Advice Please: Tightgroup vs. 231 for .45ACP 38+P 45 Colt

[Gary H]

Advice Please: Titegroup vs. 231 for .45ACP 38+P 45 Colt

I've been using Universal/CCI primers and have found a fairly large standard deviation, which may be due to poor metering and powder distribution. I'm thinking of trying W231, or Titegroup. I'm not adverse to moderately heavy crimps and major PF loads in order to get clean burning. Any experience with these two powders and/or advantage to changing to another primer..such as Winchester

 

[Razor 10]

Gary



The only help I can be is. I load .38 +p @ 125 gr bullet with 4.7 gr of titegroup with win. primers and it shoots great and very clean the velocity I usually see is 980 fps out of my sp101.


Good Luck
nick

 

[EchoSixMike]

I am using 6.0gn of Titegroup in 45Colt using a 255gn RNFP. Using 4.0 and a 230gn FMJ in 45ACP. S/F..Ken M

 

[stans]

I've never used Titegroup, but I have a fair bit of experience with W-231. I have found it to be reasonably clean, very consistant, and meters very well. It has become my favorite fast burning powder for 9mm, 357 Magnum, and 45 ACP.

 

[Chugach]

I use Winchester 231 for 357 Magnum loads and I'm very pleased with the results. Meters really well, but occasionally when throwing a charge into the scale pan you get a little bouncing out. Not a big deal, just a minor clean up.

 

[GooseGestapo]

My only experience with Titegroup is in .38spl, and 9mm. It is clean burning and efficient. However, with very small quantity for .38spl Wadcutter loads, I was getting frequent very lite charges so went back to the "Gold Standard" of Bullseye.
I've used quite a bit of Win231 and find it to be outstanding, second only, in my opinion to Bullseye.
The best NRA bullseye/PPC shooter I know (and try to emulate-he's my mentor, and I occasionally/frequently beat him now that's he's 73!- Thank God he's at Camp Perry this weekend, I'll clean-up in his absence), has/tries everything that comes along component wise. His winning combination for the .45 in Bullseye and NRA-PPC is STILL, a 185 or 200gr Star SWC, re-lubed with liquid alox, over 4.0gr (200gr) or 4.3-4.4(185gr) of Bullseye over a Federal Lg Pistol primer, in a Federal case. I too have found it nearly impossible to beat. Probably a close 2nd would be 4.3 and 4.6 of Win231 respectively. If you need to make a power factor, increase the Charge weights until you get necessary velocity, as long as you don't exceed published maximums.
These aren't "clean" loads, as Bullseye is "sooty" ,but I prefer "clean scores" to "clean bores".
YMMV
Good Luck.
(Note: I find left over fouling from win231 to be more annoying as it is a fine yellow "grit" and with revolvers, will occasionally get under the extractor ("star") and cause binding, hence I still prefer Bullseye)

 

[ChristopherG]

If irregular charging is one of your concerns, then 231 might be the answer to your prayers. I'm astounded at how consistently it charges in my Dillon SDB. And, it covers a very nice range of loads in 38/357 (I don't do 45).
cg

 

[Paul "Fitz" Jones]

The Best Primers available

In my booklet "How to Live With And Love Your Progressive Reloader" I recommend Federal and Winchester primers as the most reliable with the least problems if any. Remingtons are sucessfully used by a few men that can afford them.

In most Bullseye shooting Federals are used for the 25 yard range and the Winchesters for the 50 yard range because they are a little hotter. Both brands are known for their reliability.

In my interviewing many hundreds of automated and progressive reloader owners and my customers for my Booklet, all of the injuries from primer explosions were caused by CCI primers that did not have reliable diameters to fit in the feed machanism of the reloaders. Some CCI's could be out of round, rough edges to the cups, variable height cups, too high primer anvils and cocked anvils. I felt that the CCI company lacked quality control staff.

When CCI's arriving in the primer magazine jammed or when arriving in the primer slide exceeded the slides cup dimensions and when forced in the normal speed of reloading exploded and in some cases set off the whole primer magazine.

I provided the booklet with all the reloaders I sold to keep the owners out of trouble and the C-H factory that printed the booklet for me did the same with their customers and followed my advice to add a blast tube over the brass primer magazine on the Auto Champ press..

I advised my Star reloader customers that it did not make sense to purchase the most accurate and expensive reloader on the market and to feed it the cheapest and least reliable primers that caused all if the injuries I learned about. The Star has a blast proof brass primer magazine and the injuries happened in reloaders whose primer magazine was not blast proof.

I have heard of CCI primer problems from their invention to the present day. "Cheaper is not Better" and" You Get What You Pay For".

It also pays to have a raised lip on the edge of your reloading bench to keep primers and primer tubes from rolling off.

I would buy 120 pounds at a time of my favorite powder WW231.

 

[Poodleshooter]

I use Winchester primers for all of my handguns, and am moving in that direction for handguns. That said, I've had few problems with CCI's in my rifles.
I've used Titegroup in .38 and .45ACP a lot lately, and have found that a solid crimp plays a LARGE factor in velocity and consistency for my loads. Much more so than with a bulkier powder like Universal (which I'm just beginning to shoot). What kinds of SD's and extreme spreads are you getting with given velocities?
231 was great when I tried it, but there's no shotgun data for it that I know of so I usually opt for Alliant or Hodgdon pistol/shotgun powders. Haven't shot it in years.

 

[Gary H]

I had one pound of 231 and decided to try it in .38 Special. Loaded 5.7gr/125gr FP West Coast Plated and every drop was 5.7gr. The Universal is now retired. I don't know if I'll settle on 231, or Titegroup, but Universal will be my shotgun powder..still have 12 pds of the stuff.

 

[HSMITH]

Try some decent primers first. Universal is a great powder, and very uniform for me........

 

[Gary H]

It won't meter properly in my Pro 2000. I plan on going to Winchester primers.

 

[Gary H]

Shot my first Titegroup out of a 5" barrel. I loaded .357 mag. light. Didn't take my chronograph, but all loads were free of unburnt powder. Certainly dirtier than Universal, but had a nicer kick than the 231 being shot at the same time. Shot 125 gr. West Coast plated and Laser-Cast FP. Loaded both at 4.3 gr. and 4.5 gr and used both Magnum and Standard primers.. WSP .. WSPM I'll need to use the chrono in order to make a more detailed comparison.

 

[LAH]

I use nothing but Winchester Primers in handguns and use a lot of Winchester powder. 231 is one of my favorites.