38 Special vs 357 Magnum - Snub Nose

357 Magnum or 38 Special +P From a Snub Nose?

  • 357 Magnum

    Votes: 48 28.9%

  • 38 Special +P

    Votes: 118 71.1%
  • Total voters
    166
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SteadyD said:
I could be mistaken, but I have been under the impression that the HST bullets have been tested through various barriers, such as drywall, auto glass, etc... and that they have performed well.
Click to expand...

You're not mistaken in the least, the 9mm/1100fps thing with the hst ammo held it's own in barrier tests. The 38spl p+ 130gr hst mico ammo that came out in 2017 isn't going to do much against barriers with it's huge hp, soft alloy core & impressive +/- 825fps out of snubnosed revolvers.

That 130gr bullet just doesn't have the mass, velocity in short bbl.'s nor is designed for penetrating barriers.
 
The HST, and others, perform very well against people, but people are soft, most game is much tougher, and some a great deal tougher.

If you need to penetrate barriers to put down a bad guy, the best bullet (IMHO) is one that doesn't expand much, if at all, but LE has to worry about over penetration and rounds scurrying down the street putting others at risk. So do people defending themselves to a point.

Game animals is a totally different subject where you need tough bullets that can perform as needed in the game being hunted, and that means soft expanding bullets to bullets which do not expand at all and run straight and true in a game animal.

We are not doing a good job of keeping different needs from bullets clear here. IMHO of course.
 
Eddietruett said:
I've actually found the Golden Saber +P .38 round to perform better than the .357 Mag version in a short barrel. They are actually 2 different design bullets. I got curious about performance after reading the difference in the lucky gunner testing. You can buy Golden Saber bullets as components to "roll your own" and they come both for .38 and .357 and there is a difference.
Click to expand...

357 mag top , 38spl bottom
Golden Saber in both 38spl +P & 357 Mag
Both perform well out of a 2 inch barrel Im sure the 38 load has alot less , fuss
I like the added Pentration of the 357 mag round ...
image.jpeg image.jpeg
 
The 2 1/2" 686 is the lightest thing I want to shoot full power .357 Mag in, but I don't want a .357 Mag for self defense period, and especially in a short barreled gun, and doubly so in a lightweight one. Too loud, too much flash, too much recoil. The .38 Spl is more than up to the task. Or the .44 Spl, low pressure, not a lot of flash and blast, will bore straight through with hard large meplat cast bullets, or dump a lot of energy in the target with the good self defense JHPs we have these days.
 
I shot a bunch of H110 loads out of my 3” 686+ on Sunday.

I don’t imagine them being a ton of fun from anything smaller.
 
I had a Kimber K6s, but not for long, less then a month. The blast with 357 was way too much and for me, shooting 38 spl out of it made no sense when I can carry a S&W ultralite.
 
Interesting commentary going here. I'd like to throw an additional .02 into the fray. I primarily own and carry only .357 revolvers. I started it all out with a 6" Security Six which was (is) used as a sidearm when hunting. It sees a diet of .357 JHP 158 grain and .38 Special JHP +P 125 grain. I also own an SP101 DAO in .357 and an LCR .357 that have never seen anything stronger than .38 Special +P's. I don't ever intend on shooting a .357 round thru them...but like the fact that "I can" if I should so desire. The heavier frame, especially on the LCR, aids in absorbing recoil. I practice with Remington .38 Special +P JHP 125 grain and can shoot over 100+ rounds and my hand feels no worse for the wear.

All that being said....my primary reason for the .357 was to standardize. I also like the fact that a .357 is a little heavier and stouter in areas of the frame that will handle the higher pressures of that round.

My LCR .357 is my EDC. Because of its short 1-7/8" barrel I choose to carry ARX 77 grain round that delivers a mean velocity of 1050 FPS and provides penetration well within the FBI protocol while opening up a wound channel similar to the heavier lead hollow point ammo. Those numbers can be documented HERE. This ammo was designed with the shorter barrel guns in mind. I like that I can shoot a lower recoil round thru this short barreled gun and get faster follow up shots on target.
 
My most concealable handgun is a five shot 357 Magnum snub revolver. I practice with 38 Special target loads & before going home I fire five or ten rounds DA into the 15 yard target w/357 Mag (125 grain JHP) factory ammo. The recoil w/357 Mag ammo is not an issue for me but the muzzle blast generated by the small revolver is enormous. When I carry for protection I use 375 Mag figuring muzzle blast will be the least of my problems but I believe that +P 38 Special is an adequate fight stopper with well placed shots & definitely much more comfortable to shoot than the 357 Mag. .
 
My shooting buddy was fascinated with .357 in the smaller frame revolvers including the lcr. After a bit of that he rethought that scenario. Sore hand, too much blast and flash. Yes it's possible to carry these, but really .38 +p is plenty out of these lighter guns. On a side note we have a sp101 in .327, girlfriends gun. After touching off one round to demonstrate the blast of full power 327 she now uses 32 h&r or 32 sw long.
 
Generally speaking, I load 357 Magnum cartridges with 158 gran SWC to about 950-1000 fps from a four inch barrel. These are comfortable to shoot in my 3" S&W Model 60 and I'd feel adequately protected shooting them.

These hand loads would probably be uncomfortable to shoot in a light weight framed J-frame revolver.

I leave full power 357 Magnum ammunition to full size, 4" plus barreled revolvers. But that is just me.
 
Duke Venturino tackles the magnum issue in the August 2019 Guns magazine: "Magnums? No Thanks!" Here's a noteworthy comment: "Finally, there is a Smith Wesson Model 360 357 Magnum with 1.8" barrel but it's a lousy excuse for a 357 Magnum. Firing full charge loads in it is almost a crippling affair. I only feed it 38 Specials now and it travels most everywhere I go because it only weighs about 11 oz.".
 
WheelGunMan said:
Interesting commentary going here. I'd like to throw an additional .02 into the fray. I primarily own and carry only .357 revolvers. I started it all out with a 6" Security Six which was (is) used as a sidearm when hunting. It sees a diet of .357 JHP 158 grain and .38 Special JHP +P 125 grain. I also own an SP101 DAO in .357 and an LCR .357 that have never seen anything stronger than .38 Special +P's. I don't ever intend on shooting a .357 round thru them...but like the fact that "I can" if I should so desire. The heavier frame, especially on the LCR, aids in absorbing recoil. I practice with Remington .38 Special +P JHP 125 grain and can shoot over 100+ rounds and my hand feels no worse for the wear.

All that being said....my primary reason for the .357 was to standardize. I also like the fact that a .357 is a little heavier and stouter in areas of the frame that will handle the higher pressures of that round.

My LCR .357 is my EDC. Because of its short 1-7/8" barrel I choose to carry ARX 77 grain round that delivers a mean velocity of 1050 FPS and provides penetration well within the FBI protocol while opening up a wound channel similar to the heavier lead hollow point ammo. Those numbers can be documented HERE. This ammo was designed with the shorter barrel guns in mind. I like that I can shoot a lower recoil round thru this short barreled gun and get faster follow up shots on target.
Click to expand...
This ARX 77gr .38 Spl is exactly what I carry in a SW 649 (20oz) It has my seal of approval! It’s a very accurate and soft shooting round. I really believe it is the best answer to the 11oz revolver problem.

They were a hoot to shoot out of this guy. 9589F81B-7AFA-4799-AE51-C458220EA189.jpeg
 
ancientnoob said:
This ARX 77gr .38 Spl is exactly what I carry in a SW 649 (20oz) It has my seal of approval! It’s a very accurate and soft shooting round. I really believe it is the best answer to the 11oz revolver problem.

They were a hoot to shoot out of this guy. View attachment 845277
Click to expand...

My LCR weighs in at 17 oz...so shooting the ARX round is ideal for me. I see a S&W in my future after looking at some of your collection.
 
For years I was a diehard .357 Magnum fan, and that was all I would carry. I could not understand why anyone would carry/shoot any 38 special ammo when the .357 Magnum was there. Well I've finally turned 70 and I now understand why so many load there short .357 Magnum revolvers with something other than full tilt Magnum ammo. Now days it's six (6) rounds of 38 Special+P ammo.
In addition to being easier on my hands and forearms when shooting 38 special ammo, my flinch has all but gone away.
 
Building on Buckeye63’s comment re Golden Saber .357s. There are other medium power .357s that are certainly manageable in small(ish) .357s like an SP101 or model 640, or the K6: Data from Lucky Gunner fired from a 2 inch K6 shows:

Speer 135 .357
1069 fps
13.0" pen
.55" exp


Remington GS 125 357
1096 fps
18.7" pen
.62" exp


Winchester 125 PDX1 Defender
1100 fps
13.9" pen
.63" exp
 
Last edited:
I went with .38 Special +P, but I do have revolvers that handle .357 Magnum quite well.

I never use .357 for home defense, I already have hearing loss.
Also, the fireball would be bad on the eyes in a fairly darkened room.
My S&W M60, at 3" and 25 oz, is probably the minimum for shooting .357 with.

In Black Bear country, at least .357 Magnum.
Brown Bear, calls for .44 Magnum.
 
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