444 w/ 300gr Sierra's question.

[BigBore44]

So twice a year a make a trip up to Sierra and Starline in Sedalia MO. Always buy about 25-30 lbs of seconds. Last trip I bought a couple pounds of their 300gr .429 Sportmasters. Thought I would try them out in my 444.

Problem: The bullets can't be seated to the cannelure because the factory case is to long. And their new catalog clearly states "Not for 444 Marlin". I called them today and they said it's for that exact reason.

So I just loaded 20 of them ahead of the cannelure to give me an OAL of 2.530-2.535. With 39gr of H4198 I got (IMO) stellar accuracy. 1.25" 3 shot groups. Tried 40 and 41gr and the spread went out to 2.5 and 2.85" at 100 yards. So I've stuck with 39.

So today I was bored and thought I'd see about trimming a few cases so I could seat to the cannelure and still maintain the proper OAL. As a side note: Between my 5 manuals, I see an OAL of 2.505-2.570. Figure I've got plenty of wiggle room. So I grabbed a new case, bullet, and dial calipers. My new brass is 2.215" which when paired with that bullet seated at the cannelure gives me an OAL of 2.675. Obviously this won't work as max OAL is 2.570". It actually chambers in my 444S just fine. But it won't eject. The lead tip hangs on the rim of my chamber when the ejector spring tries to kick the cartridge out. So to the trimmer I go. I trimmed the new case to 2.075" and adjusted my seating die to seat to the middle of the cannelure. This gave me my desired OAL of 2.535".

Now here's my question....

With the new OAL being the same as my original, just trimming the case as to seat at the cannelure, I can't see a reason why this won't work. I'm not increasing or decreasing the OAL or the space inside the cartridge. I've thought about it for a good hour. I've measured and remeasured and measured again. I've checked, rechecked, and triple checked my numbers and calculations. Can anyone come up with a reason why this won't work? I know I'll have to shoot it to see if accuracy is the same. But I'm a "by the manual" kind of guy and don't want a catastrophic failure because there was something I didn't think of.... I will include a picture of the original loading next to one of my newly made potential disasters.

 

[1stmarine]

hi,
the 444 headsapces at the rim so no worries there.
What you have to make sure is that there is enouhg fo the bullet engaged in the freebore to be properly centered. Accuracy should not suffer too much even
with a longer jump. It is not like you are shooting long bullets with small bearing surface like long range.

 

[the Black Spot]

Should work.

39 gr of 4198 behind a 300 gr xtp gave me 1" groups at 100 yds. Crimp in top cannelure. Pretty devastating load for smaller type deer though.

 

[the Black Spot]

Let us know how they work please.

 

[BigBore44]

Let us know how they work please.

 

[BigBore44]

Sorry guys. Had a malfunction with this site. Wouldn't let me reply. Never happened before. As soon as I shoot them I will post my findings. I may also load some to the max OAL and see how those do. If they shoot well, I'll just trim the case to give me max OAL so my brass lasts longer (less trimming). Not that I'm low on brass. But I try to be frugal with it.

 

[RPRNY]

This is why the Hornady Leverevolution FTX cases are shorter. Provided your trimmed cases are feeding and ejecting, all should be good. Above 39grs of 4198 under a 300 gr bullet is quite stout and, with the bullet seated below the cannelure adding pressure, would have given me pause for concern. So, trimming the case and seating properly was the right thing to do. Hopefully you can keep, what in my opinion too,is stellar accuracy.

 

[the Black Spot]

Starline has 444 brass now. I think 250 for $150?

 

[BigBore44]

Yes they do. And I will be purchasing some my next trip up there.

 

[Wis-Harpo]

I have been warned that trimming below minimum case length may cause you some trouble if you try to shoot some factory or correct case length ammo after shooting the shortened case loaded ammo. There may be some residue built up in the chamber where the shortened ammo was fired. This may cause some pressure spikes.

That said, I trim my .32 Rem ammo to the minimum length of 2.030 inches. The Max is 2.050, and suggested trim length is 2,040. I have to trim the cases to the very minimum for the same reason as the original post. The cannelure is placed on the bullet for the .32 Win, NOT the .32 Rem cartridge. Trimming the extra .010 inches allows me to crimp the bullets in place and stay below the maximum C.O.L. The Rem Model 14 has a tube magazine, so crimping is pretty much a must.

 

[BigBore44]

Wis-Harpo,
That may be because the 32 Rem has a shoulder and is crimped. The 444 is a slightly tapered case and (typically) isn't crimped. My cartridges are not crimped. If it loads without difficulty, it shouldn't have any problems. But, since this is my first go round doing this, I'll shoot 20 or so and then try to load a FL case and see if there's any resistance.

 

[Wis-Harpo]

The similarity is (1) that we both trim to the minimum length, and (2) if your rifle has a tubular magazine like mine you should use some sort of crimp to prevent bullet setback when firing the other cartridges in your magazine.

 

[BigBore44]

Ok so I finally got to shoot the trimmed cases... They shot very well and maintained consistency. But they did shoot 2.5" lower than the FL cases. I will load up some more and see if I can load them to the max OAL and still seat to the cannelure whilst still maintaining the consistency. Man I love that round. You definitely know you're shooting a large(r) calibre.

 

[BigBore44]

So I thought I would go ahead and post a few pictures of those round's grouping. Shots were 101 lasered off shooting sticks and me sitting in a turkey chair. There looks like a flier in the group that is covered by a quarter. It's not. That's a shot from my 45-70. Decided I should turn the box after that shot. Fired 3 shots, adjusted windage and elevation, then fired two in the "homemade" bullseye and called it good. Not bad for a JM, MG 444S with 300gr Sierra's over H4198 I'd say.

 

[RPRNY]

Whatever you did to get that? Keep doing it

 

[BigBore44]

Whatever you did to get that? Keep doing it

I'm NOT a great rifle shooter. But I do believe I found that "sweet spot" with this rifle/load. Don't think I'll ever change it.