Confused on 1872 colt revolver, any help?

[lets talk auction]

I need help understanding and or identifying a Colt 1871 1872 revolver. For starters the serial # is 52xx,and all #'s match except the cylinder, the frame is stamped 1871 1872 36cal, the top of the barrel reads Address Col. Sam Colt New York US America. The cylinder maintians the rolled engraved stagecoach scene and reads Colts Patent No.204.
Here's where I'm having problems, this pistol has a 5 shot not a 6 shot cylinder and a octagon not a round barrel. View pictures at this link http://www.letstalkauction.com/colt1872_001.htm and hope someone can help. Greg

 

[dfariswheel]

My copy of Haven and Belden's "History of the Colt Revolver: 1836 to 1940" shows the 1872 conversion on page 143.

It describes it as a FIVE shot revolver in 38 Rim fire caliber, and shows a round barrel.
It says the trigger guard is marked .36 Caliber which was the original caliber, which was not removed during conversion.

These guns were made from mixed parts of the 1862 Police, 1862 Pocket Navy, and the 1849 Pocket.

My older copy of the Blue Book says that these were also made in a .38 Center Fire, AND that parts were intermixed between the 1862 Police, 1862 Pocket Navy and the 1849 Pocket.
According to the Blue Book, as parts were used up, Colt used whatever mix of parts were available resulting in a huge amount of minor variations.

Serial numbers are from all three model ranges.

The Blue Book specifically lists a 4 1/2 inch octagon barrel model with a rebated Pocket Navy cylinder.

So, from all this, it appears that you could have any mix of the three guns, including the receiver. So you could have a 1849 receiver with a 1862 receiver or any combination of the three models.

In your case, you have a 1849 barrel at least.

Prices are shockingly high on these.
My 1998 Blue Book shows prices from $650 in 10% condition to $7000 in 100%.

 

[BluesBear]

Looks like you have a Colt's New Model Pocket Pistol Of Navy Caliber that has been copnverted to cartridge use.

Specifications for the original revolver are;

They were made from 1890-61 to 1872.

Length - 9.5"
Length of Barrel - 4.5"
Caliber - .36
Number of shots - 5
Shape of Cylinder - Rebated Round
Engraving of Cylinder - Stagecoach Holdup
Shape of Slots - Rectangular
Shape of Barrel - Octagonal
Triggerguard - Oval Brass - Frame Regular
Weight - 1 lb 9 oz

Barrel Address - Col. Sam'l Colt, U.S.America
Cylinder - Colts Patent 15776
Frame - Colt's Patent, 36 Cal.


Remarks. This model was made on the frame and grips of the Model of 1849 Pocket Pistol by cutting the frame to allow for the size of the rebated .36 caliber cylinder.


Above information is from A History Of The Colt Revolver by Charles T. Haven & Frank A. Belden ©1950


That is has a barrel not cut for a hinged lever ramrod makes it a rare variation. Most were made with rammers.

As stated above, the patent number should be #15776.
#204 is way too low to be a Colt's patent.

I hope this helps.

 

[BluesBear]

Part 2

According to the book quoted from above, when this model was converted to cartridge it was fitted with a 3.5" round barrel. Look like yours has the original.

The specs are the same except for the caliber being .38 Rimfire.

The markings should be;

Barrel - Colt's Pt. F.A. Mfg. Co., Hartford, Ct., U.S.A.
Cylinder - Colt's Patent and number of gun
Frame - Pat. July 25, '71. July 2, '72
Triggerguard - .36 Cal.


Since all of the numbers match I'd say you have a factory produced model using an original barrel.

Take it to the CCA convention in Louisville this October. It would be a highlight I am sure.

 

[Jim Watson]

It is gun no 5B-127 in Flayderman's.
He calls it simply a "Colt 4 1/2" Octagon Barrel Revolver."
"Made c. 1873-1875; total quantity about 4000.
.38 rimfire, 5-shot cylinder. The octagonal barrel without ejector, the loading lever cutout plugged. Serial numbered as in preface material; in percussion and metallic cartridge ranges. Barrel markings
-Address Col. Saml Colt New York U.S. America-
Left side of frame marked either Colt's/Patent or with 1871 and 1872 dates. Cylinder roll scene depicts the stagecoach holdup. Key identifying features are the 4 1/2" octagonal barrel without ejector and the cylinder with stagecoach holdup scene."

Which matches your description and pictures.

In the preface, he says serial numbers fall
"2. In the Model 1862 Police and Pocket Navy range, again primarily in the higher numbers."

So this one is a conversion on a Pocket Navy C&B and is a bit unusual with low serial number 5200 out of 47,000. Looks in good condition, too.

 

[Jim K]

The reason for the low serial number is that that revolver is not a conversion. Colt made many of them up from unfinished and unnumbered parts and numbered them in a new series; they used old octagon barrels, or made new round ones with seemingly no particular order. I have a round barrel one (Flayderman 5B-132), # 4109. Pocket Navy and Police models were converted, left over parts for those guns were used, or new parts were made, again in no particular order.

IMHO, collectors who try to make sense out of those guns and talk about this or that serial range are in cloud cuckoo land. Colt was just trying to use up old parts and sell otherwise unsaleable guns (and make a buck).

When dealing with Colts, there is an old saying, "Remember, Sam Colt NEVER threw anything away." His successors continued the tradition.

Jim