Danny Creasy
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rimfire rifle is the CZ 452 Trainer (aka Special):
Purchase one if you get the chance.
Purchase one if you get the chance.
One of the best values ever in a ...
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beatledog7
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Yep. Super shooter and a great value. Probably the most gun for the money in my safe.
ColtPythonElite
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I agree. I have a couple.
ColtPythonElite
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$350 or so
Bobson
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A $350 .22LR has to be pretty spectacular for it to be a good value, IMO. For me, a good value (in guns) is when respectable accuracy, solid build quality, and authoritative reliability meet reasonable price. The lower the cost of the firearm (compared to its competitors), the more those other three factors can sink and still meet the mark of "good value." Likewise, the more expensive a firearm, the more I expect from it in accuracy, build quality, and reliability.
I think thats pretty much everyone's definition of value; if I were a business owner, appropriately meeting those four needs would be my business plan.
Considering the number of $150-$200 .22LR rifles that are available - some of which have excellent reputations regarding accuracy, build, and reliability (Marlin 60, Ruger 10/22), that CZ 452 must be downright epic.
Thoughts?
I think thats pretty much everyone's definition of value; if I were a business owner, appropriately meeting those four needs would be my business plan.
Considering the number of $150-$200 .22LR rifles that are available - some of which have excellent reputations regarding accuracy, build, and reliability (Marlin 60, Ruger 10/22), that CZ 452 must be downright epic.
Thoughts?
ColtPythonElite
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I doubt if $200 will buy any new .22 that can rival a CZ in accuracy. The build quality is outstanding. Reliability? It s tough to build an unreliable bolt gun.
The average 60 or 10/22 can't hold a candle to the average 452,453,455 in terms of accuracy.
The average 60 or 10/22 can't hold a candle to the average 452,453,455 in terms of accuracy.
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Danny Creasy
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Hey juk, I live in the Shoals area. We have three weeks left at the range we built over 30 years ago. We were on a local municipality's retired landfill and they decided that we just had to go last year. "Can't have a shooting range in the city limits." Still looking for land.
Accuracy Bobson? Here is the first target I fired after winning the pictured rifle back in 2010 on Halloween obviously. I adjusted the open sights to my preference and finished with the half incher on the bottom bull. And, that is with kick around ammo at 50 yards.
Reliable? This is actually my second Trainer. I purchased the first one back at the turn of the century and it just keeps getting better with wise use and modest care. The second one has nicer wood though.
Accuracy Bobson? Here is the first target I fired after winning the pictured rifle back in 2010 on Halloween obviously. I adjusted the open sights to my preference and finished with the half incher on the bottom bull. And, that is with kick around ammo at 50 yards.
Reliable? This is actually my second Trainer. I purchased the first one back at the turn of the century and it just keeps getting better with wise use and modest care. The second one has nicer wood though.
Jackal
Member
Reminds me of the Remington 500 series. Pinpoint accurate, rugged, reliable and built well.
Bobson
Member
Seems like an outstanding gun 
It's too bad people didn't realize what a steal the Izhmash Biathlon/Sobol rifles were. I'm not sure if they are still imported or not. One used to be able to buy one for less than $250. They have superb triggers, are fully free floated, deeply recessed target crowns andthe one I shot would consistently shoot dime size 10 shot groups at 50 yards. Truly an outstanding value. Plus the toggle action is not only fast, but very cool.
I highly doubt the CZ did anything better, let alone $100 better. I think those biathlons were one of the best values ever. No knock on the CZ, those Russian rifles were (perhaps still are) amazing values. I don't know what one goes for on the used market.
steveo452
Member
I too believe that a CZ 452 .22 RF to be one of the best values in a rimfire today. The fit-n-finish as well as accuracy are well above anything in their price range. This is my American model that I've had for about five years. It has a leupold VXII 3-9X33 efr. These five shot groups we're shot at fifty yards from the bench, they we're fired consecutively (no cherry picking). The first group was from a cold, cleaned barrel. The rest are typical. It will shoot .6" - .7" at 100 yards fairly often. So yes I would say that CZ rimfire's are a real value.
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Danny Creasy
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Girodin wrote:
It's too bad people didn't realize what a steal the Izhmash Biathlon/Sobol rifles were. I'm not sure if they are still imported or not. One used to be able to buy one for less than $250. They have superb triggers, are fully free floated, deeply recessed target crowns andthe one I shot would consistently shoot dime size 10 shot groups at 50 yards. Truly an outstanding value. Plus the toggle action is not only fast, but very cool.
I highly doubt the CZ did anything better, let alone $100 better. I think those biathlons were one of the best values ever. No knock on the CZ, those Russian rifles were (perhaps still are) amazing values. I don't know what one goes for on the used market.
I respect the BB but personally I can't stand them. We shoot a plethora of .22 sporter matches at our range and the BBs were really hot a few years ago with half dozen members purchasing them and using them. Here are some issues.
The trigger pull weight is often difficult to increase and that is an issue with the popular sport of CMP Sporter wherein the trigger must lift a 3 lb weight with out releasing the sear. One friend finally put a piece of flip flop sole behind it to give it resistance. The trigger was great for our other sporter matches that had no mininum trigger pull weight. It has a fine trigger from the factory.
To me it feels like a heavy board with no balance or liveliness.
I have witnessed the BB shooters jam the snic snac action too many times to count in rapidfire strings. The aforementioned friend seems to be the only one of the local BB shooters to have mastered the technique of working the straight pull bolt reliably. He would often coach the others, "you have to man handle it - work the h**l out of it."
Oh, I must point out. When you could still purchase the BBs new, a CZ 452 Trainer cost around $250 as well. One must compare apples to apples.
It's too bad people didn't realize what a steal the Izhmash Biathlon/Sobol rifles were. I'm not sure if they are still imported or not. One used to be able to buy one for less than $250. They have superb triggers, are fully free floated, deeply recessed target crowns andthe one I shot would consistently shoot dime size 10 shot groups at 50 yards. Truly an outstanding value. Plus the toggle action is not only fast, but very cool.
I highly doubt the CZ did anything better, let alone $100 better. I think those biathlons were one of the best values ever. No knock on the CZ, those Russian rifles were (perhaps still are) amazing values. I don't know what one goes for on the used market.
I respect the BB but personally I can't stand them. We shoot a plethora of .22 sporter matches at our range and the BBs were really hot a few years ago with half dozen members purchasing them and using them. Here are some issues.
The trigger pull weight is often difficult to increase and that is an issue with the popular sport of CMP Sporter wherein the trigger must lift a 3 lb weight with out releasing the sear. One friend finally put a piece of flip flop sole behind it to give it resistance. The trigger was great for our other sporter matches that had no mininum trigger pull weight. It has a fine trigger from the factory.
To me it feels like a heavy board with no balance or liveliness.
I have witnessed the BB shooters jam the snic snac action too many times to count in rapidfire strings. The aforementioned friend seems to be the only one of the local BB shooters to have mastered the technique of working the straight pull bolt reliably. He would often coach the others, "you have to man handle it - work the h**l out of it."
Oh, I must point out. When you could still purchase the BBs new, a CZ 452 Trainer cost around $250 as well. One must compare apples to apples.
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Interesting rule. Sounds like it might not be a good choice for such contests. I'm not surprised to hear that the trigger is less than 3 lbs. In its factory set up I like it.
Different guns fit people differently and we all have our personal preferences.
Interesting. I've never seen it. Nor have I seen it during an actual Biathlon where that Izhmash action is used. I don't doubt its more of a shooter issue than anything else. Just like with the shooters I see short stroking pump guns in 3 -gun.
Definitely a valid point if that was the case. I'm not sure when Izhmash guns were last available. I'm trying to think when I last saw one in a shop. Definitely a few years ago, but it was $240. At even money I don't know that I would argue one is per se better than the other. Of course my sample size with either gun is of course limited.
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Danny Creasy
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viking499 asked:
Shef, what were some of the other rifles on the line the day of the pic above? Many other CZ's?
The picture was taken of me on the firing line at the 2011 National Rimfire Sporter Match (Camp Perry, OH). I would have simply posted a quick link for you showing the match results with all of the rifles being used, but I cannot figure out the latest edition of the CMP website. Sometimes change is not good!
Anyway, there are three classes of rifles used in CMP Sporter competition; Open Sight (O Class), Telescopic (T Class), and Tactical. The various open sighted CZs like the Trainer aka Special, Lux, UltraLux, and FS dominate O Class. If memory serves me correctly from 2011, almost half of the top 30 O Class shooters used Trainers that day, and most of the other half used one of the other open-sighted CZs.
Up until 2010, the CZ American model was in the hands of many T Class shooters. However, there has been a recent, and sad trend to me, of the dominance of T Class by highly customized Ruger 10/22s (there is one such rifle's barrel appearing to the left in the pic). While they are within the letter of rules, I don't think they are in the spirit of them. But, as all shooting competitions tend to go, specialized equipment will always surface and then dominate the sport until they turn into equipment races.
Even O Class shooters have started building custom 10/22s with big clear open sights attached.
Shef, what were some of the other rifles on the line the day of the pic above? Many other CZ's?
The picture was taken of me on the firing line at the 2011 National Rimfire Sporter Match (Camp Perry, OH). I would have simply posted a quick link for you showing the match results with all of the rifles being used, but I cannot figure out the latest edition of the CMP website. Sometimes change is not good!
Anyway, there are three classes of rifles used in CMP Sporter competition; Open Sight (O Class), Telescopic (T Class), and Tactical. The various open sighted CZs like the Trainer aka Special, Lux, UltraLux, and FS dominate O Class. If memory serves me correctly from 2011, almost half of the top 30 O Class shooters used Trainers that day, and most of the other half used one of the other open-sighted CZs.
Up until 2010, the CZ American model was in the hands of many T Class shooters. However, there has been a recent, and sad trend to me, of the dominance of T Class by highly customized Ruger 10/22s (there is one such rifle's barrel appearing to the left in the pic). While they are within the letter of rules, I don't think they are in the spirit of them. But, as all shooting competitions tend to go, specialized equipment will always surface and then dominate the sport until they turn into equipment races.
Even O Class shooters have started building custom 10/22s with big clear open sights attached.
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Danny Creasy
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soonerfan85
Member
Really like the CZs . Maybe one of these days.
If your budget doesn't allow for a $400 rimfire but still want an accurate rifle, look for a Romanian M69. This was shot at 50yds in light rain with a $20 Tasco 4x scope using my range bag as a rest. Started with the middle target to sight in scope. Began 5 shot groups at upper right and moved clockwise. Tried the two small targets last using 3 shots. I'm not patient enough to get the best from the rifle.
The M69 definitely leaves a lot to be desired in the looks dept.
I have a NIB BRNO 611 that I've never shot. I think it's time to buy a CZ to shoot.
If your budget doesn't allow for a $400 rimfire but still want an accurate rifle, look for a Romanian M69. This was shot at 50yds in light rain with a $20 Tasco 4x scope using my range bag as a rest. Started with the middle target to sight in scope. Began 5 shot groups at upper right and moved clockwise. Tried the two small targets last using 3 shots. I'm not patient enough to get the best from the rifle.
The M69 definitely leaves a lot to be desired in the looks dept.
I have a NIB BRNO 611 that I've never shot. I think it's time to buy a CZ to shoot.
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Danny Creasy
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Could kick myself!
I remember seeing the Rominian Trainers at gun shows in the 90s selling for $39.95. I have yet to ever fire one. But, I have heard they are good bang for the buck.
Congratulations on the fine shooting.
I remember seeing the Rominian Trainers at gun shows in the 90s selling for $39.95. I have yet to ever fire one. But, I have heard they are good bang for the buck.
Congratulations on the fine shooting.
soonerfan85
Member
Sheffield, do you know if the CZ trainer was built to mimic, for lack of a better word, any particular military bolt action rifle ?
Wish My old eyes were still good enough to shoot open sights. Tri focals aren't very helpful on the range.
Even the M69s are selling for $125 to $150 now.
Wish My old eyes were still good enough to shoot open sights. Tri focals aren't very helpful on the range.
Even the M69s are selling for $125 to $150 now.
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