Anyone ever heard of listing an automatic weapon as an estate?

clemsonu0219 · Jun 7, 2009

Have been trying to research it through the net but the wording is a little too lawyerish for me.

An ATF agent told my uncle who is a DEA agent that it is legal for an individual to list an automatic weapon as an estate, not sure exactly how to and thats kind of what I'm asking, in order to own said firearm.

This is apparently a way around going through the process of obtaining a Class III.

Anyways, I'm sure someone can fill me in on this... either if I'm right or wrong. Thoughts?

waterhouse · Jun 7, 2009

You can put NFA weapons on a Trust, which gets around sending in pictures, fingerprints, and CLEO signatures for the Form 4.

I'm guessing that is what they were talking about, but I'm not sure.

You'd still have to pay the $200 tax per item, fill out the paperwork, and for machine guns you could only buy expensive pre-1986 ones, but you generally get approved a little sooner and you save time on other stuff (fingerprints, CLEO, etc.)

clemsonu0219 · Jun 7, 2009

You can put NFA weapons on a trust, which gets around sending in pictures, fingerprints, and CLEO signatures for the Form 4.

I'm guessing that is what they were talking about, but I'm not sure.

Would you still have to obtain a Class III?

ScotZ · Jun 7, 2009

It is my understanding that you only need a class III to transfer an automatic weapon. I am sure someone more knowledgable than me will chime in.

waterhouse · Jun 7, 2009

You never have to get a "Class III". Dealers of NFA guns must have a dealer's license and then pay a special occupation tax (SOT) to deal in NFA weapons, but this doesn't apply to non dealers.

Class 3 is just a class of SOT. You can get an SOT for manufacturing, or for importing, and the Class for dealing with NFA items is Class 3.

NFA weapons are generally called Title 2 firearms, as opposed to Title 1 firearms (regular old guns that most gun stores carry.)

clemsonu0219 · Jun 7, 2009

You never have to get a "Class III". Dealers of NFA guns must have a dealer's license and then pay a special occupation tax to deal in NFA weapons, but this doesn't apply to non dealers.

That makes sense. You're a good man waterhouse, thanks.

clemsonu0219 · Jun 7, 2009

One more question. It was my understanding, and it could be wrong, that this would get around having to ask your local sheriff for a signature. Some county Sheriff's refuse to sign off on it...

waterhouse · Jun 7, 2009

You're welcome. If you ever want to get into NFA stuff (I'm a big fan of suppressors) probably the easiest route is to search for a Class 3 or Title II dealer in your area and talk to them. Most of them can fill you in on local legalities and walk you through the process.

clemsonu0219 · Jun 7, 2009

You're welcome. If you ever want to get into NFA stuff (I'm a big fan of suppressors) probably the easiest route is to search for a Class 3 or Title II dealer in your area and talk to them. Most of them can fill you in on local legalities and walk you through the process.

That's most definitely the best idea. Thanks again for all the help.

divemedic · Jun 8, 2009

What I did was establish a trust, and then sent in the form. No CLEO signoff, no pictures, just the form and the trust.

TexasRifleman · Jun 8, 2009

One more question. It was my understanding, and it could be wrong, that this would get around having to ask your local sheriff for a signature. Some county Sheriff's refuse to sign off on it...

That is correct. Trusts or corporations don't need the CLEO signoff.

If you decide to go this route, be careful, don't cheap out on the legal side of things.

Make sure it's done right.

Sheldon J · Jun 8, 2009

considering what a good quality full auto can sell for having it listed would be a real good idea....

1KPerDay · Jun 8, 2009

You can leave your registered NFA weapons to your kids, and they don't have to pay the tax, IIRC. Dunno if they'll have to get fingerprinted, etc. but I assume so.

Corey · Jun 9, 2009

You can leave your registered NFA weapons to your kids, and they don't have to pay the tax, IIRC. Dunno if they'll have to get fingerprinted, etc. but I assume so.

This is correct, a legal heir has the weapon transfered on a Form 5 (tax exempt transfer). They still have to meet all the requirements for posessing an NFA weapon, they just use a different form and don't pay the tax.

SquirrelNuts · Jun 9, 2009

I have seen them advertised that way before by an estate/auction company.

Frog48 · Jun 9, 2009

It was my understanding, and it could be wrong, that this would get around having to ask your local sheriff for a signature.

Correct. As stated above, when registered to a trust or corporation, a CLEO signature is not required.

Trusts or corporations don't need the CLEO signoff.

It appears that the original poster is unfamiliar with the CLEO acronym...
CLEO = Chief Law Enforcement Officer, aka municipal Police Chief and/or county Sheriff.

Anyone ever heard of listing an automatic weapon as an estate?

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