.410 pump for apartment HD??

I use a 410 for home defense. I choose to use #6 shot since I am very concerned about overpenetration in my situation. Even a 2.5 inch shell of #6 will hit with the muzzle energy of a .357 mag. At typical across-the-room distances (like 10-20 feet) im convinced it would do some serious damage.

The winchester 3 pellet 000 buckshot is a very powerful load. Would be like getting hit with 3 rounds of 9mm at at the same time. I would choose this load if I didnt have to worry about overpenetration.

Hey, a .410 with the 000 loads is far superior to a .380 HD.

As someone already said the pellets have the same basic velocity as a 12 or 20 ga.

The 3 pellet 2.5in load moves at 1300 fps.

The 5 pellet 3 in load moves at 1135 fps.

A .380 bullet (only one per shot) moves at 950-1000 fps.

(though it does have a little more mass)

How can anyone say that a .410 with 000 would not be enough to stop a BG?:banghead:

It's a GOOD choice for the person and the situation.


fps.http://www.winchester.com/products/catalog/shotdetail.aspx?symbol=XB413&use=4&gauge=410

I have been a fan of the .410 since I (mistakenly) recommended a 20 ga. for a woman friend of mine. When we took it shooting, she hated the recoil of buckshot, really hated slugs, but didn't mind birdshot. I actually think the recoil of that 20 ga. was the same as my 12 ga. (I brought them both that day)
For a woman, I now recommend a 410 pump with 2 1/2" buckshot. Keep in mind, each of the five pellets in the buckshot has the stopping power of a .38 bullet!!!

For an apartment with walls of drywall on 2X4's, I'd load up birdshot (sorry, I can't recommend blasting holes into neighbors apartments)

And here is a little more info on the power of a .410 using buckshot from brass fetcher.

Looks good to me!

http://www.brassfetcher.com/Winchester 3 inch 5 pellet buck.html

An up side to the low pellet count in the .410 in a condo situation is, of course, the low pellet count! You only have 3 or 5 pellets to account for!


I think I'm going to go out and buy my wife one this week.

My statements above is the 410 is a limited hunting gun. I think they are fine for home defense. How many remember the snake charmer? If you think racking a load in the chamber is a deterrent your nuts. What is intimidating is making no noise and then a challenge be it a light or vocal. In your home stealth is your friend and no body should be able to beat you at it. This is the ultimate squirrel hunt.



Jim

I use a 410 for home defense. I choose to use #6 shot since I am very concerned about overpenetration in my situation. Even a 2.5 inch shell of #6 will hit with the muzzle energy of a .357 mag. At typical across-the-room distances (like 10-20 feet) im convinced it would do some serious damage.

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#6 shot will not hit like a 357... the shot column would have to act in the manner of a slug, which is does not. it acts like a few hundred tiny pellets. as a conglomeration they lack the necessary penetration to stop a bad guy.

#6 shot will not hit like a 357... the shot column would have to act in the manner of a slug, which is does not. it acts like a few hundred tiny pellets. as a conglomeration they lack the necessary penetration to stop a bad guy.

Click to expand...

I agree with you that birdshot lacks penetration but this is a good thing for me since I live in a very built-up area. Im not saying it would have the devastation of a .357, but it has comparable calculated energy when talking about close range spitting distance...when the pellets would be just barely leaving the shot cup and almost like a big solid clump.

I have no doubt that the buckshot would be a much more reliable manstopper though. Just not suitable for my situation.

Looks like mossburg makes a nice youth .410 pump with a 20 inch barrel.

That would be a great shotty for HD I think. Nice and short.

I think the whole gun is under three feet.

The federal load:
weight - 191 gr (12.41 grams)
velocity - 1200 fps

Now a modern bullet is designed to perform better than shot, but mass and velocity-wise, the .410 load has the upper hand over most popular pistol rounds. With the popularity of the judge, I'd keep an eye on the market too. I wouldn't be surprised if we see more .410 rounds geared towards SD.

EDIT: It's not clear if it's 12.41 g total or per shot. If it's total, then I guess you're looking at ~64 gr each.

My thoughts on over penetration: If it can't go through a couple sheets of 5/8" drywall, how can it possibly be used to stop a threat? I'm not making any claims about the .410, but if your main concern is over penetration you clearly are not as concerned about living and stopping a threat.


Good luck and I hope your friends are alright. I would also make sure both of them have flashlights (Lithium lights are super bright). Make sure her dead bolt works, that she has a key, and that the "bad guy" doesn't have a key.

Well I would use triple 00 or slugs they do't penetrate musch over pistol calibers.



Jim

Well, my 2 cents on overpenetration...I would honestly rather risk my own life than endanger the life of an innocent neighbor or family member. If birdshot puts me at higher risk of not stopping the threat, thats something im willing to live with.

But honestly I dont think its an issue at very close range. Get hit center of mass with birdshot from across a living room and that bad guy is in a world of hurt. If it doesnt kill them outright it will make them definitely rethink their course of action.

But to each his own...

But honestly I dont think its an issue at very close range. Get hit center of mass with birdshot from across a living room and that bad guy is in a world of hurt. If it doesnt kill them outright it will make them definitely rethink their course of action.

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well, if the situation arose where you warned, then fired upon an intruder. then i would not consider it reasonable to assume they will rethink their course of action.
drugs?
adrenaline?
getting pissed that some dude just peppered him with birdshot?

also, know that birdshot will penetrate several walls before stopping.

the best way to stop a bullet is to hit your target

For years in Eastern Ark I saw deer brought in by women and children killed with a 410. If you can kill deer with 410 buck and slugs you can take down a BG.

If it's not powerful enough to penetrate drywall, it's probably not powerful enough to stop a bad guy.

I would honestly rather risk my own life than endanger the life of an innocent neighbor or family member. If birdshot puts me at higher risk of not stopping the threat, thats something im willing to live with.

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I think you are exactly correct here. Especially when you will be called into court. I don't want to be responsible for shooting my neighbor because some crack head broke in.
I do think a load of birdshot will get a burglar's attention. We had a shooting this week where the 3 bad guys left after one was shot with a .22 by a teen. The teen will not be charged, the bad guys took their friend to the hospital.

I agree with Guns and More completely. Since your responsible for where that round goes after you pull the trigger a .410 in a condo/apartment situation sounds great. You shoot a kid asleep in the next apartment and see if you can live with that. Mike