Anyone had a safe in a basement during a fire?

[mugsie]

I have a rather large Winchester safe where all my important papers and my weapons are stored. The safe is in my basement, up off the floor about an inch because I have a few pieces of wood under it to allow for air circulation. It has the stuff around the door which expands with heat to help protect the contents, however it is stored in my basement.

In the event of a fire, my thought is that the house is going to be flooded with water, which will end up in my basement. I think more than flames, I need to be concerned about flooding. There is also a small hole in the rear bottom where the dehumidifier cord runs through. This can be easily filled with caulk, which I'll do.

Have any of you had an experience with a safe being flooded? Did the water penetrate and do more damage than heat? I'd like to hear your thoughts or experiences.

 

[we are not amused]

No experience with a gun safe going through a fire, but I have had experience with a serious house fire and flooded basement.

I ended up with about two and a half to three feet of water in the basement.

Most gun safes as I understand are not water proof, and you really don't want the acidic water and its contaminants in your safe. The heat seal around the door which are designed to expand in a fire, depend on heat to cause the expansion. In my case, the fire did not get into the basement, but due to the power being off, the sump pump could not remove the water used to fight the fire, and as a result the basement filled with almost three feet of black, acidic water.

You might check with the manufacturer to see how waterproof your safe is and what do they recommend in case of flooding.

 

[CB900F]

Mugsie;

I dealt with a customer's Graffunder that had survived a fire in the basement of that home. The contents were not damaged but the safe had to be refurbished, which the homeowner's insurance paid for. I have no idea what the conditions were in the immediate aftermath of the fire, we weren't called in until later. However, the Graffunder is a true U.L. rated safe & I believe the Winchester's (built by Granite Industries in Texas if I remember correctly) are all RSC's. And that's an apples & oranges comparison.

900F

 

[docsleepy]

Use a double insulated sump pump, and run it from a big uninterruptible power supply, or either construct one by virtue of a battery and inverter.

Store a very large box of Armand Hammer baking soda inside the safe.

 

[BSA1]

For starters you need to get the bottom of the safe higher than a inch off the floor and on a nonflammable base.

 

[docsleepy]

Find some sort of a trashcan made out of plastic, that fits the inside of your safe, and cut off 3 feet of it, put in the bottom of your safe, that will keep things potentially from getting wet.

Put the arm and Hammer baking soda at the bottom of the safe, outside of the plastic trashcan liner. When the water gets inside the safe, it will be completely neutralized by the arm and Hammer baking soda, which is a weak base.

 

[Doc Savage]

Haven't had a gun safe go thru a fire, but my Mom had a firesafe when her house burned down (to the ground) and she had a partial basement.

Two things I learned from that fire, 1. If you have a safe, put it near an outside wall and know about where it is from the outside. I was able to pick up her safe the day after the fire without digging through stuff and it was just 2' in from the foundation, easy to get to. 2. the Sentry brand firesafe that Wal-mart carries, does the job quite well. Even with the plastic keypad melted off and a hole thru from that there was little smoke damage, and even papers survived (also why I won't get a keypad on a safe, I'd rather have a steel tumbler).

As to her basement, there was nothing recoverable from there. We eventually just dozed the remains of the house into the basement and backfilled it. There was about 5' of junk in the basement (everything from the floors above the basement will end up in the basement on top of whatever is down there). Personally a basement would be the last place I put a safe after what I saw of what hers looked like.

 

[rowlandjames]

I had lost many of my important papers in the fire damage last year. The file had the all the office work and thankfully i had its soft copy in my office computer. That was a bad experience for me. south Florida public adjuster

 

[ChaoSS]

Just a thought, but maybe anything that could take water damage should be in a waterproof container?

I'd suggest some sort of plastic box that is waterproof, and all important papers in bags inside that box. Just double protection, just in case.

 

[Racinfan83]

Saw the comments on "not putting the safe in the basement".... BUT - if you put it upstairs isn't it going to fall into the basement when the wood floor burns up? I think I'd take my chances on knowing where it is and that it is still upright?
I did see a safe at Orschelin a couple weeks ago that said it was flood safe to 24" - so I guess there are some out there. Don't remember offhand what brand it was tho....

 

[Al Thompson]

BUT - if you put it upstairs isn't it going to fall into the basement?

Excellent point. Might want to make sure the safe isn't under the fridge too.

 

[moto_stevo]

If the fire is hot enough the safe will not survive. The best thing is to keep up on your for mitigation. Trim your trees, and maintain your firebreak

 

[Doc Savage]

Putting it in the basement vs "upstairs" would depend on the house construction. Our house only had a basement under an addition. The main house only had a crawlspace. Safe fell down to the earth about 3'. If the house had a full basement it's a darned if you do, darned if you don't scenario.

 

[NAK]

I went through an Introduction to Fire Cause class years ago. The class was 90% discussing pictures and videos of various structures and building materials after the fire was out. Things I remember:

In general, the higher it is in the structure, the hotter it gets.
Things on concrete slabs do not have fuel/heat sources under them, therefor stay cooler than items on a combustible floor that burns through from below.
Basements generally limit the oxygen supply to the fuel, resulting in lower temps, but often for a longer period of time.
When a multistory home with a basement burns to the ground, the basement is an unbelievable mess and can be a dangerous place to try to recover anything.

In a "total loss" fire, the insurance company pays for cleaning up the site. That is not likely to include searching the site for valuables not covered by the policy. I can see the process of trying to find, then remove a fire safe from a basement being a very expensive.

All of that said, we don't have basement where I live.

 

[mgkdrgn]

Not when it started ....

 

[ViniferaVizslas]

Sort of. When my fathers house burned he had a cabinet in the basement and another on the second floor. The one on the second was wood/glass and was directly adjacent to the stack run from the basement. They were all burned badly. The wood cabinet in the basement did better because it fell into 2 feet of water. I would say the bigger threat is water as there was only fire damage in the middle of the house basement to attic. There was water damage everywhere.