Something is still not Kosher

Status
Not open for further replies.
I'd still measure them. I'm a Lee fan as Walkalong will attest to, but I really wonder if you have an undersized die. Try measuring one of the cases that you lubed and sized.
 
jc - this fiasco started with this post the night before: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=505734 . As you can see, I had undersized die in mind from the get-go. If you read post #6 in that thread you'll see that my Speer Gold Dot SD ammo calipered the same as my resized cases so I didn't worry about the undersized dimensions I was getting. I just rechecked the Speer and my resized case and got the exact same readings.
 
Sorry if this was already mentioned but I didn't read through all of the posts. Check the cases with a magnet. I have read where some people had some Blazer cases that were brass plated steel. I would think steel cases would be harder to size and you could have a chance of sticking one now and then because of that.

Lee Dies, the best for the PRICE. Lee dies will never equal Dillion dies, just as Dillon dies will never equal Lee's prices.

Well I guess that depends on the user. I have used both and prefer Lee dies.
 
OK take it easy on me, I hadn't read that thread. I had made an earlier post on this thread and then jumped in again tonight. Anywho something's not right obviously. Sounds like undersizedis not the problem, die to rough? Hang in there, walkalong is an expert, so is RC. Your problem will get solved. Till then lube.
 
jc - I didn't mean to sound course - I deeply appreciate everything you guys are doing. Actually, the problem is not that big of a deal to me since lube fixed it. I'm pursuing this thread because Walkalong and bds seem perplexed; and, like me, they like solutions to problems.

I think, like you suggested, that the bore of the die is poorly finished. This would explain the striations you see in the photo and the fact that lube solved the problem. But being so chronically newb, who am I to say?
 
Last edited:
I'm pursuing this thread because Walkalong and bds seem perplexed
I am indeed perplexed because I have never seen this problem, ever. And having to continue using lube on your carbide sizer is not a solved problem, it is an accommodation.

I really recommend a call/email to Lee and to mention this THR thread. If you like, I will gladly email Lee for you since I have had very good customer relations with them for the past 15+ years. My guess of their response would be to send them the dies for Lee to inspect with replacement if the die dimensions are out of specs.

IMG_0049.jpg
 
I PM'd my addy Epicurean.

I have a Lee 9MM sizer that is probably going on 25 years old that works great with Blazer brass. So does the much newer Redding I have as far as that goes. Both do a great job. Neither is superior to the other, although the Redding is a hair smoother. Not really enough to pay the difference for though. I never lube the cases. :)

I had not thought about it perhaps being brass plated steel. Does Blazer do that? I know S&B does on some cases.

Are the cases nice and straight going into the die? Even if they are standing straight up, if they are out of alignment with the die, it will cause problems.

Since other calibers are OK, I would think the press is fine, which leads us back to the shell holder. But then again, it's only the Blazer brass that tears, although you do say all the 9MM brass is tough. How about a carbide insert that is not straight in the die?

AC
 
Funny thing today.

I put my Dillon .38 sizer in the LNL to size some .357 brass. The first two go fine, but then all of a sudden they start really dragging. Very tough to size, and they have some scratching. This die has been working fine for probably a couple thousand sizings since it was fixed.

This is the Dillon sizer I bought and the carbide ring came out of. I figure it got loose again and is a hair crooked in the die. I think that may be the problem with your die as well. I fully expect your brass to size just fine in my 9MM sizers when it gets here. I feel sure your die is at fault, whatever the reason. We shall soon see.

I know it is the Dillon die causing a problem because I popped my RCBS sizer die in and everything went back to smooth like it should be. Yes, including the cases that were dragging earlier. I went on and sized the remainder of 50 .357 & 50 .38 brass with zero problems. AC
 
So, assuming the cases I sent work in one of your dies, we can conclude that the problem is my die. Is there a fix or do they go back to Lee?
 
Lee will replace it. No problem. All the reloading companies stand behind their products very well.
 
Epicurean,

Sorry to hear that you are still having issues. Those pics look like the stuck cases are pretty maimed.
 
Call/email Lee and reference this THR thread. You will have your replacement die in no time.

I am hoping for a happy ending soon. :D
 
Judging by the evidence on the sized cases with the rims torn, the die is definitely bad IMO. I thought you were going to send a couple of the unsized Blazer cases. I wanted to size one to be 100% sure. I'm only 99.99% sure right now.

Still funny how the Blazer brass was the worst. They obviously had more friction/stickiness when sizing.

Call Lee. They'll make it right. :)
 
For what it is worth Lee recently had a run of undersized 9mm sizing dies. I know because, unfortunately, I had one. As best I could measure it, it was 2.5 to 3 thousandths undersized when compared to another Lee 9mm sizing die that was known to be good. My brass stuck somewhat in this die with lubed brass, but fortunately, because I use lube on all my carbide dies because I am old and weak, I did not have the tearing rims. The die would create a ridge, for lack of a better word, on the brass at the point where it reached its farthest point on its downward movement. You could see this ridge with the naked eye and definitely feel it with your fingernail. Your pictures look like those pieces of brass may have this ridge. The die was replaced gratis and the sticking and ridge problem disappeared.

Jeff
 
That looks like exactly what is happening with Epicurean's brass. It as a sharp entrance to the carbide ring at least, if not undersized as well. I had this problem on a Lee "undersized" die in .38 Super. I ruined a couple of grinding stones working on the carbide to get rid of the ridge it caused. Works OK now. Carbide is seriously tough stuff I found out.
 

Attachments

  • Epicurean's 9MM blazer Brass Pic 1.JPG
    Epicurean's 9MM blazer Brass Pic 1.JPG
    21.6 KB · Views: 5
  • Epicurean's 9MM blazer Brass Pic 2.JPG
    Epicurean's 9MM blazer Brass Pic 2.JPG
    26.1 KB · Views: 6
For what it is worth Lee recently had a run of undersized 9mm sizing dies. I know because, unfortunately, I had one. ... You could see this ridge with the naked eye and definitely feel it with your fingernail. Your pictures look like those pieces of brass may have this ridge. The die was replaced gratis and the sticking and ridge problem disappeared.

I had this problem on a Lee "undersized" die in .38 Super. I ruined a couple of grinding stones working on the carbide to get rid of the ridge it caused. Works OK now.

So, if you have one of these undersized 9mm sizing dies, one call to Lee and you will have a happy ending?

Epicurean, have you called Lee yet? :D Walkalong, you considered calling Lee also for your 38 Super sizer?
 
I am putting my money that the die is really a 380 die that was mislabeled at manufacture. I own both calibers from Lee and the only diff is the carbide size ring in the mouth as far as I can see.
 
Did the OP ever mic the cases as asked way back? Whether it means anything or not. And if so what is the dia.?

Epicurean did in his earlier post: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=505734

I started sizing and decapping some 9mm tonight. I have the Lee 4 die set. The case is very difficult to fully insert - so much so that I had to lube the cases and torque the press (Lee Classic Turret) much much harder than the 38s I loaded. I calipered the OD of some cases and they measure 0.375" at the mouth and 0.384" just above the head. This is 0.006" to 0.007" below the spec in the Lee book. I set up the Factory Crimp Die, ran the crimp all the way out and the cases slide in effortlessly. Do I have an undersized resizing die?


I am putting my money that the die is really a 380 die that was mislabeled at manufacture.
Epicurean posted,
"Brand new Lee 4 die set ... literature says 9mm Luger."

This intriguing saga continues ...
 
Walkalong, you considered calling Lee also for your 38 Super sizer?
No. Should have, but I am bad about trying to fix stuff myself. Hard headed and impatient I am. :scrutiny:

It was sizing correctly, it just left a tiny ridge (smaller than the one on Epicurean's brass) around about a third of the case. Now it doesn't. :)

I'll never try to work carbide again. Dang stuff is bullet proof.
 
I am putting my money that the die is really a 380 die that was mislabeled at manufacture.
On that note I took a Blazer 9MM case (range brass) that had been already sized in a 9MM sizer. It had no bottle necked look etc. Nice and smooth. I put my RCBS .380 sizer in my Partner press and sized the case. It was easy enough for about the first 2/3rds, but then got very tough. I sized it all the way down. It was fairly easy to pull back out of the die.

Judging from measurements on Epicurean's brass and this brass, his die is a 9MM, just either undersized, or with a "sharp" entrance to the carbide ring. One or the other or both.

The 9MM Blazer brass I sized in a .380 sizer had already been sized in a 9MM sizer and was .382 & .388 before running through the .380 sizer. It came out .368 & .373. Epicureans brass was .370/.380 & .387.
.
 

Attachments

  • 9MM blazer brass sized in RCBS carbide .380 sizer Pic 1.JPG
    9MM blazer brass sized in RCBS carbide .380 sizer Pic 1.JPG
    21.1 KB · Views: 6
  • 9MM blazer brass sized in RCBS carbide .380 sizer Pic 2.JPG
    9MM blazer brass sized in RCBS carbide .380 sizer Pic 2.JPG
    25.5 KB · Views: 12
  • Epicurean's 9MM blazer Brass Pic 3.JPG
    Epicurean's 9MM blazer Brass Pic 3.JPG
    29.7 KB · Views: 7
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top