I recently bought a Ruger SP101 357 with a 2 1/4 inch barrel I have a couple of powders to chose from and I plan on using hornady 125 grain xtp's for my choice of bullets. Question is, is a fast burning powder like Tightgroup a better choice than a slightly slower burning powder like AA#5 for 38 special loads and the same thing in 357 , would AA#5 be a better powder than 2400 in 357 because of the short barrel of the revolver?
Best powder for a snubbie
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The Bushmaster
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I have a Kimber UC II with a three inch barrel. I use Bullseye. Its supposed to be one of the fastest powders out there. It works well for me.
In general, faster powders are more efficient in short barrels, ie. Bullseye, Red Dot, AA #2, #5, W-231. You don't want something that's going to put a big fireball out the muzzle. However, you're typically not going to be able to completely avoid that in a snubby.
If you're looking for performance in a snubby as defensive carry, bullet choice is more important than powder since you're not going to make the most of the magnum cartridge, regardless of powder. Look for something that either opens dramatically and quickly at lower velocities or something that has good penetration like a jacketed softpoint.. XTP will open up somewhat, but proably better in a little heavier bullet that has the momentum to fully open up. Speer/CCI Short Barrel Gold Dot is another good (better) choice to dramatically open the HP, though I'm unsure whether or not they make in .357 . . . probably do. Then, too, I would recommend a heavier weight.
Of course you are going to use what you want, but as many folks have posted in this forum, it might be the best idea to use factory ammunition for self defense . . . one less thing for a personal lawyer to use to get money out of you if something goes bad. Lead SWCs with a quick burning powder will give you more practice loads for the same price as the XTP and lead's easier to clean from barrels than copper.
Went overboard, didn't I? Just another poster's opinion to file away where you wish.
If you're looking for performance in a snubby as defensive carry, bullet choice is more important than powder since you're not going to make the most of the magnum cartridge, regardless of powder. Look for something that either opens dramatically and quickly at lower velocities or something that has good penetration like a jacketed softpoint.. XTP will open up somewhat, but proably better in a little heavier bullet that has the momentum to fully open up. Speer/CCI Short Barrel Gold Dot is another good (better) choice to dramatically open the HP, though I'm unsure whether or not they make in .357 . . . probably do. Then, too, I would recommend a heavier weight.
Of course you are going to use what you want, but as many folks have posted in this forum, it might be the best idea to use factory ammunition for self defense . . . one less thing for a personal lawyer to use to get money out of you if something goes bad. Lead SWCs with a quick burning powder will give you more practice loads for the same price as the XTP and lead's easier to clean from barrels than copper.
Went overboard, didn't I? Just another poster's opinion to file away where you wish.
Slow powders still give higher velocities, regardless of barrel length. You just have to live with the muzzle blast.
Also, that 125 XTP opens just fine as long as you're around 1100 fps, and is still tough enough to hold together well at 1500. Past that though, and it starts acting like a varmit bullet.
Also, that 125 XTP opens just fine as long as you're around 1100 fps, and is still tough enough to hold together well at 1500. Past that though, and it starts acting like a varmit bullet.
Agreed. Meant to put that at the end of my fist paragraph. I like 2400 in 357 regardless of barrel length . . . but I got sidetracked in writing my epic.
Thanks for the replies I think I'll also try some 140 grain xtps based on the replies and see if i can get a hold of some gold dots to. I normally do keep factory ammo on hand for carry but I also like to practice with something as close as I can get to that factory ammo with reloads as its much cheaper.
I used to have an older Speer Manual from the 70's. It listed loads specifically for a .38 snubbie. They stated that the slower powders would yield higher velocity at the cost of "teriffic" muzzle flash.
Excellent statement.
However, if you want to shoot, for practice, with lead bullets try Bullseye, Unique, W231.
I have shot case loads of 158 L 3.5 grains Bullseye, any case any primer in my 38 Snubbies. This load is accurate, no huge muzzle blast, no leading, no unusual funnies. I have no doubt that there are Bullseye loads for the 357 with lead bullets. Or Unique, or W231.
Just thought I'd update my tests at the range on powder sellection for my snubbie.
38 special +p loads
Winchester 125 grain 38+p 905 fps 3 inch group at 15 yards,125 grain xtp's 7.6 grains of AA#5 910 fps 2 1/2 inch group, 125 grain xtp Titegroup 5.0 grains 917 fps 2 1/2 inch group. not much difference with these powders. But the 357 mags are interesting. Factory Winchester 110 grains HP 1226 fps large grouping , 125 xtp 14 grains of 2400 1006 fps 4 inch group, 15 grains 2400 1040 fps same size group, 16 grains 2400 1080 fps about the same group. now the AA#5 10.5 grains 1147 fps large group, 11.0 grains 1210 fps large group. The groupings with the higher velocity loads I'm sure were mostly my fault but it seams the faster powder in a snubbie does give more velocity. I also shot 125 grain Golden Sabres the grouping was large but my chrono didnt read them not sure why Im guessing because it was sunny and the golden bullets, I had it set just like the others . The Mag loads were not that hard to shoot recoil wise but accuracy was no where near what I could do with the 38+p loads. The load data was from Hornady for the 2400 loads and from Accurate for the AA#5 and from Hodgdon for the Titegroup. From Titegroup to #5 made almost no difference in 38+p loads , but it seams in my gun the faster powder was actually a plus for the 357 Mag loads. All shots were taken at about 15 yards.
38 special +p loads
Winchester 125 grain 38+p 905 fps 3 inch group at 15 yards,125 grain xtp's 7.6 grains of AA#5 910 fps 2 1/2 inch group, 125 grain xtp Titegroup 5.0 grains 917 fps 2 1/2 inch group. not much difference with these powders. But the 357 mags are interesting. Factory Winchester 110 grains HP 1226 fps large grouping , 125 xtp 14 grains of 2400 1006 fps 4 inch group, 15 grains 2400 1040 fps same size group, 16 grains 2400 1080 fps about the same group. now the AA#5 10.5 grains 1147 fps large group, 11.0 grains 1210 fps large group. The groupings with the higher velocity loads I'm sure were mostly my fault but it seams the faster powder in a snubbie does give more velocity. I also shot 125 grain Golden Sabres the grouping was large but my chrono didnt read them not sure why Im guessing because it was sunny and the golden bullets, I had it set just like the others . The Mag loads were not that hard to shoot recoil wise but accuracy was no where near what I could do with the 38+p loads. The load data was from Hornady for the 2400 loads and from Accurate for the AA#5 and from Hodgdon for the Titegroup. From Titegroup to #5 made almost no difference in 38+p loads , but it seams in my gun the faster powder was actually a plus for the 357 Mag loads. All shots were taken at about 15 yards.
I can't believe your getting #5 to work well in a snub. The burn is too long. Does it leave an unburnt mess behind? I have tried it in the past and it even caused a squib because of the un-burnt powder.
Burn rates ;-)
The question is what do you want to get out of your load. If you want the most vel a slower powder will more than not still be your best bet - at least a med burn rate. A fast powder just doesn't give you what a slower powder will. There is the question of efficiency of course but who cares unless you are pinching pennies. Of course you will have more recoil and depending on powder more flash.
YMMV I got a deal on some AA5 and use it now for my 38 loads. No problem with unburnt powder. May I suggest to check your OAL and crimp if you are getting unburnt powder. Maybe even nudge up your powder charge if you are loading lite and it is safe to do so.
Unique would be a good powder. Usally more vel than many in and around the same burn rate. One of the best all around powders out there.
sb
The question is what do you want to get out of your load. If you want the most vel a slower powder will more than not still be your best bet - at least a med burn rate. A fast powder just doesn't give you what a slower powder will. There is the question of efficiency of course but who cares unless you are pinching pennies. Of course you will have more recoil and depending on powder more flash.
YMMV I got a deal on some AA5 and use it now for my 38 loads. No problem with unburnt powder. May I suggest to check your OAL and crimp if you are getting unburnt powder. Maybe even nudge up your powder charge if you are loading lite and it is safe to do so.
Unique would be a good powder. Usally more vel than many in and around the same burn rate. One of the best all around powders out there.
sb
jfh
Member.
fourdollarbill: Starting out with the Speer PDF files for the 135-gr. GDSB bullet, and on into Speer 14, you will find AA#5 is the powder many of us prefer for our GDSB loads. Google here, in this forum, for more extensive discussions.
I would also consider #5 to be my 'no.2' powder for 158-gr LSWC(-HPs); my number one is True Blue.
It also works fine the same bullet and ballistics in 357 cases--tweaked as needed, of course.
In .38 Special, these are loads at or near max--max being the 38 Special CIP standards.
Personally, I find it runs a bit dirty, but I am still tweaking the crimps--
For lower-pressure, 231 is a fine load, as noted in other posts above--but AA#5 in 2" barrel revolvers works just fine.
Jim H.
I would also consider #5 to be my 'no.2' powder for 158-gr LSWC(-HPs); my number one is True Blue.
It also works fine the same bullet and ballistics in 357 cases--tweaked as needed, of course.
In .38 Special, these are loads at or near max--max being the 38 Special CIP standards.
Personally, I find it runs a bit dirty, but I am still tweaking the crimps--
For lower-pressure, 231 is a fine load, as noted in other posts above--but AA#5 in 2" barrel revolvers works just fine.
Jim H.
A few years ago I tested a bunch of powders for snubby use. The one I liked the best was Green Dot.
It was the least position sensitive (most consistent muzzle up vs muzzle down) and one of the quieter ones for a given velocity.
It was the least position sensitive (most consistent muzzle up vs muzzle down) and one of the quieter ones for a given velocity.
Bulleye and W231 as well as titegroup would be okay for short barrel in 38 spcl but I have began messing around with red dot for both 38 spcl and 357 Mag with Lead projos' and have found results to be refreshing.
LGB
LGB
I use 5.6-6.0 of AA#5 with 158gr LSWC .358" in a 1.875" S&W 36 it works well, it works better in my 6" S&W 10. For my 36, my best loads are with Bullseye and W-231. The best powder I have tried for upper end .357 mag. with 158-180gr for a 2.75" Ruger SS is AA#9. For medium .357 mag. Bullseye, W-231 and AA#5 work very well in a short barrel.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
There are several very good powders on the market for what you're looking to do such as AA#5, Longshot, Power Pistol and True Blue but I think the best "medium burn" powder out there is Hodgdon HS-6. I use it in medium Magnum rounds as well as .38 Special +P applications with great success. You should look into it.
BTW, it's accurate, clean burning and low flash... It also works very well with lead bullets as well as jacketed.
BTW, it's accurate, clean burning and low flash... It also works very well with lead bullets as well as jacketed.
I use H-110 w/ 125 gr. Winchester HP's in a S&W Highway Patrolman. Shoots very very well. There's a little blast (there always will be with a short barrel) but it's not terrible.
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