over me and the rest of the legel shooters in CA by the commies making all guns have to have microstamping or it will show that it wont work. People will just pick up the 2-3 casings put down and just as someone said before me they will use legaly fired rounds in place. Blam! easy solution to make people move out of CA so this doesnt ever happen again or just keep costing the state money in Judges and juries to catch the right person
 
Let's not forget that this legislation would essentially forbid the sale of all surplus or historic firearms... and also just used firearms that predate microstamping technology.
 
STI hasn't had a handgun on the california safe gun list for sale since april of 2005 and I really doubt they sell much to law enforcement. They haven't been able to sell handguns in california for almost 3 years so now they make this statement? Sounds like they are trying to drum up sales more than make a statement.

xtra870 "Ar15s are already illegal in CA"

Not quite. I am picking up a double star lower monday and I'm waiting on a rifle kit I ordered to be shipped. Here's pics of a bunch of cali AR's:http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=26726

Mark
 
They probably wouldn't be able to do case-matching, since the criminal would have gotten rid of the actual murder-weapon. I'm told that one of the reasons that criminals carry such cheap guns is that they know they'll need to get rid of it in the event of their usage.

*COUGH*hi-point*COUGH*
 
Well if that did happen Strat81, woudn't they just use case matching?
Who knows, maybe they would. But not after severely "inconveniencing" a law abiding citizen in the process.

Personally, I do not want to sit and wait in jail while they test my gun(s) and the gun(s) of some scum bag to find out who did what.

Your situation also assumes the bad guy keeps his gun. He may dispose of it.

And what about when they go to detain the law-abiding gun owner? Will they descend upon his home or office, guns drawn? Will it be another no-knock warrant with a full SWAT team crashing through doors and windows in the middle of the night since "the suspect is known to be armed and potentially dangerous"?

Sorry. I do not want the police dealing with me or my family in any capacity just because I left a few pieces of brass at the range.

This case stamping could just trace the serial number through state/federal records back to the owner.
To the original purchaser. What if the gun was stolen? Sold to someone out of state? Kaboomed at the range and thrown in the trash?

Sounds like common sense to me.
You're asking for common sense from a state that requires Springfield Armory to pay for CA DOJ "certification" for every COLOR (color!) of XD it sells. Because color affects function.

Ar15s are already illegal in CA
No, they are not illegal. Check http://www.calguns.net/ for more info.
 
Good on 'em. I know Barrett did this a while back, even to the point of refusing to sell to California law enforcement. I think it is going to get worse in Cali before it gets better, but I think if enough companies do this it will eventually get better.
 
Despite what they say on the TV, criminal investigation is about finding a conviction, finding the truth is not a consideration.

Selena


Oh so true....and what occurs in a courtroom is the application of law, justice
is not a consideration. If it occurs it is an accidental and unintended byproduct of the legal process
 
Yeah, another is that they still list a distributor and sales rep in CA on their web site. They did this little stunt more than 3 months ago but have yet to yank the distributor of the web site. Why would they list a distributor in CA if they weren't selling there? Why do they have a sales rep? FYI, it is the same number from before their boycott and they do have a webmaster who updates their website. If STI truly stopped selling and pulled out of CA, they would have neither of those things.

FYI, you can still buy STI goodies from the distributor who lists them on the internet.
 
I just saw the movie Mr. Brooks (not bad if you haven't seen it). The serial killer ziptied a plastic bag to his wrist to catch the shells. Doesn't seem that hard to figure out. Or using a revolver, or picking up your shells. I could ALMOST see this making sense if they tried to mark the bullet, since you really can't bring that with you. Of course that would just require a naivety in the knowledge of firearms ballistics to propose. As opposed to the sheer "non thinking" mentality they had to have for this one.
 
The Lone Haranguer said:
The flip side is that it accomplishes what I think the lawmakers wanted: a reduction and eventual elimination of handgun sales due to the supply drying up.

You are completely correct. This law isn't about solving crimes. It's about gun control.

For those of you outside the state of California, understand the legislative environment here. The anti-gunners can't get an outright ban through, so they push restrictions on what can be sold here and how it can be sold, often in the name of "safety." Most of the new gun legislation in the past 10 years has been like this: the "unsafe handgun" law and its "approved for sale" list, the 1-handgun-a-month law, the "safe handling demonstration" (you have to demonstrate that you know how to not shoot yourself, every single time you buy a handgun), etc, etc. We've also had stupid new requirements for storage, like having to buy a lock with every firearm you buy.

The latest tactic is increased design requirements for handguns to get approval to be sold here. Since the "safe handgun law" passed we've seen more and more things required in order to be listed for sale. New requirements added over the past couple of years include a magazine disconnect, a loaded chamber indicator, and now this microstamping BS. You can see where this is going. Pretty soon you won't be able to get anything onto the list of handguns approved for sale in California.

This tactic is working, and we're having a hell of a time fighting it, because it's all for "safety." Nobody wants to be perceived as against safety regulations for firearms - especially the Governator (see also: .50BMG ban). Joe Blow on the street might be against a gun ban, but I bet he supports the idea of safety regulations. He doesn't understand the details so he doesn't see these restrictions for what they are: gun bans in disguise.
 
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