357 rifle load

[JRWhit]

Not to put the cart before the horse,but I'm soon to come in to a Win lever in 357 mag. I've done quite a bit of loading for 357 but only in a 6" pistol. I have a couple hundred 140 gn FTX bullets that I've been needing to put to use. Now I just have a couple hundred questions.
1: Is there generally enough freebore in a rifle to load the FTX bullets without case trimming?
2: What powder will best take advantage of the longer barrel? 4227?
3: How stout are these rifles? I have some stout 296 win loads in 125gn but would be hesitant to try and add barrel length with them.
4: Would it be safe to assume that anything stout in a GP100 would likely be over pressure in the rifle?
5: Anything that I haven't asked that I should know?

On the rifle What I know is that it is a post 64 and most likely a 94. If it turns out to be a 92 I'll be a gitty little school girl but I doubt it. I don't yet know if it is a side receiver safety or a tang safety.

 

[JRWhit]

Just got a confirmation that it is a 94 and the good news is that it is a tang safety . Now just to find if it's US or Japanese.

 

[Reloadron]

Using for example a 158 grain JHP bullet the powders which should yield the faster velocities would be powders like Win 296 and H 110. Actually IMR 4227 may get you 1500 FPS give or take. You may get more with the longer 22" barrel over for example a 16" barrel. For the 140 grain FTX I would look to AA #9 or Enforcer looking at the Hornady 9th Edition. Really depends on what you want. My experience with the 357 lever guns is limited. Anyway, best of luck and enjoy the new rifle.

Ron

 

[ReloaderFred]

Your fun shooting is about to start. Between my wife and I, we own half a dozen .357 Magnum leveraction rifles, all Marlins, though. We shoot mostly .38's through our rifles, but I have some good stout loads for them, too.

Several manuals have rifle loads listed for .357 Magnum rifles, but any load you shoot through a revolver will go through your rifle. Powders that really take advantage of the longer barrel are Win. 296/H-110, Accurate #9 and Hodgdon Lil'Gun. I've got a load for my 18.5" Marlin that averages 1,710 fps with a 185 gr. cast bullet with a gas check, using Lil'Gun. You can shoot everything from mild to wild through the rifle, with one caveat. Make sure it's got enough velocity to clear the barrel. I've heard of some who have stuck a really mild .38 Spl. WC load in the barrel, and you want to avoid that.

Some leveraction rifles are sensitive to bullet shape, and won't feed SWC bullets. Some of mine will, and some won't. I'd stick with RNFP, FP and HP bullets for smooth feeding.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[Shaq]

I would consider any max load for a handgun to be max for a rifle. The only caution is with light loads. The bullet has to clear a much-longer barrel, so it's not a good idea to use light target loads in a rifle.

 

[ColtPythonElite]

I use 125 gr Montana Gold JHP and 10 gr of Power Pistol. It clocks 1800 fps out of my 16" rifle and is very accurate.

 

[redbullitt]

As long as you have a bullet profile and cartridge length your rifle likes you will be golden. Id start at normal lengths and go from there! I doubt you will have a problem with that pointy bullet. Usually the big flat noses are what make my lever actions choke up without some length tweaking. I have not personally used the 357 ftx, but I do like the 45-70 version. With it I do have to trim the brass to hit the crimp right, but I am not sure you will have to worry about that on the 357. Recoil will be mild enough that a good crimp might be enough without being in the perfect spot.

I like lil gun and h110 and similar powders for this application. Unique and 2400 work well too if you are going lighter on the power. 357 really likes the carbine barrel, so you can get some great velocity without working too hard.

As far as interchangeable ammo, I have not had an issue. Everything I have run through the revolvers (the only caveat being big WFN bullets and wadcutters) does just fine in the bolt and lever action 357 here. Sometimes there are sizing differences needed with cast bullets of course.

The 357 carbine is probably my favorite rifle to shoot. You will have a hoot with it!

 

[rg1]

The reason for the shorter cases is because of the long ogive of the FTX bullets. What I'd do is load 25-50 shortened cases to Hornady's recommended trim length. Shoot them and reload some more FTX bullets until you run out of them and not buy any more. My favorite load is Hornady's 158 gr. XTP HP and also the XTP flat point. The XTP flat point bullet is supposed to perform better at higher rifle velocity. I shoot the same exact load in a 6" revolver and my Marlin rifle. Both are extremely accurate with Hornady 158 XTP's with Accurate Arms #9 powder at 13.0 grains. I use CCI 500 standard primers with the AA#9 powder which is the data in AA's # 1 manual. The 2nd edition uses CCI magnum primers. I can see the FTX bullets having better ballistics in some calibers but don't see the need in .357 Magnum. Loads safe in your pistol should also be safe in your rifle. I like loading the same for each so there's no issues trying to keep your loads separated.

 

[Wildfire]

+1 for rg1. I also use AA#9. Works....
The 1892 rifles are considered the strongest actions. Marlins and Winchester 94s run just behind the 92s. The 92s can be a tad on the crazy side with what they can handle. AA#9 @ 12.0 gave us an average of 1498 fps. from an 18" barreled bolt action Ruger. The bullet was a 158 hard cast Swc. Standard CCI500 primers. Recoil is low.
Rem, factory .38 special +P 125s ran 1247 fps from the same 18" barrel. {very accurate}.
I do not load too hot because we use different hand guns with the same ammo.

 

[GooseGestapo]

I used the Hornady 158gr XTP over 17.8gr of Hodgdon Lil'Gun in my 20"bbl M94.
It got 2,050fps. Killed deer well. Sold rifle due to poor heat treating of case feed pawl allowing it to distort and prevent proper feeding from magazine creating jam.

 

[Sunray]

There's jacketed and cast rifle data(18.5" barrel) on Hodgdon's site. Data's pretty much the same as revolver data(10" barrel for some daft reason). No IMR4227 rifle data except for a jacketed 158 or 125 though. No hand gun data for anything but a jacketed 140 either.

 

[buck460XVR]

Not to put the cart before the horse,but I'm soon to come in to a Win lever in 357 mag. I've done quite a bit of loading for 357 but only in a 6" pistol. I have a couple hundred 140 gn FTX bullets that I've been needing to put to use. Now I just have a couple hundred questions.
1: Is there generally enough freebore in a rifle to load the FTX bullets without case trimming?
2: What powder will best take advantage of the longer barrel? 4227?
3: How stout are these rifles? I have some stout 296 win loads in 125gn but would be hesitant to try and add barrel length with them.
4: Would it be safe to assume that anything stout in a GP100 would likely be over pressure in the rifle?
5: Anything that I haven't asked that I should know?

1: I'd be more concerned with the gun being able to feed those longer bullets thru the action than whether they will fit in the chamber. The little pointy red tip will not contact the rifling anyway when chambered and that's what makes the bullets long.
2: Any powder that works well in revolver loads will also work well in the carbine. IMR4227 does work well in .357 carbines. Much better than it perform in revolvers. While I don't use Lil' Gun in any of my revolvers anymore, it too works well in carbines. Be warned tho, if you shoot in long sessions the gun may become too hot to handle.
3: Any published load that falls within SAAMI specs will be safe. Period.
4: No, refer to the above statement.
5: While many times loads that work well in your revolvers will also work well in your carbine, like any other firearm, you won't know till you try. Jacketed bullets, being the most forgiving, generally make the transition from revolver just fine. Whenever I load mouse fart type plinking loads for my carbines, especially with jacketed bullets, I stick with a recipe/load that produces over 850 fps from my revolvers. This guarantees me the bullet will make it out of the barrel.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I don't have a Winchester but I do have a Marlin levergun in .357 Magnum.

I have found the highest velocities are generated by Lil'Gun front the longer barrel. I won't use it in my revolvers but I will in the Carbine.

As to your strength question, if it's chambered in .357 Mag it is safe to shoot any load that is within SAAMI pressure limits.

 

[RecoilRob]

Agree that bullet selection first priority is 'will it feed it'? My Rossi 92 is a bit fussy about COAL and bullet shape as to what will feed or not. Slower powders than 296 or 2400 aren't likely to offer any benefit because a full charge of these pretty much fills a 357 case to the bullet base, so slower powders will probably run out of case room before offering you anything downrange. I once loaded some 357's (158 JHP Winchester) with 4831 just to see what would happen, and the bullets barely left a 6" barrel with just a light 'pop' and all of the powder sprayed on the floor. That's an extreme case of using the wrong powder, but if you stick with published loads you'll do fine with the rifle in 357.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Agree that bullet selection first priority is 'will it feed it'? My Rossi 92 is a bit fussy about COAL and bullet shape as to what will feed or not. Slower powders than 296 or 2400 aren't likely to offer any benefit because a full charge of these pretty much fills a 357 case to the bullet base, so slower powders will probably run out of case room before offering you anything downrange. I once loaded some 357's (158 JHP Winchester) with 4831 just to see what would happen, and the bullets barely left a 6" barrel with just a light 'pop' and all of the powder sprayed on the floor. That's an extreme case of using the wrong powder, but if you stick with published loads you'll do fine with the rifle in 357.

I would wager the primer pushed the bullet and the powder never even lit.

 

[DWFan]

Some of these rifles (I'm talking the 94 here) have chambers long enough to accept the .360 Dan Wesson loaded with the 180gr Hornady XTP seated to the lower cannelure (1.830" OAL). The action must be tweaked a bit to get them to feed but you can single load them.
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/Trapper.html
With that setup, you can use almost 20gr of H110 to reach near .357 Maximum velocities.

 

[JRWhit]

thanks for all the info guys. It's great knowing that anything the revolver digests will work in the rifle.

 

[Wildfire]

The history of the 1894 is at times rather confusing. Dates bounce around and places do also. But, that "tang safety" sort of gives it away. Many called it the Lawyer safety.
It was installed to allow for international shipping.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winchester_Model_1894
Who knows exactly what the correct history is. It can be traced by serial numbers.
Have fun with it.

 

[CJ8281]

You might be interested in Alliant's 300-MP powder. The load they list is 18.8 gr with a 158 gr Gold Dot HP, test barrel is 10 inch and they report 1.686 fps. I have shot Hornady's 158s with 18 gr in a Ruger Security Six and a Marlin 1894 and they are fun in both. I wish I had a chronograph just to see what the velocities are.