Swapping Cylinders For Reload?

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tpelle

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I see over and over on the net references to shooters "back in the day" carrying extra preloaded cylinders for their percussion revolvers, and swapping the cylinders out when a reload is required. However, in all of my fairly extensive reading (mainly centered around American Civil War, I will admit) I have NEVER read of any references to this actually being done.

I have also examined several books that are studies of the gunleather used during the period. Whereas there are detailed studies of saddle holsters of varying models, as well as numerous versions of ammo boxes and cap pouches and flap holsters and the accompanying belts and buckles, never once have I seen mentioned a spare cylinder pouch.

I have, however, read of soldiers, mainly cavalrymen and of those, mainly Confederates, who carried multiple loaded revolvers in to battle. It seems to have been common practice to perform what is today referred as a "New York Reload".

I admit that, if you had been armed with a Remington-Beals pattern revolver, then the ergonomics of swapping cylinders, a la "Pale Rider", just might have been feasible. But with a Colt open-top revolver, I think you would be juggling too many parts.

In either case, I think that the fine motor skills required to do a cylinder swap would have deteriorated too much in the excitement of battle to perform this successfully.

But in any event, I would like to research this matter. Can anyone point to an actual historical (first-person non-fictional) account of the cylinder-swap reload being performed?
 
Swapping cylinders takes a lot more time than grabbing another loaded revolver. I consider the practice internet myth brought on by the movie "Pale Rider"...which was a movie, after all, and if you look close, he was carrying cartridge cylinders, of course, for movie blanks.
 
looks cool on film when the bullets are flying, and our hero is calmly staying his course and swapping cylinders… me id want another pistol or two as has been stated way faster than a reload, and c'mon who doesnt look more intimidating and ready to go than a guy with multiple guns on him, (ie josie wales)
Gene
 
The only other place I have seen cylinders being swapped for a reload was in an episode of Bonanza, being done by Little Joe with a Colt 1860 (or possibly an 1861, I saw it quickly on TV a while ago and the two revolvers look very similar) while in a shootout.
 
When i first started shooting these black powder guns i shot my dads 1858s first. Since i was new and i hadnt messed with them a whole lot i wasnt really good with removing and replacing the cylinder. I some how got 2 of them mixed around and they both shot terrible. After going round and round with them i finally decided to swap the cylinders around and instantly they shot better.

Thats one main reason i havnt bought any extra cylinders is because i dont think they will shoot good in my guns. I think they have changed things so many times threw the years that i dont think year to year they are consistant enough to match up.

Maybe if you knew your gun was made the same years as the replacement cylinder or if you could check it out in your gun before you buy it then i might change my mind.
 
:D
MCgunner said:
Swapping cylinders takes a lot more time than grabbing another loaded revolver. I consider the practice internet myth brought on by the movie "Pale Rider"...which was a movie, after all, and if you look close, he was carrying cartridge cylinders, of course, for movie blanks.
Click to expand...
Dang, now I'm a mythical creature, cuz I can and have swapped cylinders on 1860 Army and 1858 Remmy's.

Always wanted to be up there with the like of Zeus and Apollo. You know, all powerful and good looking.
 
you will want to read "three years with Quantrill" Lots of good gun details. At one point the author tells of passing a house where he and his bushwacker friends had shot it out with union cavalry a few days before. A young lady flags him down and returns a cylinder that had been dropped in the road during the action.
 
40Rod has it right.

"3 Years with Quantrill" by John McCorkle is an excellent book on the western theater of the War of Southern Independence. "Gray Ghosts of the Confederacy" by Brownlee is another.

The border guerillas carried as many revolvers as they could and just swapped them as they ran empty. Some of them carried spare cylinders in their pockets, but I cannot conceive of a man in the middle of a firefight trying to swap out cylinders while trying to manage a terrified horse running at any kind of speed. I would expect the swaps occured after breaking contact with the enemy.

At that time the infantry were armed with single shot muzzleloaders, and the guerillas were cavalry armed with the equivalent of submachineguns. In close the advantage was all to the guerillas. The books talk about a few battles that occured in towns and the Union troops hold up in buildings gave better than they got.

I highly recommend those books.

Some other books worth attention are "Gone to Texas" and "The Vengance Trail of Josey Wales" by Forest Carter. They are fiction, but good fiction. Carter also wrote "Wait For Me On the Mountain" which is a biographical novel of Geronimo.
 
I remember reading an account and I can't find it anymore about I think Anderson's men one had a sack of revolvers the other spare cylinders and he used a long stick as a wedge to make it easy to pull out and put in
 
Howdy

Only a movie reference, but in the movie Gettysburg, Jeff Daniels plays Col. Joshua Chamberlain of the 20th Maine Regiment. While defending Little Round Top, on the second day of the battle he can be seen changing cylinders on his Colt 1860 Army. Just a movie, I know, I have not found any specific references to Chamberlain actually doing that.

The thing that strikes me about carrying extra cylinders is, why? I wonder if Colt was selling extra cylinders? If battlefield guns were being picked up from fallen infantrymen, it seems most logical that entire revolvers would be taken, not just cylinders. I have to question how available extra cylinders actually were at the time.
 
Driftwood Johnson said:
Howdy

Only a movie reference, but in the movie Gettysburg, Jeff Daniels plays Col. Joshua Chamberlain of the 20th Maine Regiment. While defending Little Round Top, on the second day of the battle he can be seen changing cylinders on his Colt 1860 Army. Just a movie, I know, I have not found any specific references to Chamberlain actually doing that.

The thing that strikes me about carrying extra cylinders is, why? I wonder if Colt was selling extra cylinders? If battlefield guns were being picked up from fallen infantrymen, it seems most logical that entire revolvers would be taken, not just cylinders. I have to question how available extra cylinders actually were at the time.
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kinda what i thought too, also would they even work properly from gun to gun, dont some of the modern repro's need minor fitting to work?
Gene
 
I think it was mostly hollywood also but it would have been possible

it would have been a lot harder back in the day but some fitting would have
all the cyls working fine.
 
I was in a Civil War Museum in Harrisburg PA last month. One thing I noticed is that there were several original presentation cases for revolvers and none had a spot for a spare cylinder. Two pistols, sure! But no spare cylinders.
 
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Any newbies here following this thread need to know that carrying a spare loaded and capped cylinder is a very bad idea. I've contemplated getting a spare cylinder just to extend my shooting time. Shoot the revolver until filthy, swab the barrel, clean the frame, put in the spare cylinder and keep shooting. I think that in history you were lucky just to be able to afford just a revolver, extra spare cylinders were probably not common.
 
Rom828 said:
Any newbies here following this thread need to know that carrying a spare loaded and capped cylinder is a very bad idea. I've contemplated getting a spare cylinder just to extend my shooting time. Shoot the revolver until filthy, swab the barrel, clean the frame, put in the spare cylinder and keep shooting. I think that in history you were lucky just to be able to afford just a revolver, extra spare cylinders were probably not common.
Click to expand...
That is a good point i am hesitant to remove a cylinder in my gun when i have caps on it. Last trip to the range i had a cap fall down and jam up the bolt so it had problems locking the cylinder up when fully cocked. I had to remove the cylinder and i went niiiice and slooooow. Made sure i didnt bump it ont he frame or the table
 
Big Al Mass said:
The only other place I have seen cylinders being swapped for a reload was in an episode of Bonanza, being done by Little Joe with a Colt 1860 (or possibly an 1861, I saw it quickly on TV a while ago and the two revolvers look very similar) while in a shootout.
Click to expand...
The scene where Little Joe swaps cylinders was from the first season, episode 5 titled "Enter Mark Twain" and it was a Navy Colt.
 
The only thing I've ever read about anyone swapping cylinders as reload was a character named Bass Outlaw.
He apparently carried a modified Colt 1873 that was set up to slip fire. The trigger and ejector rod were removed and the cylinder pin modified to allow it to be removed quickly to reload.

http://www.cartertown.com/Guns/BassOutlawColt.jpg
 
When your revolver is empty and you are still under fire, I would rather fool with a spare cylinder than a flask loose balls and capper.
even on a standing horse.
the tactics of mounted combat were to charge, fire until empty, then withdrw to a place to reload. I just cant see fumbling with powder and loading levers when a spare cylinder could be purchased, even if exceptionally expensive
 
Modernhoglegs
I`ve got the book Gone to Texas by Forrest Carter and borrowed the Vengance Trail of Josey Wales. I saw the movie first and thought it was great. Then I read Forrest Carter`s book and liked it a lot better ! A lot less bull***t than the movie, much more like the way things were then. Definitely worth anyone`s time to read both books!
 
I certainly have not gone through looking for any historical evidence one way or the other, but the question was posed as to why someone would want to.

When you are carrying quite a bit of weight, and you can choose another 1/2 lb or 3 lbs as a means to keep going, or 1 lb vs 6 lbs, which would you choose, especially when you need to be mobile?

I don't know that they did or didn't, but I can certainly see why now would rather carry several charged cylinders over several loaded pistols.
 
While not an ACW reference it is documented that Texas Rangers using Paterson belt revolvers did carry multiple revolvers with multiple spare charged and capped cylinders and used them in the heat of battle with the Comanche in the 1840s and 1850s, but not with Walkers since no spare cylinders were supplied for the Walkers issued during the Mexican War.
 
I think swapping cylinders was the idea behind some of the design of the 1858 Remington. Whether or not it turned out to be a viable option under fire is a different question. There are modern examples as well where the design looked good on paper, but in actual practise proved unworkable. The use of magazines instead of belt fed ammo in the M249 SAW comes to mind.

LD
 
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