Arkansas CHL

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RevNate

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I am coordinating an effort (in conjunction with the Arkansas Concealed Carry Association) to see a change made in the Arkansas CHL law which would allow churches and other religious institutions to decide whether or not to allow concealed carry on their own property. Currently Arkansas law does not allow carry in a place of worship, regardless of the preference of the local congregation.

Specifically, I need church and religious leaders who would support this change and who would be willing to express their support to the Judiciary Committee of the State Assembly, either in person or by letter. We have until the end of January to get it lined out- so time is crucial.

This is what I need:
Ministers- please PM me and let me know if you support this change

All Arkies- please speak to your religious leader about this and encourage their support. If they need more info, please put them in contact with me.

PM me for contact info and more details.

This is truly a grass-roots movement, so we need all the help we can get.

Thank you,
Nathan Petty
 
Very Backward

I found it very backward living in Arkansas, after paying a good sum of money to get a CHL, that i couldn't legally carry a handgun in twenty some odd places....that is rediculous when you look at the background check, class time, fingerprinting, and of course fees. Go somewhere like New Hampshire and Alabama (where licenses are dirt cheap and issued at the county level) and you can carry virtually anywhere...schools, bars, churches...it doesn't matter because that was the whole purpose of getting a license so you can carry it on you right? I thought it was so stupid that the Arkansas CHL is really good for keeping a loaded handgun in your car and going to the grocery store and that is it. If you want to be legal and go about your week, you are constantly taking your gun off you and leaving it in your car...then putting it back under your jacket....very very smart Arkansas lawmakers! They must not care about people's guns being stolen.
 
Just a bump and a reminder, with a bit of a (non) update.

Still no details on the specifics of the bill. Some have asked and as of today, the bill had not yet been pre-filed. My contact at ARCCA has been on vacation so I am hoping for some new info by next week.

Concerning the specifics- as explained to me, the law would simply remove "(16) Any church or other place of worship;" from §5-73-306 and would afford churches the same option businesses have, specifically that carrying a handgun would be prohibited in:
"(19) (A) Any place at the discretion of the person or entity exercising
control over the physical location of the place by placing at each entrance to the place a written notice clearly readable at a distance of not less than ten feet(10) that “carrying a handgun is prohibited”. (from §5-73-306. Prohibited places.)

I have prepared a sample letter of support for those who would like to voice such. Again, at this stage we are primarily looking for "religious leaders" who want to see the change made to allow churches to decide whether or not to allow concealed carry in their buildings.

Keep spreading the word! We need support in place early if we are to avoid seeing this die in committee again.

Thanks,
Nate
 
First, please let me say thank again to all of you who have taken the time to
discuss this issue with me. My goal is to find 50 pastors and church leaders who will voice their support of this change within the next two weeks. That means I need your help spreading the word. Please talk to your colleagues. Make some phone calls. Send out a few e-mails. We need all the help we can get.

Concerning the actual bill- as of today, the bill has not yet been filed. I
talked to Grant Exton from the Arkansas Concealed Carry Association
(www.arkansascca.org) on Friday 1/9 and got an update. Representative Beverly Pyle has indicated that she intends to sponsor the bill. Since the Arkasnas Concealed Handgun License program is administered by the Arkansas State Police, it is a customary courtesy for lawmakers to consult with ASP before making changes that affect them. That was done last week. Barring any derailment, Mr. Exton anticipated that the bill would be filed this week. But, lawmakers do what lawmakers want to do.

This is where your involvment becomes important. If we wait until the lawmakers get their ducks in a row, we may find that it is too late to get organized and get our voices heard. This is not about a single bill, or a single lawmaker's intent. This is about the right of a local church to exercise control over its own property. We also have to understand that nobody else is going to pick up this cause for us. It is up to church leaders to speak out on this one.
 
Good luck, RevNate!

When I took my CHL course our instructor - an ex Little Rock LEO - was talking about "gun free zones" and churches. He asked, sarcastically, did anyone ever hear of a shooting in a church? Never happens, right? He did tell us that carrying here and there may be illegal, but there is sometimes a thin line that, depending on the person, could be crossed. But at risk, of course.

Wouldn't you know, but a few days later there was a shooting inside a church in Tennessee.

I don't know the stance of my "pastor", Gene Levy, and would hope that he is not anti. I know he is liberal and democratic leaning, but one would hope he also remembers history and what an infamous German dictator did after suspending firearm rights.

Good luck, sir.
 
ed,
Perhaps you might feel comfortable discussing it with him? Whether he supports it or not, it is at least a relevant topic of conversation. I doubt I would have any pull with him, but I would be willing to speak to him about it or send him some information if you think it would help. I'm just a "goy" but I'll help if I can :)

Shalom
 
ccsniper,
Please inform your preacher buddies about the facebook group- Arkansas Pastors for Concealed Carry.

Thanks!
 
ed,
Perhaps you might feel comfortable discussing it with him? Whether he supports it or not, it is at least a relevant topic of conversation. I doubt I would have any pull with him, but I would be willing to speak to him about it or send him some information if you think it would help. I'm just a "goy" but I'll help if I can

Shalom
Click to expand...

If you could reach out to him that would be great. He did live in San Antonio so maybe there's hope. I'd prefer to remain somewhat anonymous, because there are a lot of anti's in our congregation and gossip travels faster than grass through a goose. :)
 
HB1237 is on the agenda for the House Judiciary Committee this Thursday, January 29th. This is important because the last time a similar bill came to this committee, it died there. Even if you have already written a letter, please send an e-mail to the members of this committee. Your voice is crucial!


Send e-mails of support to the members of the committee:

Steve Harrelson, Chairperson [email protected]
Joan Cash, Vice Chairperson no e-mail indicated
Dawn Creekmore [email protected]
Lindsley Smith [email protected]
Tommy Lee Baker no e-mail indicated
David "Bubba" Powers no e-mail indicated
Johnnie J. Roebuck [email protected]
Barry Hyde no e-mail indicated
Duncan Baird [email protected]
Debra M. Hobbs [email protected]
Andrea Lea [email protected]
Butch Wilkins [email protected]
Terry Rice [email protected]
Darrin Williams [email protected]
Steve Cole no e-mail indicated
Ann V. Clemmer [email protected]
Davy Carter [email protected]
Jim Nickels [email protected]
Tiffany Rogers [email protected]
Mary L. Slinkard no e-mail indicated
 
Interesting....

From the blog of the chairman of the Judiciary Committee (I'm the guy mentioned in Update #1):

Tuesday, January 27, 2009
Clingin' to my guns and my religion

HB1237 has been assigned to my committee, which allows for concealed carry in churches. I'm from south Arkansas, so therefore I have guns -- a lot of 'em. Still, the thought of carrying one into the sanctuary has never crossed my mind.

I suppose it's the principle of not having control over one's own property (the most valid point), and this is obviously reactionary to the 2008 shooting at a Unitary Church in the hills of Tennessee. This'll be an interesting debate, because members on the committee know it'll be the first bill on the 2009 NRA scorecard.

Update: The first message on the bill comes from a preacher at a Fordyce Baptist Church. He's for it, he says, on the basis that each church should be able to choose for itself whether concealed carry inside the building is appropriate.
Update II: My pastor is less enthusiastic and points me to the church discipline, which prohibits firarms at events associated with the church.

posted by Steve Harrelson @ 1/27/2009 05:26:00 PM
 
your church prohibits guns at your events? my church hosted a "gunnin for glory" a couple of years ago. wouldve turned into an annual thing if not for the new land we bought.
 
not my church... that is from the blog of the Chairman of the Arkansas House Judiciary Committee. He was quoting his Pastor, who I believe was referring to an official position of the United Methodist Church, of which he is a member.

edit: BTW, sniper- your Rep, Terry Rice, is a co-sponsor on this legislation. Good thing. I e-mailed all of the committee members and he was one of those who responded. He seems quite enthusiastic about the whole thing. I wish my Rep would even acknowledge one of the notes I have sent to him.
 
Legal in TN

I carry at church everytime i go and I also live in TN. I haven't seen guns suddenly jumping out of people's pockets and going off during church services.

Arkansas messed up a long time ago by having twenty some odd places as 'off limits' to those who pay $150 to the AR State Police and another $100 for a class, and then requalify fees for a class and renewal fees every few years. With all the background checks, training, and retraining, you'd think that you could carry wherever you wanted...but no....AR says you can get a license but it's not good in twenty places!

In TN, we cannot carry in buildings open to the public (legal at private clubs) that sell alcohol for consumption (misdemeanor), property with properly worded signs (max $500 fine misdemeanor), courtrooms during a judicial proceeding (felony), and school grounds (felony or misdemeanor unless it stays in the car). Some people think it is illegal to carry in parks...but many lawyers believe it is legal....as do i...so i carry there. Most folks are generally asked to leave if 'caught' in a place with the properly worded signs or a place that serves alcohol. I have never heard of a true criminal charge of someone with a permit carrying at Chili's minding their own business. I can legally carry in govt offices, churches, when i early vote at a church, athletic events (if no alcohol or school related), and I don't have to tell the whole world "Hey i'm carrying a gun can i come inside?" before i step in someone's house. I also don't have to conceal if i don't want to. I will say i miss being able to throw a loaded rifle legally behind the seat of my vehicle though like in Arkansas!
 
Judiciary Commitee review on this bill has been rescheduled for Tuesday, Feb. 3rd. I need letters to carry with me or, even better, church leaders who will attend. The time is here.
 
fox16.com has a poll on their homepage which stems from this bill. The question: Should you be allowed to carry a gun to church?

All "Yes" votes are greatly appreciated.
 
My letter to my rep:

Mr. Burris,

I am writing today to urge you to support HB1237, make your support known, and to vote in favor of this measure if it makes it out of committee.

HB1237, you may know, aims to strike the prohibition on licensed concealed carry holders carrying in places of worship. Upstanding, responsible citizens of the state of Arkansas should be afforded the ability to protect themselves in all situations.

Underlining the importance of this bill, a concealed carry permit holder Colorado recently stopped a spree killer before he could take the lives of more of her fellow worshippers. It made the national news at the time - you can read about it here. The article lists the shooter as a "security guard" - in actuality, in the meat of the article, you'll see she volunteered to be present for services that day, as a shooting at another church had concerned her.

Throughout my research, I have not found a single instance of a licensed concealed carry permit holder killing anyone in a church or other place of worship, either maliciously or by negligence.
Click to expand...

I know John, and he'll vote for this anyhow. It never hurts, though.
 
Rep. Barbara Nix of Saline County (District 28) has been removed as a co-sponsor of this bill.... but the GOOD news...

Rep. Dawn Creekmore of Saline and Pulaski counties (District 27) has replaced her as one of 14 co-sponsors. Rep. Creekmore is a member of the House Judiciary Committee (that is a very good thing). This makes three members of the committee who are co-sponsors on this bill now.
 
You are right, sniper. It is just a matter of getting the word out on it.

If it is any consolation, I looked at the signatures and counted 16 of them who I personally know are Pastors or Church Staff Members. I think that will have an impression on the Committee. Still, a couple of hundred would be nice!!

That is why I have been asking so many people to spread the word. Though I have been in the ministry for 15 years, my circle of friends in the ministry is really pretty small. I have been working to get the word out to all of the guys I know, but there are a lot more out there whom I do not know.

It would be a tremendous help if every Arkie here would take a moment today to call his or her "religious leader" and discuss it with them. Rest assured that this is not a fringe movement. These guys are not some crackpot half-wits with a bible and a pulpit and no knowledge of what to do with either one. These are Seminary instructors, church associational officers, respectable ministers and I can give my word that the ones I know on the list are exemplary men.
 
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