Caliber Conundrum

[lizziedog1]

I was looking through some of my reloading manuals. I was looking at all the cartridges that we have. I noticed that certain calibers have more cartridges available than others.

30 caliber cartridges seem to come in all flavors and sizes. How many 308 Winchester class, 30 caliber cartridges do we really need? How many 30 caliber, full-blown magnums, are really necessary? How long before the next new-fangled one shows up on a cover of a gun magazine?

Then I looked at 270 cartridges. There are exactly three. The Winchester, the Winchester Short Magnum, and the Weatherby Magnum. Why have only three cartridges in this caliber and ten times the number in 30 caliber?

Actually, 270 caliber development makes more sense. You have the 270 Winchester that should do for most hunting situation around here. If one wants to hot rod this, they can get the Weatherby offering. Then you have the short magnum that sort of splits the difference.

7mm rounds seem to be varied also. Not as much as 30 caliber, but definately more than 270 caliber. Way more than 6.5mm caliber, a caliber that I feel should have a few more options available. 22 caliber seems to be pretty popular, not so much for 35 caliber. Whats up with that?

So, what is our infactuation with certain calibers? If a hunter is a 30 caliber fan and wants to have a gun chambered for every 30 caliber cartridge, he could just about hunt everyday with a different gun. And when he gets bored with all those 30 calibers, all he has to do is wait a few months for the next new, grand super-duper 30 caliber to be introduced. Three guns would cover all the 270 calibers for 270 fans. At least it won't goof up his budget as much.

Why hasn't cartridge development been so intensive in certain calibers?

 

[axxxel]

Isn't the 6.8SPC a .270 cartridge as well?

I think the reason .30 cal has gotten so popular is that the US military used three .30 cartridges in a row. The civilian use of these calibers fed the profitability of everything .30. This widespread caliber has always had the upper hand in barrel availibility, bullet selection and knowledge among the customer base.

 

[Gunnerboy]

Get a book called Cartridges of the world, then you'll see just how many other calibers there are in 22-28 that youve never heard of. The main reason the .30 is so popular is because it works and it has over a hundred years and millions of things killed to prove it.

 

[Sam1911]

While I'm a little hesitant to do this because of the huge size, here is the list of cartriges, in caliber order, for which you can buy brass from Midway:

17 Remington Fireball
17 Remington
20 OTTR
20 Tactical
204 Ruger
5.6x33 Rimmed Rook
22 Hornet
218 Bee
221 Fireball
222 Remington
222 Rimmed
223 Remington
220 Russian
219 Zipper
225 Winchester
224 Weatherby Magnum
22-250 Remington
223 Winchester Super Short Magnum
220 Swift
5.6x52mm Rimmed (22 Savage High-Power)
6x45mm (6mm-223 Remington)
6mm PPC
6mm BR (Bench Rest)
6mm XC
243 Winchester
243 Winchester Ackley Improved
243 Winchester Super Short Magnum
240 Weatherby Magnum
6mm Remington
6mm-06 Springfield
6.17 Spitfire
240 Hawk
244 H&H Magnum
240 H&H Magnum
240 Gibbs
25-20 WCF
25-20 Single Shot
256 Winchester Magnum
25-21 Stevens
25-25 Stevens
25-36 Marlin
25-35 WCF
25 Remington
250 Savage
257 Roberts
25-06 Remington
25 Gibbs
25 Winchester Super Short Magnum
257 Weatherby Magnum
6.53 Scramjet
257 STW
6.5x53 Rimmed
6.5 Grendel
264 SALZ (264 Salisbury)
6.5mm Japanese
6.5mm Carcano
6.5x54mm Mannlicher-Schoenauer
6.5 Creedmoor
6.5x47mm Lapua
260 Remington
6.5x55mm Swedish Mauser
6.5mm-257 Roberts
6.5x58mm Rimmed Sauer
256 Newton
6.5mm-284 Winchester (Norma)
6.71 Phantom
6.5mm-06 A-Square
6.5mm Remington Magnum
264 Hawk
6.5mm Gibbs
264 Winchester Magnum
6.5mm STW
6.5mm-300 Weatherby Magnum
6.8mm Remington SPC
270 Winchester
270 Winchester Short Magnum
270 Gibbs
270 Ackley Magnum
270-338 Winchester Magnum
270 Weatherby Magnum
270 STW
7x33mm Sako
7mm TCU
7mm BR (Bench Rest)
7-30 Waters
7mm-08 Remington
7x57mm Rimmed
7x72 Rimmed
7x57mm Mauser (7mm Mauser)
7mm Shooting Times Easterner
284 Winchester
7x64mm Brenneke
280 Remington
280 Remington Ackley Improved 40-Degree Shoulder
7mm Gibbs
275 H&H Magnum
7x61mm Sharpe & Hart (7x61mm Super)
7.21 Tomahawk
276 B-J Express
7mm Remington Short Action Ultra Magnum
7mm Winchester Short Magnum
7mm Remington Magnum
7mm Weatherby Magnum
7mm STW
288 Barnes Supreme
7mm-300 Weatherby Magnum
7.21 Firebird
7mm Remington Ultra Magnum
7mm Dakota
28-30 Stevens
300 Rook
300 Sherwood
307 Winchester
30 M1 Carbine
300 AAC Blackout (7.62x35mm)
30-30 Winchester
308 Marlin Express
300 Savage
30 TC
308 Winchester
30-40 Krag
7.62x53mm Rimmed
7.62x54mm Rimmed Russian
7.5x55mm Schmidt-Rubin (Swiss)
309 JDJ
30-06 Springfield
30 Gibbs
7.82 Patriot
300 Hoffman
300 Ruger Compact Magnum
300 Remington Short Action Ultra Magnum
300 Winchester Short Magnum
30-338 Winchester Magnum
308 Norma Magnum
300 H&H Magnum
30 Newton
300 Caribou
300 ICL Grizzly
300 Winchester Magnum
308 B-J Express
308 Barnes Supreme
300 Weatherby Magnum
300 Gonzo II
300 Dakota
300 Remington Ultra Magnum
7.82 Warbird
30 Super Flanged
30-378 Weatherby Magnum
300 Pegasus
300 Norma Magnum
7.62x39mm Russian
32-20 WCF
303 British
7.7x58mm (Japanese)
7.65mm Argentine Mauser
310 Cadet
8x48mm Rimmed Sauer
8.15x46mm Rimmed (318 Diameter)
8x58mm Rimmed Sauer (318 Diameter)
8x58mm Rimmed
32 Winchester Self-Loading
32-40 WCF
32 Remington
32 Winchester Special
32 Ideal
8x56mm Mannlicher-Schoenauer
8x57mm Mauser (8mm Mauser)
8x57mm JRS Rimmed Mauser
8x60mm Rimmed S Mauser
8mm-06 Springfield
8x64mm Brenneke
8mm-06 Springfield Ackley Improved
320 Hawk
325 Winchester Short Magnum (WSM)
8mm Remington Magnum
8x56mm Rimmed Hungarian Mannlicher
318 Westley Richards
333 B-J Express
333 Flanged Nitro Express
333 Jeffery Rimless
334 OKH
333 Barnes Supreme
335 OTTR
338 Spectre
338 IHMSA
338 Marlin Express
338 Federal
33 WCF
340 Gibbs
338-06 JDJ
338-06 A-Square
338-06 A-Square Ackley Improved
338 Hawk
338 Scovill
8.59 Galaxy
338 Ruger Compact Magnum
338 Winchester Magnum
338 Norma Magnum
338 A-Square
338 Baker
338-404 Express
340 Weatherby Magnum
330 Dakota
338 Remington Ultra Magnum
8.59 Titan
338 Lapua Magnum
338-378 Weatherby Magnum
348 Winchester
35 Winchester
35 Winchester Self-Loading
351 Winchester Self-Loading
9x57mm Mauser (9mm Mauser)
360 Nitro Express
400-350 Nitro Express (350 Rigby)
350 Rigby
35 Remington
356 Winchester
358 Winchester
358 JDJ
35 Gibbs
35 Whelen
35-06 JDJ
350 Remington Magnum
358 Hawk
358 Scovill
358 Norma Magnum
358 B-J Express
35 Newton
358 Shooting Times Alaskan
350 G&H Magnum
358 Yukon
358 Barnes Supreme
9.3x57mm Mauser
9.3x62mm Mauser
9.3x82mm Rimmed
9.3x74mm Rimmed
9.3 Sisk, 9.3 Barnes-Sisk
366 DGW
400-360
400-375 Nitro Express
375 Winchester
9.5x47mm Rimmed
38-56 WCF
9.5x56mm Mannlicher-Schoenauer (375 Nitro Express Rimless) (9.5mm Mannlicher-Sch
375-284 Winchester
375 Hawk-Scovill
375 Whelen Improved
375 ICL Kodiak
375 Epstein Magnum
375 H&H Magnum
375 H&H Magnum Ackley Improved
375 Flanged (Rimmed)
375 Ruger
375 Weatherby Magnum
375 Barnes Supreme
375 JRS Magnum
375 Dakota
375 Remington Ultra Magnum
375 A-Square
378 Weatherby Magnum
375 Chey-Tac
376 Steyr
38-55 WCF
38-72 WCF
375 Rimless
400 Nitro Express
395 Tatanka
38-40 WCF
40-60 Marlin
40-70 Sharps
40 Newton
10.15x61mm Jarmann
400 Hoffman
40-90 Sharps
400 Whelen Basic
400 H&H Magnum
450-400 Nitro Express
405 Basic
401 Winchester Self-Loading
40-65 WCF
40-72 WCF
40-82 WCF
408 Chey-Tac
400 A-Square (400 Pondoro)
411 Hawk Basic
404 Barnes Supreme
405 Clemens
405 Winchester
416 Ruger
416 Taylor
416 Remington Magnum
416 Accurate Reloading
416 Barnes Supreme
10.57 Meteor
416 Hoffman
416 Weatherby Magnum
416 Rigby
425 Fossdal
404 Jeffery
10.75x65mm Rimmed
10.75x68mm Mauser
44-40 WCF
444 Marlin
425 Express
43 Mauser/Spanish/Egyptian (11x60mm Rimmed Mauser, 11.15x60mm Rimmed Mauser)
11.2x72mm Schuler
43 Werndl
451 Detonics
500-450
45-100 WCF
45-110 Sharps
45-120 Sharps
45 Basic
450 Bushmaster
45-75 Winchester
577-450 Martini Henry
43 Beaumont
45-90 WCF
458 Socom
45-70 Government
458 Denali
450 Marlin
458 Acc Rel (Accurate Reloading)
458 Winchester Magnum
458 Lott
450 Alaskan
450 B-J Express
458 MCW
450 Watts Magnum
450 Barnes Supreme
450 Assegai
450 Dakota
460 Short A-Square
450 Number 2 Nitro Express 3-1/2"
450 Magnum Express
450 Nitro Express
460 Weatherby Magnum
465 H&H Magnum
500-465 Nitro Express
461 Gibbs
470 Capstick
470 Mbogo
476 Nitro Express
475 Nitro Express
470 Accurate Reloading
470 Nitro Express
475 Number 2 Nitro Express
50 Beowulf
500 Accurate Reloading
500 Mbogo
577-500 Nitro Express
Belted Magnum Basic
505 Empire
505 Barnes Supreme
505 Gibbs Magnum
50 Alaskan
50-90 Sharps
500 Nitro Express
500 A-Square Magnum
500 Jeffery
495 A-Square
50 BMG
56-50 Spencer
50-110 Winchester
50-70 Government
50-95 Winchester
12.7x44mm Rimmed Danish
577 Snyder
585 Nyati
577 Nitro Express
600 Nitro Express

(Whew!) Now the crazy part is I can think of a BUNCH of cartridges that aren't on that list!

I count about 81 cartridges above 6mm but below .30 cal. Obviously they aren't all common, but some are pretty well known. (I only see 38 true .308 cal. cartridges.)

Obviously folks have played around with just exactly how much case volume and powder need to be behind a bullet to almost every conceivable degree. I suppose there may be some question as to why we choose certain diameters over others to experiment on, but the bigger question to me is WHY we keep reinventing the wheel. Sure there are useful variations of similar rounds (rimmed vs. rimless for example) but it does seem we take specialization to absurd degrees.

Probably some of it is just marketing. Winchester doesn't want to put out rifles in Remington's new cartridge, but wants one just (nearly) EXACTLY (almost) like it. Some of it is kind of obsessively extreme boundary-pushing with costs in barrel life and recoil that few folks really want to pay (Lazzeroni's stuff?). A lot of it is merely obsolete rounds that were perhaps optimized for 19th century technology and are surpassed by more efficient loadings today. Still...doesn't really matter what caliber you pick -- there are a LOT of cartridges out there.

 

[lizziedog1]

Nice list Sam!

But I was looking at current reloading manuals figuring what they list what are more common and easier to get components to reload for.

Yes, you can get brass and dies for all those round listed above through mail order firms. But which ones will you find on shelves of Cabelas or Sportsman's Warehouse?

I counted 41, 30 calibers cartridges on your list and only 7, 270 caliber cartridges.

The 30 caliber development has become downright silly. Its like some gun company executive wakes up this morning and proclaims to his staff that he came up with a cartridge that will turn the shooting world upsidedown. He tells them it is short, 30 caliber round that will launch a 30 caliber bullet at about the same velocity as a 30-06 and yet be the size of a 308 Winchester case.

His fellow employees cheer and break out the bubbly. The next issue of Gun Rag Magazine will have a full blown article about this wonderful new cartridge with never seen before ballistics. This seems to happen several times a year.

 

[Sam1911]

Cabelas? Here's the list of rifle calibers they keep in stock. How many of these are on the shelf in the brick & mortar store every day, I don't know. Quite a few, from what I remember. Certainly not possibly all of them.

.17 HMR
.17 Mach 2
.17 Remington
.17 Remington Fireball
.204 Ruger
.218 Bee
.22 Hornet
.22 Long
.22 LR
.22 LR HV (High Velocity)
.22 Short
.22 Winchester Magnum
.22 WMR
.22 WRF
.22-250 Remington
.220 Swift
.221 Remington Fireball
.222 Remington
.223 Remington
.223 Winchester Super Short Magnum
.240 Weatherby Magnum
.243 Winchester
.243 Winchester Super Short Magnum
.25 Winchester Super Short Magnum
.25-06 Remington
.25-06 Winchester
.25-20 Winchester
.250 Savage
.257 Roberts
.257 Weatherby
.257 Weatherby Magnum
.260 Remington
.264 Winchester Magnum
.270 Weatherby Magnum
.270 Winchester
.270 Winchester Short Magnum
.270 WSM
.280 Ackley
.280 Remington
.284 Winchester
.30 Carbine
.30 Rem. AR
.30 T/C
.30-06 Springfield
.30-30 Winchester
.30-378 Weatherby Magnum
.30-40 Krag
.300 H&H Magnum
.300 Rem. SA Ultra Magnum
.300 Remington Ultra Magnum
.300 Ruger Compact Magnum
.300 Savage
.300 Weatherby Magnum
.300 Winchester Magnum
.300 Winchester Short Magnum
.303 British
.307 Winchester
.308 Marlin Express
.308 Norma Magnum
.308 Winchester
.32 Winchester Special
.32-20 Winchester
.32-40 Winchester
.325 Winchester Short Magnum
.338 Federal
.338 Lapua Magnum
.338 Marlin Express
.338 Remington Ultra Magnum
.338 Ruger Compact Magnum
.338 Winchester Magnum
.338-378 Weatherby Magnum
.340 Weatherby Magnum
.348 Winchester
.35 Remington
.35 Whelen
.375 H&H
.375 Remington Ultra Magnum
.375 Winchester
.378 Weatherby Magnum
.38-40 Winchester
.38-55 Winchester
.40-60 Winchester
.405 Winchester
.416 Remington
.416 Rigby
.416 Weatherby Magnum
.444 Marlin
.45-110 Sharps
.45-120 Sharps
.45-70 Government
.45-90 Winchester
.450 Bushmaster
.450 Marlin
.454 Casull
.458 Lott
.458 Winchester Magnum
.460 Smith & Wesson Magnum
.460 Weatherby Magnum
.470 Nitro Express
.50 Beowulf
.50 BMG
.50-90 Government
.50-95 Winchester
.505 Gibbs
.56-50 Spencer
.577 Snider
.577/450 Martini-Henry
5.45x39
5.56 NATO
5.7x28mm
6.5 Creedmoor
6.5 x 284 Norma
6.5 x 52mm Carcano
6.5 x 55
6.5x 50 Japanese
6.5x50mm Japanese
6.5x52 Carcano
6.5x55
6.8 Remington SPC
6mm Remington
7.5x55 Swiss
7.62 x 39
7.62 x 51 NATO
7.62 x 54R
7.65x53 Argentine
7.7 x 58mm Japanese
7mm Remington Magnum
7mm Remington Ultra Magnum
7mm SA Ultra
7mm STW
7mm Weatherby Magnum
7mm Winchester Short Magnum
7mm-08
7x30
7x57mm Mauser
8 x 56 R Hungarian Mannlicher
8 x 57mm Mauser
8mm Remington Magnum
8x57 Mauser
9.3 x 74R
9.3x62

 

[68wj]

America has a soft spot for .30 Cal, and other calibers have to shout from its shadows (even if they perform better, whatever your definition of performance is). Nothing new, and I don't see it changing any time soon.

 

[BrocLuno]

All about sales and market share. If there is away to get someone to try something "new" it'll be out for while. Much easier to get the casual hunter to try a different cartridge that fits their existing rifle than it is to get someone to change rifles as long as they are comfortable with what they have.

Most folks have .30, .22, and maybe something in between. 30-06 and 30-30 are still way up there in annual sales (world wide), so that ain't going anywhere. 303 is falling as more Commonwealth countries restrict guns one way or another, but it's still a player. And 7mm is still out there because of all the former Eruo colonies with with old weapon inventories.

223/5.56 is catching up, but it has limits hunting. So, where does that leave most folks?

 

[Bio-Chem]

The real question is "isn't diversity great"? Just because the 30 06 is over a hundred years old and has been used to successfully take every game animal on the north american continent (and others) doesn't mean there isn't room for other cool .30's out there. we love diversity. Sometimes it's fun owning a caliber none of your buddies has. The US military has had a long love affair with .30 cal and it probably won't go away. that love affair has had a distinct trickle down effect upon US civilian shooters.

There is only so much the writing of the great jack o'connor can do for the .270 caliber. It does have me wondering why the .308 wasn't ever necked down to .270? or maybe it was and i don't know about it? Just because it's been necked down to 6.5 mm and 7 mm doesn't mean they shouldn't try .270 does it? the 30 06 was necked down to all those as well.

 

[Freedom_fighter_in_IL]

Bio-Chem, A friend of mine had just such a rifle chamber cut a while back and gave that a whirl. Needless to say it was not very worth-while. My 7mm.08's outperformed it in just about every way. Flatter trajectory, less recoil, better choice of bullets. One thing I did like about it was it was a hard hitting thumper. He had it loaded up with 150gr Hornady Interlocks and I had the 139gr Interlocks. At 200 yards, wet phonebook tests, he penetrated about 3 inches more than my 7mm.08 consistently. He shot a few deer with it and did like it which I guess is all that matters. Was getting a little flatter trajectory than a .308 and a bit more speed and hitting a bit harder than the 7mm.08

Have to agree with what most others have said here when it comes to the .30cal. And also have to agree that enough is enough. You can only go so fast (until they come up with a faster burn than gunpowder) and you can only get so tough a bullet (deer are not bullet-proof).

 

[Bio-Chem]

And that's the thing. Bullet selection would of course play huge role in effectiveness, but for me the idea of using a wildcat very few others have would be appealing. Diversity is fun. If it was all about finding an effective deer round we would have stopped at the 30-06 and stopped innovating

 

[MachIVshooter]

Now the crazy part is I can think of a BUNCH of cartridges that aren't on that list!

Obsolete, Wilcat & Proprietary, European, Asian, etc.

The number of ~.30 cal military rifle cartridges developed 1890-1940 alone is notable. Off the top of my head:

.30 Carbine
.30-40 Krag
.30-06 Sprg.
.303 British
7.35x51 Carcano
7.62x54R Soviet
7.65 Argentine Mauser
7.7x58 Arisaka
7.5x54 MAS
7.5x55 Swiss

Only the Germans strayed from ~.30 cal (well, the 7.35 Carcano is .29 cal., never really made it, and the Italians fought WWII with mostly 6.5 and converted 8x57mm Carcani. They also fought on both sides and within)

 

[Jim K]

A good part of the popularity of the .30 is that it was the U.S. service caliber from 1892 to the 1960's. And why was the .30 chosen to begin with? The Army Ordnance officer who made the decision (I used to know his name, but age is catching up with me), told a reporter that "it seemed like a nice round number."

Today, they would spend millions of dollars on tests and run hundreds of thousands of computer simulations to make a choice like that.

Jim