.308 180gr question

conan32120

conan32120

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I'll start by saying I don't have a chrony so I'm working at a disadvantage. I shoot a 10 twist savage that has no problems shooting moa with 168gr bullets over 42gr of varget but it doesn't seem to do as well with 180s. I ran a ladder from 41 to 43 grains and never bettered 2.5 moa, also tried cfe223 as its a slower powder with similar results. I bought a box of Federal 175gr premium match bullets and they hit the paper out to 200 yds at sub moa. could my rifle be that sensative that 5 gr weight increase? Or should I try a heavier loading as hodgden calls for a max of 45gr varget?
 
conan32120 said:
I'll start by saying I don't have a chrony so I'm working at a disadvantage. I shoot a 10 twist savage that has no problems shooting moa with 168gr bullets over 42gr of varget but it doesn't seem to do as well with 180s. I ran a ladder from 41 to 43 grains and never bettered 2.5 moa, also tried cfe223 as its a slower powder with similar results. I bought a box of Federal 175gr premium match bullets and they hit the paper out to 200 yds at sub moa. could my rifle be that sensative that 5 gr weight increase? Or should I try a heavier loading as hodgden calls for a max of 45gr varget?
Click to expand...
It might not be weight, just that bullet. Swap powder and see if that helps. Some combinations just don't jive.
 
Like AJC1 said, your rifle just might not like that particular bullet, or that bullet/powder combo.

The length of that 180 may be the issue, but so could the bullet itself. The Federal ammo uses the 175 gr sierra MK which is as long as many 180gr bullets.
 
conan32120 said:
I'll start by saying I don't have a chrony so I'm working at a disadvantage. I shoot a 10 twist savage that has no problems shooting moa with 168gr bullets over 42gr of varget but it doesn't seem to do as well with 180s. I ran a ladder from 41 to 43 grains and never bettered 2.5 moa, also tried cfe223 as its a slower powder with similar results. I bought a box of Federal 175gr premium match bullets and they hit the paper out to 200 yds at sub moa. could my rifle be that sensative that 5 gr weight increase? Or should I try a heavier loading as hodgden calls for a max of 45gr varget?
Click to expand...
Work up a little higher, I have some combinations that like starting to middle loads, others? Max load is the only thing that groups great, first time I dealt with one, I was getting Shotgun pattern groupings, then in the last 1.5 gr, things started to tighten up nicely, with the last .5 giving me a "wow" moment. Only way to REALLY know what your rifle likes is to try a FULL work up, I'd go 43.4, 43.8, 44.2, 44.6, 44.8-45. Watch for the pressure signs. Also playing with COAL wouldn't hurt...
 
It's the bullet length that the rifle is sensitive to ... the 180 gr.bullet is too long and not being stabilized by the 1-10 twist rate of your rifle barrel therefore your accuracy is lacking .
Notice how the shorter 168 gr. and 175 gr. bullets perform better .
You have found a good powder with Varget , now just test a few bullets and and find one that likes your barrels 1 - 10 twist ... if you look at Premium Match Bullets , less than 180 gr. , Boat Tail Hollow Point design (like the Hornady 165 gr. SST ) that should be just the ticket .
Sounds like the Federal Premium Match - 175 gr. ..."sub moa at 200 yards " might be just the ticket .
But notice how the lighter 175 gr. Federal bullets have a shorter bearing surface than the 180 gr. bullets and notice how they shoot so much better !
Gary
 
. the 180 gr.bullet is too long and not being stabilized by the 1-10 twist rate of your rifle barrel therefore your accuracy is lacking .
Click to expand...

A 10 twist barrel is plenty fast for 180 gr bullets. It will stabilize 200 gr bullets. The 30-06 was initially designed for 220 gr bullets with a 10 twist. Most 308's had12 twists until just a few years ago for lighter 150 gr bullets in mind. But most manufacturers have switched to 10 twist barrels to shoot heavier bullets on newer rifles. A few compromise with 11 twists.

I've had great results with 178 gr Hornady ELD-X's and 180 gr SST's in my 308's. I have 3 rifles, with 10,11, and 12 twists. Even the 12 twist shoots great at that weight. I have only done little work with 200 gr bullets, but know of some guys who have had good luck with them.

I use a near max load of Varget.
 
gwpercle said:
It's the bullet length that the rifle is sensitive to ... the 180 gr.bullet is too long and not being stabilized by the 1-10 twist rate of your rifle barrel therefore your accuracy is lacking .
Notice how the shorter 168 gr. and 175 gr. bullets perform better .
You have found a good powder with Varget , now just test a few bullets and and find one that likes your barrels 1 - 10 twist ... if you look at Premium Match Bullets , less than 180 gr. , Boat Tail Hollow Point design (like the Hornady 165 gr. SST ) that should be just the ticket .
Sounds like the Federal Premium Match - 175 gr. ..."sub moa at 200 yards " might be just the ticket .
But notice how the lighter 175 gr. Federal bullets have a shorter bearing surface than the 180 gr. bullets and notice how they shoot so much better !
Gary
Click to expand...
The less bearing surface of the 175 (and length of the 175 smk) disproves that the twist isn't fast enough for a 180.... just saying.... you could likely get a good 180 flat base to shoot better than an smk because of said bearing surface and length if the twist was truly an issue.
 
I wouldn't expect the 180 interlocks to have the accuracy potential of the match bullets you are comparing them to, but they should shoot better than 2 1/2". Keep looking for the right combination and you'll eventually find one.
 
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