Single stage press?

Thanks for the input, hags. I'm a long-time shooter, who has been taking the slow approach to getting into handloading; I've been reading books for about six month's now, and am going to take the plunge. My thoughts are along the lines of 'buy cheap, buy twice', but getting everyone's two cents on presses is really valuable.

Atroxus, if there is a gun club in your area go over and ask where some of the local guys get their powder and primers. You may have to talk to a few before you find out what you need to know, as many will only order large orders on the web.

ranger335v said:

But loading handgun ammo places little real stress on a press, anything out there will do quite nicely. Even one of the little RCBS aluminum framed "Reloader" presses would be good enough, right?

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Absolutely CORRECT.
However, what happens when the person decides they are now going to load thousands of rounds of .223 ammo, because someone gave them the brass, and then they want to load 30-06 and other rifle cases? I know once a person gets into reloading, it is contagious.

Why buy something now when, down the road, you may regret it and wish you would have spent a bit more to begin with?

Just sayin!

As all of my presses are Lee Classic CAST presses I will stay out of this Lee press bashing session. BUT...If you want the best for your megger dollar. Look into Lee's Classic CAST presses, both single stage and turret press...

You can save a little money on a press and still go first class by visiting Gunbroker or AuctionArms and looking for a used RCBS. You also have a chance to find some of their discontinued presses, some of which were sweethearts.

I started reloading in 1979 with an iron frame RCBS RS press that I've grown to love over the years. Nothing I've used gives the feel of seating a primer like that press; partly because it doesn't have the fancy toggle-link press linkage. Yet it still has enough leverage to handle the limited amount of belted magnum reloading I do...and being an iron O-frame, it's plenty strong.

Recently I found a virutally NIB RCBS JR3 on Gunbroker for about $70 and bought it. It's the same press as my old RS except with a different name. Set it up in a different location. It too is a dream to seat primers with. No messing with ram primes or hand primers and a seperate priming step; seat on the press during the size operation.

I've not been too happy with the toggle-link presses I've owned. Yeah, they make sizing a .300 Mag. case a bit easier, but the primer seating feel is very poor. The typical reloader will seat a lot more primers than he will size belted magnum cases. Unfortunately, nearly every press built today is toggle-link.

Yeah, I know....old school....
Bob

Back to helping Atroxus....

Know anyplace that has primers by chance? Also is 162.99 a good deal for 1000 new winchester brass cases?

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Atroxus -
Like was said... go to a local gun club meeting, shooting range, gun store, gun show, or outdoor sports store and ask around. Primers and powder are much cheaper to buy locally when you're only buying 1 lb at a time. A pound of powder will cost you somewhere around $17-$25. If you ship it through the mail, then they add a $25 hazardous material fee. I think you can add well enough to see what happens.

Order bullets from Missouri Bullets as a starter. Order something middle of the road, such as 124-125gr in 9mm. They'll be tons of loading info on that weight range. THR users get a discount from Missouri, so do a search on "Missouri discount".

On powder, stick with something common like Winchester 231 or Hodgdon HP-38, which use the exact same load data. You can get trusted load data from the Hodgdon web site. These are very common powders and very easy to find. Fairly clean and very accurate. You just can't go wrong starting there. As was said, you'll get about 1600 shots from a pound of powder, so you'll only need 1 can. Besides after 1600 shots, your right arm may have fallen off.


Most important of all... advertise here and at the local gun club to have someone look over your shoulder for the first couple of times. You need a local buddy in this hobby. Someone you can call, someone to swap with, someone to alert you to good local deals, someone to bounce ideas off of, someone to split powder orders with. You see how it is, over half this thread is an argument over brand loyalty and not really helping you with your questions. A buddy gives you a single trusted point of contact.


Watch where you step! Reloaders are everywhere!

Most important of all... advertise here and at the local gun club to have someone look over your shoulder for the first couple of times. You need a local buddy in this hobby. Someone you can call, someone to swap with, someone to alert you to good local deals, someone to bounce ideas off of, someone to split powder orders with. You see how it is, over half this thread is an argument over brand loyalty and not really helping you with your questions. A buddy gives you a single trusted point of contact.

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Now that's a good piece of advice!!

IMO, I would steer clear of anything Lee.

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hags I would be interested to know why you think this and what problems you had with your Lee presses.

My thoughts are along the lines of 'buy cheap, buy twice', but getting everyone's two cents on presses is really valuable.

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I thought the same thing so I started with the Lee classic turret because it was what I could afford at the time. Well I have been loading on it for over three years and don't see any reason to change. I have loaded on a friends Dillon 550 and even though it was nice it's not worth the extra money for me.

However, what happens when the person decides they are now going to load thousands of rounds of .223 ammo, because someone gave them the brass, and then they want to load 30-06 and other rifle cases? I know once a person gets into reloading, it is contagious.

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Not a problem. I have loaded thousands of rounds of 223 on my classic turret and have a couple of friends that have loaded thousands of 30-06 rounds on their classic turret presses. Inspector this is not aimed at you it's just a general statement. You would be surprised how many people like to say they would never own a Lee press or Lee is junk just from what they have heard and have never used a Lee press. I think if they could get past that and try the classic turret or classic cast single they would have a change of heart.

Why buy something now when, down the road, you may regret it and wish you would have spent a bit more to begin with?

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How true but how do we know what to buy. I know this is very rare but I actually know someone that started with a Dillon 550. He didn't like it so he sold it and bought a Lee classic turret and said he is much happier. Spending more money isn't always the best deal.

I have been offering classes on Handloading thru the local Sporting Goods store for the last 10 years. Having someone mentor you is the best way to see how the process works , see different press configurations and build confidence and knowledge thru hands on.
As you can tell, Handloaders are very eager to help. I am sure there are more than a few around you...Seek them out
Our program familiarizes the newbie with different presses and focuses on the press set up that the student is most comfortable with and is within their budget. The quality of your ammunition is determined by knowledge and experience...Not the Press

So when you hear...

IMO, I would steer clear of anything Lee.

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Disregard as nonsense.

Also, getting a few to go in on orders is a real $$ saver.

psyop said:

So when you hear...

IMO, I would steer clear of anything Lee.

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Disregard as nonsense.

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Agreed.


Brand loyalty is fine. But unless you can get someone to say WHY one brand sucks, or why he prefers another product, ignore it.

I have a LOT of Lee tools. The only tools I don't use from Lee are the powder measure and scale. The powder measure is so-so for anything except ball. Ball powder leaks through the gaps and seams.

The powder scale is OK. But I prefer something more robust, and that can measure heavier weights.

I have these on my bench, two Ultramags and one Lee Classic Cast Turret. I've also owned Forster and the Rockchucker. The Forster was a very nice press just not enough room for my ham hands with the magnum cases so I sold it. The Rockchucker was sloppy compared to all the others. I would not buy another. The Lee is a very nice press for the money. I paid $62 for mine brand new. I wish I'd picked up a Lee Classic Cast when they first came out for $54. The Redding Ultramags are rock solid. The Lee Classic Cast Turret can be used as a single stage press by removing the auto index linkage. It's also very solid.

As I've said before....

• Reloading presses are like cars. Whether you drive a Yugo or a Mercedes, everyone gets where they're going. The owner simply makes his/her own choice based on the mix and quality of the features versus the price they can afford at the time. There are far too many choices, features, prices for someone else to make a single statement about what's going to be best for me next week.

• In truth, after reloading for 10+ years no reloader's bench is all one color. Eventually everyone has a smattering of red, burgundy, orange, gray, green, blue, the other green, and maybe even black and brown! Everyone seems to be trying to hit a moving quality target, which always seems to cost just a little more than I can afford right now.


Best bet is to save all the strong feelings and opinions for our elected officials who would take it all away.

I wish I knew someone local to mentor me for reloading, but I don't have any friends that load their own ammo. You guys on THR sem downright helpful though, so I hope you don't mind being a substitute mentor.

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I work for a small 85 person company. I put a tiny notice on the common bulletin board for reloaders to contact me. Six different people, whom I had worked with and known for years, stopped me. Another guy who was thinking about it, and who has since bought a Hornady LNL, also came by. Three more who were "gun nuts" also stopped by.


Watch where you step! Reloaders are everywhere!

I don't have any friends that load their own ammo.

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Seek them out..what a super way to meet new friends

I started handloading in 1968, and my press was the RCBS Jr. You asked if anyone recently upgraded to a progressive press. I added a Dillon 550B about 7 or 8 years ago, simply to increase loading speed of commonly used handgun loads. I still use the RCBS Jr. for load development and all rifle loading. After 41 years, that little gem still works like a new one.
No, it is not for sale. But RCBS can fix you up with a good single stage loader that will last you a life time. Just my humble opinion. I've never used any Lee stuff, other than a few of their bullet moulds, which I have no problem with. They work fine and are a good bargain, if you think you might want to get into casting. I don't do much of that anymore. Have a hard enough time getting to the range to shoot, these days.
I think you'll find that handloading is an enjoyable hobbie in itself. A great thing to do on those long, cold winter nights to build up your inventory of ammo for the spring, summer, and fall. Take your time and enjoy it. There is no need to hurry. When the time comes that you shoot more than you can load, then you will know it's time for a progressive. For me, that took quite a few years.
Have fun, but be safe!

Hello Astroxus,

Let me start by saying that on my bench in the Man Cave, I have a Lee Classic cast, a Redding T7 Turret, a Dillon 550B, and two Dillon XL650's. I also have a RCBS Rockchucker that I used for years and years from my God father in a box (hold extreme sentimental value as he recently passed)

That said, I also have a mini bench in my family room that holds a "crappy old Lee challenger press, the one without the breech locks. I think I paid $25.00 for it new from my friend who works at a shooting range I go to.

With that crappy little press, I can safely say I would not hesitate to work brass on any caliber I presently I assemble cartridges for. It may not be as smooth as my "better" presses or as stout and I may eventually break the linkage if I continue to try and push it by using it on my magnum cases but if all you are going to do is load handgun, IMO, this would be all you need.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psyop
So when you hear...


Quote:
IMO, I would steer clear of anything Lee.

Disregard as nonsense.

Agreed.

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I also agree with this 100%

If you are wanting to assemble your own ammunition and have very limited green backs in your wallet, Lee makes tools that will get the job done. Are there better tools? Absolutely but the best tools are not always neccesary.

LGB

My defense ammo is 115gr and I would like to keep my target ammo characteristics similar to my defense ammo.

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I agree. 115gr 9mm would also be a nice, middle of the road place to start. Good shooting and inexpensive. Maybe a little more barrel flip but nothing to complain about really. We all started on 115gr at one time.

However, before settling on your SD ammo, you might want to read this.... RAT CHEER, as we are prone to say in the South.

I wish I knew someone local to mentor me for reloading, but I don't have any friends that load their own ammo.

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Best way to fix that is move South, brother. You never have control over where you were born, only over where your children are born.

I am new to reloading as well. I haven't used anything but RCBS equipment so far, but I wouldn't be opposed to trying Lee. After all, as reasonably priced as it is, if you don't like it, you're not out a lot of money. I am about to try some Lee dies because I can get them at Mid South Shooter Supply for $15 each. I have a friend who hasn't shot a factory load in ten years and he swears up and down that Lee dies are better. I guess I'll see. For the money, it's definately worth trying.

I have a Lee Classic Cast Turret and a small Lee Reloader single stage. Both have performed perfectly. My next press will be the Lee Classic Cast single stage. Contrary to what some say, I believe you will be hard pressed to find a better value than Lee products.

I get a kick out of this whole Lee vs Anti-Lee crap. You know folks, they all do the job well. I have one of about everything and they all work fine. My Lee Challenger has loaded thousands of rounds and I've never had a problem with it. My Dillon 550B has loaded 10 of thousands of rounds, and I've had zero problems with it.

They all do as advertised.

For a starter, I'd get a Lee Anniversary kit and start reloading. If you want something bigger, better, faster later, then do so. I suspect that you'll keep the press and upgrade the accessories though.

Didn't know this was a Lee debate...........but,

you can measure run out on a finished round from a Lee and one from a a Forster.
Let me know what you find.

Not to mention out of square trimmers, inaccurate and inconsistent powder chargers, cheapy scales, parts breakage and not so hot tolerances.

I'm not dumping on Lee, just giving my experience and opinions. This is my experience and the experiences of those I know and deal with.

Lee makes great beginner and entry level products. They are a plus to the industry and hobby.

The problem with single stage presses from RCBS, Hornady and Lyman is none of them have decent spent primer handling. They each send more than the occasional spent primer (and a fair amount of dirt/debris) bouncing to the bench and floor below.

Lee, Redding and Forster all make presses that do consistently herd spent primers and debris through the ram into a tube to a catch bottle or bucket/wastebasket below. The Lee Classic Cast, Redding Big Boss II and UltraMag, and the Forster Co-Ax all have this feature.

In addition, all of these presses are compatible with, or offer their own version of quick change die systems. The LCC, BBII and Ultramag are compatible with Hornady's Lock-N-Load press conversion kit that allows them to use dies equipped with LNL QC bushings. The Co-Ax has it's own snap-in/out floating die system for both convenience and enhanced accuracy.

The LCC is impossible to beat for the price, and is a solid, powerful and accurate press in its own right. Its handle and linkage are adjustable for handle and stroke length, angle of handle sweep, and left/right handedness. At almost 3X the price of the LCC, the co-ax is loaded with accuracy and convenience features, and is widely considered the best-designed, best-built single stage press available. The UltraMag is about the same price as the co-ax, and handles larger cartridges (the co-ax handles cartridges up to and including standard magnum length just fine), but lacks the co-ax's floating die system and universal shell holding jaws. The BBII is in between the LCC and Ultramag/co-ax in price, and is a very well made o-frame press.

The venerable RCBS Rockchucker press is no longer made in the US, and the quality has fallen from its once exemplary status. If you can find a used one from a couple of decades ago, that is still in good condition (i.e. well taken care of), it would be an good press, but no better than an LCC, and probably almost as expensive.

Andy

I'll stick with good ol' made in the USA Lee equipment. My brother has an older RCBS,and it's good, too...but his equipment cost more,and mine came as a complete kit,and cost less.

I have been wanting to get into reloading but am on a fairly limited budget. Is there anyone out there that has recently upgraded from single stage, to a progressive press? If so would you be willling to sell your (working) used single stage press at a reasonable or low price to help a fella get into reloading?

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Just to get back on track here.... If the lee is what you can afford, and you can't find a used press, then buy one. Period.
The end result will be reloaded cases..... which is where you are trying to got to.
At least you will be shooting while you save enough money for a different brand if you don't like it! When I started the only thing I put serious money into was my scale. A lousy press may be a pain in the neck, but it wont hurt your gun. A cheap unreliable scale could.