ACME red coated 240gr LSWC and 2400 in 44

[Palladan44]

Seeing if anyone else has used this combo before. I typically use about 20gr of 2400 with hard cast lead, Brinell 18, 240gr. LSWC.

This is the first I've tried these "lipstick" bullets, and I wonder if they can handle going as fast as I have pushed former hard cast lead. ACME says their hardness is 16, so slightly softer than I'm used to, but coated.

If I must go slower, then I'll consider working with W-231, Power Pistol or Longshot on these bullets.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

What are you shooting them out of? Rifle, snubby, lever-action carbine, GE rotary gun....?

ACME says they can be pushed faster than waxed/lubed cast but I'd probably try to keep it under 1500fps just to be safe. I've used their .358 and .356 bullets in .357 magnum and 9mm but not over 1200fps in either - I typically try to stay under speed of sound in .44's unless I'm after groceries.

 

[WrongHanded]

I don't think you'll have an issue. But there's only one way to know for sure. I've used SNS and ACME coated bullets in .44 and .41 mag with 2400, and not had any issues to speak of beside a little occasional smearing in the barrel.

 

[sparkyv]

I regularly shoot a similar 240gr SWC coated bullet from Brazos Bullet Co which is approximately 13BHN to over 1,400fps with H110 in a 6.5" M629 with great satisfaction. I should think you are GTG, Palladan44. I haven't tried pushing them faster than just over 1,200fps using 2400 yet.

FYI, Missouri Bullet Co. makes that bullet in 18BHN. I shoot the MBC 300 grainers in my 460S&W to 1,597fps so far and they hold together quite well.

 

[drband]

No issues with full house W296 in a SBH 7.5” barrel with those same Acme bullets.
You’ll be fine with 2400! Load ‘em up!

 

[JO JO]

I have used acme 240 gr swc and acme 200 gr rn with 2400 / be86 and aa#7
They all worked well , but none were loaded hot ,

 

[Palladan44]

What are you shooting them out of? Rifle, snubby, lever-action carbine, GE rotary gun....?

ACME says they can be pushed faster than waxed/lubed cast but I'd probably try to keep it under 1500fps just to be safe. I've used their .358 and .356 bullets in .357 magnum and 9mm but not over 1200fps in either - I typically try to stay under speed of sound in .44's unless I'm after groceries.

I load an all-purpose "magnum" deer hunting round, but it's amazing how accurate it is as well. I really hope to achieve the same accuracy with these coated bullets. And this go-to load performs well in all 3 of my 44s I own.
Dan Wesson 744- 6"
Ruger Super Blackhawk -7 1/?"
S&W 29- 8 3/8" Nickel

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I load an all-purpose "magnum" deer hunting round, but it's amazing how accurate it is as well. I really hope to achieve the same accuracy with these coated bullets. And this go-to load performs well in all 3 of my 44s I own.
Dan Wesson 744- 6"
Ruger Super Blackhawk -7 1/?"
S&W 29- 8 3/8" Nickel

Ah, gotcha. Let us know how it works out. My tried and true SBH & M77/44 loads are a 300gr Sierra over a fair amount of Blue Dot and a 270gr Speer over a little less Blue Dot. I Chrony’d them once. Didn’t write it down in my notes so I probably figured it didn’t matter how fast they were going as long as they made big holes. Which ever one I use always does.

Funny thing. I’m always looking at cast bullets for anything, the heavy for caliber bullets mostly, and everything but in that Ruger matchup - the SBH & M77/44 - I only use jacketed in the field, Speer or Sierra’s and not their heaviest bullets either. Maybe it’s time for a change.

 

[Seedy Character]

My hunting loads, in a 92 rifle, have excellent accuracy and are loaded HOT. Never a problem with powder coated.
Have loaded .30-30 to 2400 FPS with 120gr and .30-06 to 2500 fps with same bullet. Works great.

 

[forrest r]

What are you shooting them out of? Rifle, snubby, lever-action carbine, GE rotary gun....?

ACME says they can be pushed faster than waxed/lubed cast but I'd probably try to keep it under 1500fps just to be safe. I've used their .358 and .356 bullets in .357 magnum and 9mm but not over 1200fps in either - I typically try to stay under speed of sound in .44's unless I'm after groceries.

Where do you guys get these "velocity limits/1500fps" from????

 

[forrest r]

I use home cast/coated 44cal bullets that are 8/9bhn in the 44mags and have no issues with full house loads using 2400, H110 or MP-300. But then again I'm only pushing them up to a little over 1600fps with the 200gr bullets.

 

[Hondo 60]

I don't think you'll have an issue.

I don't "think" you'll have an issue either
Just be safe, start low & work up.
If you just "have to" start with an "OMG" load, you're on your own.

 

[Seedy Character]

Where do you guys get these "velocity limits/1500fps" from????

Using lubed lead bullets. High velocity will cause lead smearing in the barrel.
Having a good powder coat, velocity is not a problem, until you get to 2800, more or less.

I limit my velocity to 2700, usually 2600 or less.

 

[forrest r]

Using lubed lead bullets. High velocity will cause lead smearing in the barrel.
Having a good powder coat, velocity is not a problem, until you get to 2800, more or less.

I limit my velocity to 2700, usually 2600 or less.

Thank you, 2700fps is a lot different then 1500fps I keep seeing people post.

I used a lee tl 312-160-r2 to cast these bullets using a 14bhn alloy (4.25%/4.25%/91%). They were cast with the same alloy/same casting session.


I shot them in a 30" bbl'd 308w puma rifle/10-shot groups @ 100yds.

The traditional lubed bullets blew out @ 2600fps+/37gr of H335


The coated bullets did not & actually the 37gr load had the smallest group. The coated bullet had 50fps+ more velocity for the same load also.


Started thinking about it and figured that traditionally lubed bullet didn't have enough lube to properly seal the bbl. So I added a layer of 45/45/10 lube to the bullet and re-tested. Sure enough the groups tightened up


What the inside of that 30" bbl looks like


30 rounds with the bare lead/traditionally cast lubed bullet @ 2600fps. There's no lead "smearing" in the bbl.


I did run into issues when pushing the coated bullets over 2700fps. The coating actually started to burn from friction leaving black streaks in the bbl.


Ended up using bore-tech bore cleaner to get black marks out of the bbl. I gave the coated bullets a coat of the 45/45/10 and retested with velocities up to 2900fps+. With the coating of 45/45/10 the pc'd bullets had no issues. I really couldn't drive that bullet harder/faster, was at the max load pressure wise.

 

[Seedy Character]

You CAN overdrive powder coat, but it is getting up there velocity wise.

Shooting a few lower velocity rounds (2200 +/-)
will clean out most of those smears.

I loaded grandson some .30-06 loads and had no smears and under 1" groups.
Same with .30-30.

Besides, the experimenting is just too much fun.

Looks like you found some good loads.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

You CAN overdrive powder coat, but it is getting up there velocity wise.

Shooting a few lower velocity rounds (2200 +/-)
will clean out most of those smears.

I loaded grandson some .30-06 loads and had no smears and under 1" groups.
Same with .30-30.

Besides, the experimenting is just too much fun.

Looks like you found some good loads.

erhem! Y'all do realize we're talking about .44 handguns, right?

Dan Wesson 744- 6"
Ruger Super Blackhawk -7 1/?"
S&W 29- 8 3/8" Nickel

Anybody here who can handle a 6" .44 revolver making 2600fps with a 240gr. LSWC is a better man than me!

 

[Seedy Character]

erhem! Y'all do realize we're talking about .44 handguns, right?


Anybody here who can handle a 6" .44 revolver making 2600fps with a 240gr. LSWC is a better man than me!

His side question was the 1500 fps vs 2600 fps and barrel problems.

1600 fps and 240gr .44 is a bear. But achievable and powder coated bullets will be outstanding.

Fact remains, powder coated can be driven faster and problem free, way in excess of what a lubed bullet can.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

His side question was the 1500 fps vs 2600 fps and barrel problems.

1600 fps and 240gr .44 is a bear. But achievable and powder coated bullets will be outstanding.

Fact remains, powder coated can be driven faster and problem free, way in excess of what a lubed bullet can.

Sorry I guess I missed the side question. As for pushing any bullets at any speed, the coating matters less than size, composition, alloy and powder. But all things being identical, yes the plastic based polymer coatings will generally leave less residue in the barrel than most wax-based lubes. But it’s not some miracle Elixir or anything. You still need all those other factors to be right. Powder coating antomonial lead doesn’t make it okay for 2600fps from a .308. But maybe I’m wrong.

 

[forrest r]

Sorry I guess I missed the side question. As for pushing any bullets at any speed, the coating matters less than size, composition, alloy and powder. But all things being identical, yes the plastic based polymer coatings will generally leave less residue in the barrel than most wax-based lubes. But it’s not some miracle Elixir or anything. You still need all those other factors to be right. Powder coating antomonial lead doesn’t make it okay for 2600fps from a .308. But maybe I’m wrong.

Just wondering where you came up with the 1500fps barrier from???
I was merely using my 14bhn/2600fps+ pc'd bullets as an example. I also run 200gr 8/9bhn cast/pc'd bullets 1600fps+ in a 44mag/contender bbl. I ran 180gr 8/9bhn cast/pc'd bullets 1800fps+ in the same bbl. I do run 110gr & 125gr 8/9bhn cast pc'd bullets 1800fps+ in a 357mag/contender.

1500fps is child's play with a lead/cast/coated bullet. Those lead/cast/coated bullets I'm referring to are my home cast/coated 8/9bhn bullets. And yes I have no issues using the same 8/9bhn alloy to cast/coat bullets for the 308w to use up to 2000fps.