Home defence loads for 7.62x54R and 8mm

overpenetration could be a problem.

Does your Mosin have a bayonet?

^ +1

There's no way I'd use a rifle like that for home defense! Besides the over-penetration aspect, you'd be deaf for life. Go buy a cheap Hi-Point pistol at least, or shop for a used pistol.

I would agree with the other posters that those rifles are not the best to use in a home. You can find a shotgun for $150+/- that would suite your needs.
However; if you are dead set on using these rifles, you could load down both to about 1800fps. I use 28-30 grains of H4895 under 185gr cast bullets for my 8mm Mauser and I have also successfully used jacket bullets of the same weight with the same charge (don't go any less on the powder if using jacketed bullets). According to the manual, that should give you 1700-1800fps (I don't have the manual in front of me now).

Baby Mosin anyone???

What about one of these for home defense?



You would still have to worry about the over-penetration thing I guess.:banghead:

Closet

BATFE is looking for you!

An acceptable self defense load could be developed with a light 120-130 gr bullet designed for varmint hunting at nearly full velocity. One of those shouldn't have an overpenetration problem, but it'd be horrendously loud. A .45 LC with a good load will shoot through a house from side to side unless something pretty substantial like a big chunk of meat in the refrigerator is hit.

The other problem with most military rifles is that they're LONG. Trying to maneuver one of those around an average house or apartment could prove to be tricky.

Unless you'd like to pay $200 for a license for a "destructive device" or want to explain things to BATFE and a judge, don't cut the stock and barrel off to make it illegal either.

armoredman

Nope! I took it to a local gunsmith/dealer and he said that it was legal. Overall length is 30.5 inches and the barrel is a smidge over 20.

A relative resently passed and I was given all of his reloading stuff. When I removed a stack of about 20 dies this was behind them. His sister signed it over to me.

Closet

Don't use handloads for self defense!

Every article I've ever read by anyone with legal experience regarding self defense have all said the same thing. Do NOT Use Handloads For Self Defense.

It gives the prosecuting attorney "ammo" to use against you. How are you going to prove you didn't load some special "killer" bullets?

One other, more important issue, factory ammo has been tested and has certain proven characteristics, like the pattern of burnt powder residue deposited at close range. There was a cop who was acquitted of shooting a perp largely because the perp's claim of being 30' away was impossible given the powder residue on the perps clothing that indicated a max distance of 18".

Do use handloads to develop skills useful for self defense.

In that case, there's a chiropractor looking to work on your hands/wrists - OUCH!

I did shoot it twice and it kicked like a mule! I held it on my hip with my thumb next to my trigger finger and my left hand on top of the chamber. It's not real accurate. Imagine that!!

I think I'll clean it up and display it. Nice conversation piece.

You can load 10grs of Red Dot with either a cast or jacketed bullet of normal weight for the cartridge. No fillers and don't go past 13 grs. With a jacketed bullet the velocity should be around 1,200 to 1,300 fps for either.

+1 on the Red Dot idea. I used to load up 30-06 this way with a 110gr Sierra Varminter. Not sure how fast it was going, but I'd suspect it'd do just fine. I suppose the same kind of loading with light bullets would do well for 7.62x54r or 8x57 (I think Hornady makes a 125gr bullet).

You can contact Alliant at http://www.alliantpowder.com/ and go to the "Contact Us" for their e-mail or phone number.

Tell them your looking for a low power load using the powder of your choice for a 1,200 - 1,300 fps with the bullet you want to use. They'll most likely send you a load. It may take some time.

Unless you'd like to pay $200 for a license for a "destructive device" or want to explain things to BATFE and a judge, don't cut the stock and barrel off to make it illegal either.

Click to expand...

You mean short barreled rifle. Sure is a hoot to shoot a 91/30 like that....

My not on it is get a managable rifel u like in handgun cal such as Henery yellowboy in 44mag and run agood self defence load like T.A.P.

Batjke,

While there would be no end to answers regarding not to do it, I think a Mosin, loaded properly would be actually a great home defense gun. Check out Brassfetcher online for their 203gr Soft Point gel tests for 7.62x54. Neat stuff and penetration seems manageable (however, it is Barnaul ammo, so flash would set the house on fire) .

Also, Graf and Sons used to have a 125gr Hornady VMax for .311 diameter guns (specifically the x39). This, loaded with a mild load to keep flash down would be great. Failing that, a 125gr soft point would keep overpenetration down, as I would imagine most of the .311 diameter 125gr softpoints are designed for x39, not x54. Anything heavier than that would most likely overpenetrate. As for flash, lower loads are a must. Also, in my loading adventures, Vihtavouri powders always seem VERY low flash and perform superbly.

As for 8mm Mauser, in my opinion, would not use for home defense. Most bullets for loading in that diameter are heavy soft points that are designed for heavier animals. Unless you can find a light weight soft point for it, Mauser would be out of the question in my mind.

I have always been under the idea that a bolt action (if properly loaded for and trained with) can be effective for home defense. It isnt the latest shotgun with lights attached or tacti-crap on it, but one can still attach a light to a Mosin and have an effective home defense. The M44 Mosin, coupled with a scout mount/large diameter red dot, with a light attached (while looking ungainly), good loading and proper technique would be a very effective home defense weapon. Just because it takes a little more practice than a claymore on a stick doesnt mean discount it if that is all one has/limited to.

As far as not using handloads for defense, has there ever been a case regarding this? I have nothing but respect for Ayoob, but filler material for his book would be what I believe this to be. So many people say that but never come up with case one where it was used as an attack against the defendant. Heck, I could imagine that lots of folks that cant afford factory ammo using ball reloads bought from a store (like ultramax or house brands)for defense. I load all my loads for defense very stringently for quality and never scrimp (I dont use a progressive just for that reason, gotta check every one). I have NEVER had one load not go off. YMMV. I feel as long as one doesnt gas on about reloaded ammo and how it made him dead right there, one should be fine. Sorry for the rant, but I get a little hot under the collar when I hear that stuff. To me it is a similar arguement above: Its not the most tacticool round on the planet, so you will get in trouble in court for using it.

PTK,

Please tell me that chopped 91/30 is a Photoshop

The muzzle blast on that must make an M44 look/sound like a kids cap gun.

Screw the mosin and the mauser for home D. Use a ball bat. It is more fun

"...What about one of these..." The only thing that's more useless than a shotgun with no stock is a rifle with no stock.
"...Any suggestions?..." Buy a 12 or 20 guage pump shotgun. If that's out, financially, look into light cast bullet loads. You'll still have over penetration issues though. They're still far faster than any handgun bullet.

Dude, I really would ditch the bolt action rifle for home defense. I hate to say it, but if some guy comes in your house with a wonder nine or a shotgun, you are gonna be toast.

I really think you should spend the extra $150 on a good used shotgun.

Actually, it's safe to go up to 15 grains of red dot in these cartridges. Generally, though, 13 grains is ideal.

(From Ed Harris).

I load squib loads with 7 grains of red dot in the mosin. No recoil worth talking about, and with a 160gr bullet, I figure it's somewhere between .38 special and .357 in terms of muzzle energy.

That's far below published loads, however, so use at your own risk. Be alert for squibs. I use it in a 91/30, so if your mosin is a carbine, you'd probably have no problems with that load.