Need suggestions on a Multi rifle.

krocus, you are one abrasive, hostile little fella! Lighten up! If your 7615 outshot an AR, it was likely because YOU outshot the PERSON shooting the AR. Heck, I have, at High Power matches, outshot expensive autloaders; AR15's, M1A's, etc., with old military surplus rifles. Does that mean the old clunkers are more accurate than the modified autos? Of course not. That's absurd.
You are correct, I am a newie here, but not at shooting. Personally, I don't think a person gains knowledge by sitting in front of a computer screen all day posting messages on this forum. So, I'm about to walk over to my range and test some loads in my new 96 Swede, but feel free to sit here and "gain" knowledge to your little hearts content.

EDIT: Oh yeah, I forgot to mention..I do not, have never and will never own an AR15. I'm a lover of the bolt action with the odd Garand and SKS thrown in just for ****$ and giggles.....

BB

P.S.- Maybe you could challenge the gentleman who posted the pictures above of his bolt action Scout Rifle. Looks like he could give you a run for your money with that little rig and what appears to be a 2X scope, no less. Plus, he won't have to worry about losing a clip/magazine or whether or not rifle his will feed his ammo be it slick jacketed bullets or cast round nose....

with old military surplus rifles. Does that mean the old clunkers are more accurate than the modified autos? Of course not. That's absurd.

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You assume TOO much. Why can't an old surplus rifle in good condition shoot as good if not better than a AR variant. There's nothing even slightly absurd about that. AR's are good rifles but once you get beyond the belief that they are the alpha and omega of rifles you open up all sorts of possibilities. There is NOTHING magic about the AR it's just another gun and all AR aren't created equal.

Personally, I don't think a person gains knowledge by sitting in front of a computer screen all day posting messages on this forum

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That's your own problem if you cannot realize that READING and comprehending messages posted can gain you a wealth of information in one sitting that could have taken years to have found out in the dark ages.

How long do you think it would have taken you to find out in the 1970's what the total production of Swiss K-31's were by year? Nowadays you can find out in about 45 seconds.

Or since you mention Swede who would have you asked in the 1990's to find out that powders with burnrates close to IMR4320 work best with their direct gas impingement system.

But according to you there is no knowledge to be gained on the internet

You assume TOO much. Why can't an old surplus rifle in good condition shoot as good if not better than a AR variant. There's nothing even slightly absurd about that. AR's are good rifles but once you get beyond the belief that they are the alpha and omega of rifles you open up all sorts of possibilities. There is NOTHING magic about the AR it's just another gun and all AR aren't created equal.

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I'm not assuming anything. I'm speaking in general terms. You, on the other hand, are simply looking for something about which to argue.

That's your own problem if you cannot realize that READING and comprehending messages posted can gain you a wealth of information in one sitting that could have taken years to have found out in the dark ages.

How long do you think it would have taken you to find out in the 1970's what the total production of Swiss K-31's were by year? Nowadays you can find out in about 45 seconds.

Or since you mention Swede who would have you asked in the 1990's to find out that powders with burnrates close to IMR4320 work best with their direct gas impingement system.

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Schmidt-Rubin production numbers? I own four of them, and though I'm not the least bit interested in production numbers, had I wanted to know, I'd have search for a book with that info.

Data for a Swede? I wouldn't have asked anyone on the internet. I'd have referred to one of the dozen or so reloading manuals I own. Don't you own reloading manuals? I cannot imagine anyone using the internet as their sole source of reloading data, but from what you're saying, sounds like you do. FWIW, I began developing loads for the 6.5x55 in about 1981...long before the personal computer or internet. I made use of loading manuals and a chronograph. And oddly enough, (you better sit down for this one)my father began reloading in the late 1950's...and without a computer! While we're at it, a 96 Swede doesn't have a gas impengement system. It's a bolt action rifle. The one to which you refer is the Swedish AG-42B Ljungman. I'm surprised you didn't know that.

Those are nice groups you shot with your little .223. You'd put it up against my sporter weight bolt gun? (BTW, I don't own any benchrest rifles...or for that matter, not even a single heavy barreled rifle at all)
O.K....here's a very limited example of what you'd be up against. All groups are very typical of what these rifles will do:




If the groups in the bottom picture look somewhat lackluster, it's because they were all fired from 50+ year old rifles at 100 yds. with open (issue) sights.

Remember one of the original posters criteria: The rifle must be chambered in 308. So, Remington 7615 is not an option. And the 7600 is not an option either because 1) the carbine version is chambered only in 30-06 and 2) it already weighs over 7 lbs. before the scope, scope mounts, sling, etc. are added.
Regards,
35W

Data for a Swede? I wouldn't have asked anyone on the internet. I'd have referred to one of the dozen or so reloading manuals I own.

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And not a single one of them would have mentioned that the semiautomatic AG42b existed.

I'm not assuming anything. I'm speaking in general terms.

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AH YES! We all know how making sweeping generalizations is a great way to learn things.

It's a bolt action rifle. The one to which you refer is the Swedish AG-42B Ljungman. I'm surprised you didn't know that.

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MY mistake I did omit that in my original text, Having owned 4 examples of Swedish Mausers and one AG42

Those are nice groups you shot with your little .223. You'd put it up against my sporter weight bolt gun? (BTW, I don't own any benchrest rifles...or for that matter, not even a single heavy barreled rifle at all)

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Yes I would as 3 shot groups don't really prove much but If you want to shoot 3 shot groups I've got an ancient surplus BUBBA hackjob that'll give your Ruger 280 a run for it's money. It is chambered for a .308 diameter cartridge and it does weigh less than 8lbs with a scope sling and all.









But how can that be! old surplus guns NEVER shoot as goot as modern sporting firearms

I started out not knowing whether to just delete argumentative posts or close the thread.

Heck with it. Back to the Talladega race.

Closed.