Another example of why you should think long and hard before you jump into someone else’s fight

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there is a difference between a police/peace officer and a cop.
 
From a police use-of-force POV I guess it's different, but I would generally not voluntarily join a fight I wasn't willing to shoot my way out of. I think that's the obligation that comes with going armed; it's the sharp-edged corollary to, "an armed society is a polite society."

Obviously that severely limits the fights I'd join. If whatever the contest is about doesn't justify killing the other guy, don't join the contest; once you do, WIN fast and hard.
 
Actually it’s not much different from a police POV. The off duty officer was alone, had no backup and no radio. It wasn’t a matter of life or death if he didn’t intervene. He took a photo of the suspect. Why press the issue? It was a misdemeanor arrest. Smarter decision would have been to call someone who was on duty to handle it.

I think the lesson here is that if you are armed you need to avoid putting yourself into a situation where you can lose control of your weapon. That goes for sworn officers and private citizens alike.
 
From what I've read elsewhere, the off duty CHiP was rescuing the girl whose phone had been stolen. She tried to get it back from the thief and the group began to beat her. When the CHiP intervened, they transferred their attack to him.

These punks are lucky to have survived the incident. Even though he was off duty, the CHiP retained his police powers. Eight on one and choking the CHiP out made this an attack with deadly force that justified defense with deadly force. Yes, there would have been screams of (false) outrage by the usual suspects and maybe even another riot.
 
Kendahl said:
From what I've read elsewhere, the off duty CHiP was rescuing the girl whose phone had been stolen. She tried to get it back from the thief and the group began to beat her. When the CHiP intervened, they transferred their attack to him.
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Did you watch the video? It looked like they both had successfully disengaged on the video. It wasn't until the off duty officer moved towards the suspect that the fight started.

Kendahl said:
Even though he was off duty, the CHiP retained his police powers. Eight on one and choking the CHiP out made this an attack with deadly force that justified defense with deadly force.
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Police powers or not, going into that situation the way he he did was immensely stupid. Do you know if he was armed at the time? Again the video didn't show him flashing a badge or otherwise identifying himself as a police officer. That doesn't mean he didn't say it, just that the video doesn't show it.

It's a better plan to disengage and come back later with enough help so you can make the arrest without a fight.
 
Thinking long and hard before fighting is always advisable if it may be a luxury we don't always have. A large number of decisions to fight will be a matter of a split-second response based on pre-programmed.condition.

More than once I've laid out a scenario in a story of a man reacting to an immediate crisis and only after hours of considering the situation realize that the action I proposed wouldn't have met a legal or a moral standard. Had I been in that situation myself, I wouldn't have had the luxury of either time nor contemplation.

Every man, I suppose, knows that it's possible to round the next corner and face a situation that's beyond his physical ability to handle. To some extent, we can mutter, "fortunes of war" and shrug off those possibilities. It's a little harder our limitations when they run to something deeper than the physical.

Much of the time the right course of is obvious and clear cut. It isn't always.
 
They easily could have found that officer dead. Would his family have supported his decision then?
After I retired I clarified the situation to my wife.
I'm not rescuing anyone, I am not the Lone Ranger.
If the threat is coming directly to us, I will defend us, otherwise, I am a citizen with a cell phone, and brains enough to stay out of it.
 
My phone was snatched by a cute lil thing that asked to use it, jumped into a waiting car.
Phone was worth about $1000.00 which probably made it a felony but my insurance covered all but $250. What's cheaper and easier? Phones can be immobilized immediately (mine traveled to Denver within 6 hours before the perps changed the chip).
$250 vs $2,500,000 and/or prison. For a phone? This is a no brainer.
 
george29 said:
My phone was snatched by a cute lil thing that asked to use it, jumped into a waiting car.
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I make it a rule never to pull my phone out in public unless it's an emergency.

I also make it a rule if I don't know you you're not borrowing my phone. Although mine is a cheap hundred dollar Walmart phone
 
Years ago we advised all of our officers (young officers particularly) that their best action off duty was to "call it in" and only get involved if there were no other choice (real threat to life, comes to mind). After all of that I know of more than a few instances where our officers (and me included..) chose to get involved. Some of the incidents worked out just fine -and occasionally an officer might even have gotten a commendation, some went bad and the officer was lucky they weren't injured or killed. I won't describe my own foolishness except to say mostly my mis-adventures came out okay... All of this was before the widespread cell phone era, but toward the end of my career cell phones were so widespread that there was no reason not to reach for it when something was going down....

Now retired and starting my 25th year out of police work - the most important tool on my person out in public? You guessed it - that cell phone. Of course young officers (particularly the idealistic ones...) will act before thinking on many occasions. If they survive, that will become tempered by hard experience....

The reality is that if you act as an officer outside of the scope of your employment your agency is under no obligation to support you at all... and if you're hurt that goes double....
 
Generally speaking I’m not willing to risk my life for my material possessions, I’d be even less likely when it’s not even mine. Now if believe someone is in danger, that’s different, a lot different.
 
lemaymiami said:
Now retired and starting my 25th year out of police work - the most important tool on my person out in public? You guessed it - that cell phone. Of course young officers (particularly the idealistic ones...) will act before thinking on many occasions. If they survive, that will become tempered by hard experience....
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+1

Back when I first decided to get my carry permit, some long hard thinking finally persuaded me to finally get a cell phone after resisting for so long.
 
First, getting involved in a violent confrontation to protect property is not something I'm willing to do. If someone is being hurt, that's one of those situations which has no good options, either doing nothing while that person is getting hurt or involving yourself and getting hurt or worse yourself. I was also one of those young patrolmen who thought nothing of jumping into those situations, fortunately without any bad results. I can't say with 100% certainty what I'd do if I saw someone getting hurt now, but I'm 57 and am almost recovered from back and neck problems so fighting isn't something I'm up for, have no legal authority as I'm no longer a LEO and have kids I'm responsible for. My 13 year old in particular would be in trouble if something happened to me. I'm more likely than not calling 911 and letting the police handle it.
 
TomJ said:
First, getting involved in a violent confrontation to protect property is not something I'm willing to do. If someone is being hurt, that's one of those situations which has no good options, either doing nothing while that person is getting hurt or involving yourself and getting hurt or worse yourself. I was also one of those young patrolmen who thought nothing of jumping into those situations, fortunately without any bad results. I can't say with 100% certainty what I'd do if I saw someone getting hurt now, but I'm 57 and am almost recovered from back and neck problems so fighting isn't something I'm up for, have no legal authority as I'm no longer a LEO and have kids I'm responsible for. My 13 year old in particular would be in trouble if something happened to me. I'm more likely than not calling 911 and letting the police handle it.
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You mean, it's not like TV where the injured cop waves off the ambulance, hobbles back to car, swaps witty banter with the cleavage endowed partner that secretly loves him and they ride off laughing into the sunset?
 
george29 said:
You mean, it's not like TV where the injured cop waves off the ambulance, hobbles back to car, swaps witty banter with the cleavage endowed partner that secretly loves him and they ride off laughing into the sunset?
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:rofl: and there's my THR laugh for the day.
 
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