.357 mag rifle loads

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Just ordered a Henry Single shot in this caliber. It's use will be as a general camp gun to introduce youth/new shooters to firing a centerfire rifle as well as general target shooting, possibly deer hunting by aforementioned youth hunters or myself if I feel up for a challenge. Rifle may also be pressed into emergency service for black bear use, but this scenario is unlikely as a .30-06 and 12GA also live at the cabin.

I've got a good idea on the plinking/general use loads, but looking for something optimized for deer hunting to 75 yards or so in a rifle. Currently running a Nosler 158HP over max load of H110 in my 6" M66. No doubt this would work, but looking for something more interesting to sling through this longer rifle barrel. I stock H110 and IMR 4227, but would consider adding another niche powder for use in this rifle.

On a related note, anybody know if this rifle can safely be re-chambered to .357 max?
 
There is no doubt that H110/W296 will give you max velocity, but it wouldn't hurt to try some of that IMR4227 you have... it's not quite the rip-snort the others will give you, but is an excellent powder in straight-wall cartridges through rifle barrels. It's what I use in my .41 MAG loads for my 1894... even over H110.
 
Longshot with the Sierra soft point 158 grain bullet. Gotta watch out for barrel heat up, but this combination has resulted in screaming velocities and the bullet is known as a stoutly constructed one. In my 24 inch Rossi I found several accurate loads, but never pursued it further as it isn't legal for deer in my state.
 
Same load that shoots well in my 6" revolver shoots even better in my rifle. I like AA#9 powder and 158 gr Hornady XTP's both HP and XTP 158 gr. Flat Point FP. The `158 XTP-HP is recommended from 700-1400 fps while the XTP-FP is rated from 1200-1800 fps. Both the HP and FP shoots the same with the same data. The Flat Point XTP may be better for bear? The Hornady XTP's are my most accurate loads tested. Accurate Arms data available on-line.
 
Longshot with the Sierra soft point 158 grain bullet. Gotta watch out for barrel heat up, but this combination has resulted in screaming velocities and the bullet is known as a stoutly constructed one. In my 24 inch Rossi I found several accurate loads, but never pursued it further as it isn't legal for deer in my state.
What sort of velocities were you getting? Longshot would be useful for me, as I also occasionally use it for 12ga field loads.
 
I use 13.5gr of H110 with 180gr HiTek Coated Lead bullet (for hogs) and get around 1350 fps out of my 83/8" Model 686 and 16.5gr with a JHP usually Speer of Hornady (for deer) and get around 1500fps IIRM. I also shoot the same loads out of my Rossi .357 Lever Action. I have not chronographed the loads out of the rifle since someone stole my chronograph. But I can't imagine you would need anything more than this load as long as it shoot accurately. Fortunately for me both loads shoot extremely well out of my Model 686 and the Rossi. I limit my handgun shooting to 50 yards on live targets and 75-80 for my rifle and they perform great. At 75 yards with the Rossi, the 158 JHP will do everything you want it to do on a deer. You might be able to get a few more fps using other powders, but to get much more, then you are going to start pushing pressures.
 
What sort of velocities were you getting? Longshot would be useful for me, as I also occasionally use it for 12ga field loads.

I did not have a chrony, but there are articles/posts out there where people got crazy velocities (like 2000 FPS) with rifles using high end charges. I have some longshot kicking around, but other than some test loads it isn't something I load or shoot. If I want to shoot 357 mag I usually use 13.5 to 14 grains of 2400. Mostly, I shoot 38 special and 38+P out of my 357s. On a muzzleloader hunt for elk and deer this Fall I will likely be packing the 357 revolver as a sidearm in case things get sideways with a large animal, but not sure just yet whether I will load it with commercial hard cast bear loads or a few speer jsps with a stiff dose of longshot/
 
Generally, I find that the load that produces the highest velocity in a handgun also produces the highest velocity in a rifle (18.5" Marlin 1894C 357 Mag).

I've been happy with W296/H110. My past experience with IMR4227 has not been good, lower velocity and lots of unburned powder. But, i have not experimented with IMR4227 in 30 years or so. Similarly with Alliant 2400.

With other powders, Accurate #9 might work well but I have not worked with it at all.

I've played a little with Lil Gun in .410 bore shotgun and 357 Mag loads a number of years ago. It did not set my life on fire at the time.
 
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I've been happy with W296/H110. My past experience with IMR4227 has not been good, lower velocity and lots of unburned powder. But, i have not experimented with IMR4227 in 30 years or so. Similarly with Alliant 2400.

Originally, I didn't like IMR4227... in my revolvers. I had bought 2# of it during the Great Powder Shortage, just to have something, and after initial testing I thought I was stuck with another orphan powder. I decided to just load it all up in some .41's I was loading for a long-distance steel shoot I was going to... what better way to burn it up, right? What I found was it performed very, very well in my 20" .41 Marlin. Yes, it doesn't turn in the velocity numbers W296/H110 does, but it doesn't have all that blast, either, and at the end of the day it worked very well... for me, anyway. Same load, fired through my 4" S&W .41, also did well (I was hitting the 500yd dinger 6 for 6...) but it was not as clean burning in the shorter pistol barrel (something I also checked in the .45 Colt.) I consider IMR4227 the 'Unique' of 'pistol cartridges in rifle barrels...' if that makes sense.

Oddly enough, I tried 2400 many years ago and it left me unimpressed as well. I recently bought 2# of it... mostly to try against IMR4227 in the .41 Marlin, but also to experiment with in reduced loads in the .45-70.
 
For Deer in the carbine I would load a 158gr JSP bullet over a stiff charge of W296/H110. You will like a JSP bullet better than a HP bullet on game.

Lil'Gun will deliver higher velocites than other powders but at a cost. It also generates more heat so if you use it great it like every other rifle and let the barrel cool after a few shots.

I did send a bunch of bullets over the chrono shot from the Marlin Levergun. It seems Lil'Gun adds ~100 fps to each load.
Here are the numbers: (you will be surprised!)

Using a 180gr Hornady XTP bullet:
15.0gr Lil'Gun - CCI-550 primer - AV=1584 fps
13.6gr W296 - CCI-550 primer - AV=1495 fps

Using a Cast Performance 180gr WFNGC bullet: (Hard Cast)
14.8gr Lil'Gun - CCI-550 primer - AV=1657 fps
13.7gr H110 - CCI-550 primer - AV=1547 fps

I also tried a 170gr Sierra JHC bullet and liked the results.
17.0gr Lil'Gun - CCI-550 primer - AV=1793 fps (that's amazing velocity!)
15.5gr H110 - CCI-550 primer - AV=1699 fps (actually this is amazing too)

Just to add some info for a 125gr Hornady XTP/HP bullet even though I didn't use Lil'Gun, the velocities were scary!
17.7gr 2400 - Win WSP primer - AV=2055 fps
22.0gr H110 - CCI-550 primer - AV=2239 fps
 
I use 13.5gr of H110 with 180gr HiTek Coated Lead bullet (for hogs) and get around 1350 fps out of my 83/8" Model 686 and 16.5gr with a JHP usually Speer of Hornady (for deer) and get around 1500fps IIRM. I also shoot the same loads out of my Rossi .357 Lever Action. I have not chronographed the loads out of the rifle since someone stole my chronograph. But I can't imagine you would need anything more than this load as long as it shoot accurately. Fortunately for me both loads shoot extremely well out of my Model 686 and the Rossi. I limit my handgun shooting to 50 yards on live targets and 75-80 for my rifle and they perform great. At 75 yards with the Rossi, the 158 JHP will do everything you want it to do on a deer. You might be able to get a few more fps using other powders, but to get much more, then you are going to start pushing pressures.
I run the same load you do.
 
In a carbine lil gun gives a nice boost. I use it with 180's.
If Lil'Gun is used, make sure to work up w/ a chronograph -- not blind.

I like Lil'Gun a lot in the 30 Carbine, but it spikes fast once it reaches the inflection point in the curve . . , FAST.
 
For Deer in the carbine I would load a 158gr JSP bullet over a stiff charge of W296/H110. You will like a JSP bullet better than a HP bullet on game.

Yep....me too. As has been said, H110/W296 is probably going to be your best bet. While Lil' Gun may give you a tad more velocity, the not being able to use the same ammo in your revolvers, makes it a red haired step child. While I likes me some IMR4227 in my .44 mag rifles/carbines, there is just not enough room in a .357 case to make good use of it.
 
Originally, I didn't like IMR4227... in my revolvers. I had bought 2# of it during the Great Powder Shortage, just to have something, and after initial testing I thought I was stuck with another orphan powder. I decided to just load it all up in some .41's I was loading for a long-distance steel shoot I was going to... what better way to burn it up, right? What I found was it performed very, very well in my 20" .41 Marlin. Yes, it doesn't turn in the velocity numbers W296/H110 does, but it doesn't have all that blast, either, and at the end of the day it worked very well... for me, anyway. Same load, fired through my 4" S&W .41, also did well (I was hitting the 500yd dinger 6 for 6...) but it was not as clean burning in the shorter pistol barrel (something I also checked in the .45 Colt.) I consider IMR4227 the 'Unique' of 'pistol cartridges in rifle barrels...' if that makes sense.

Oddly enough, I tried 2400 many years ago and it left me unimpressed as well. I recently bought 2# of it... mostly to try against IMR4227 in the .41 Marlin, but also to experiment with in reduced loads in the .45-70.

I've found with 4227 that while it "works" at lower pressures, if you crank it up to around max and put a good firm crimp on it you get excellent accuracy and it's pretty clean. Still smells funky though.

It's my go-to powder for 44mag. Another 100fps won't make or break me at those power levels, I'd rather have the accuracy. My Rossi 92 will chew a ragged hole at 50yrds with either 240gr XTP's or LSWC and has plenty of punch for large whitetail.

In 357mag, I might trade off a little accuracy for some extra speed.
 
Thanks for the replies folks. Once I get the rifle, I think I'll try Hornady 158 SPxtp, Speer 158 SP, Nosler 158 that I still have in stock over H110 as hunting candidates, and also Missouri 180 WFN and Penn 158TC hard cast over the 4227 and HS-6 to see what they do. Will probably run some various cast bullets I have about over HP38 and/or Unique, likely in .38 cases for target plinking. Will try to post some results once I get the rifle in my hands and some time.
 
I've worked up two loads in my 18.5" Marlin using the Remington 158 grain JSP The first was with 2400. At the max charge of 14.9 grains i reached 1690 FPS.

I next tried 300MP with the same bullet. With 18.3 grains (.3 grains under Alliants max) I was getting 1890 FPS with no signs of excessive pressure.
 
I've worked up two loads in my 18.5" Marlin using the Remington 158 grain JSP The first was with 2400. At the max charge of 14.9 grains i reached 1690 FPS.

I next tried 300MP with the same bullet. With 18.3 grains (.3 grains under Alliants max) I was getting 1890 FPS with no signs of excessive pressure.
You didn't tell us about accuracy for each.
 
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