Deputies killed-

[Jeb Stuart]

This was last Sept. maybe you have seen it. Really hard to watch as you find out the two deputies were shot and killed. I am posting this to show how easy it is to be a victim. How fast a bad guy can draw and shoot. One nut case that can live right next door to you that is out of his mind.
WARNING VERY HARD TO WATCH.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/dashcam-video-man-kills-2-deputies-opens-fire-with-rifles_2665702.html

 

[BLB68]

I feel bad for the officers involved and for their families.

A couple of observations:

1. The officer let the subject keep a hand in his pocket throughout the entire interview.
2. The subject wasn't very proficient with his rifle. He was very slow to clear a malfunction and the rifle wasn't in the pocket of his shoulder; the stock can be seen bouncing all over the place. Yet he was still deadly.

My personal takeaways are to always be alert, to watch the hands*, and not to underestimate anyone's capability to inflict harm.


*Note: The video had the actual shooting edited out, but I don't think the hand in the pocket was on the weapon. It looks like the subject swept his shirt to draw with his other hand.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

The shooter threatened to kill the young man. What was interesting the Young man, was just doing typical Juvenile crap, but from the video he was polite and no threat. Just glad the kid was not shot by this Nutcase. It seems his family did the right thing and called the police.
Yes, I think the deputies made a few mistakes. And your are right. I posted this as a message to alway's be aware and your point of watching the hand is a good observation.

 

[jmorris]

How fast a bad guy can draw and shoot.

You can say that again 2:02 into the video he looks to be drawing a pistol and instantly is at least two car lengths away coming out of the house wearing a vest with two rifles, put on a pair of gloves and even changed out of his shorts for a pair of blue jeans! That’s super hero speed or something is missing.

I don’t believe in super hero’s so there is more to this story than that video. What in the world transpired between the officer having ahold of him to letting him go back inside his house, change and arm himself? That is what got them killed.

Unless I am to assume he shot the officer that grabbed him as well as the one at the front car, then went back inside to gear up? At that point the “warning very hard to watch” part is a bit misleading because then all I see is a bad guy getting shot and giving up.

 

[Matthew Temkin]

I think he shot and killed both deputies with the pistol before going back inside for the rifles.
The officers returning fire must have been backups.

 

[<*(((><]

Video to small to see, the sound makes it seem like he has an auto sear, lightning link, but the ejection speed doesn’t.

Coward needs the needle or rot in jail.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

Watch the video. Notice how the shooter is facing at a angle of the Officer, his strong arm away from him. The whole movement starts about 1 or 2 seconds before this Picture when he is bringing his hand to the weapon.

Notice at around the 2 minute mark int he video, right when the Officer say's the word "Arrest" is beginning of the drawing from the shooter. The officer in the back, it would seem to have been able to observe the right hand of the shooter and been ready.
I do not mean to judge the Officers. Just pointing out a few observations.

Confession below. Interesting that he say's his son is a Deputy Sheriff.
Shooter was known as a hot head.

https://www.macon.com/news/local/crime/article218386485.html

 

[SSN Vet]

Very disturbing... that a guy will just murder two police officers because hes' not getting his way with the neigbors. And then he suits up and goes full nut case with an AR and mag vest.

He wasn't so tough when he was injured, and has the gaul to plee for mercy, fully expecting them to grant it and take him to the hospital.

My BIL is a state police detective and his son is active duty US Army MP, who has always wanted to follow his dad's footsteps. The son married last year and his wife is expecting their first child. After a long heart to heart, my BIL talked his son out of a post army career as an LEO, because he thinks things are going to continue to get a lot worse for cops in the furture.

He's a hard working kid who's stayed out of trouble and he'll have many good options in this strong economy. Why should he jeopardize the well being of his family?

 

[Jeb Stuart]

So what do you take away from this video. For myself, is as a civilian is to be aware. Avoid confrontations at all cost. I have seen many videos like this over the 10 years I started to carry. In most cases, it seems the bad guy alway's has the edge. Most are up close and in most all cases I have seen only a few shots fired. At least where I live. What is more important than my gun or protection is training self discipline to be on guard and aware of my surroundings and again, avoid any confrontations. And as far as my Carry, quickness of draw and of course accuracy. Big bore guns, multiple magazines, ability to shoot from car, to car, building to building etc. is not what most civilian EDC persons have to focus on.

 

[Godsgunman]

Sad sad sad. I feel for those who serve and the uncertainty they face. Definitely not an expert or leo myself but what I see even from 'routine' traffic stops and the like the cops always ask the perp if they have anything on them and tell them to keep hands out of pockets where they can see them.
This wasn't a 'routine' stop or visit. The cops imo should have had their guards up to begin with already knowing he had threatened the neighbors. The cops 'seem' to let their guards down since the guy initially presents himself as calm and reasonable. His demeanor led them to believe he wasn't a threat. Again, I'm just going off of what I'm observing from the video. If hands were visible the whole time things could have been different.

Horrible situation

 

[Jeb Stuart]

I knew from watching the video that this guy was trouble. Especially when the Officer asked him where his gun was and the shooter replied "What difference does that make"? At this point he was uncooperative. So many things should alert the average EDC. One if the police did come to my house, I would have secured my weapon in the house if I was carrying and never walked out of the house to meet them with a weapon on my person. And this dope did this after he admitted he was drinking, and right after he threatened the life of someone.

This guy was a ticking time bomb and something bad would have happened down the road. And the guy doing wheelies up and down the front of the guy's house, one that he knew would be out to argue with him was wrong as well. Hopefully, the police did see the video and arrest the motorcycle driver for reckless driving, disturbing the peace and on and on.

 

[WestKentucky]

I preach situational awareness in all areas of life. While driving you have to watch not only what your doing, but what is going on around you. It’s no different in this situation, officers should have had better awareness of the guys hands and when he went to a position to retrieve a weapon they should have been alert enough to get the drop on him. No different in seeing a hand reach for a gun than it is seeing a deer run out of the woods towards the road, or in seeing that a person walks into a gas station with a hood on, pocket bulging and looking down. You see what’s happening and your awareness will guide your actions to maintain your safety. Parents grow an odd extension of this in knowing what’s going on around their kids and keeping them safe, just as partners should (and often do) in law enforcement.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

I preach situational awareness in all areas of life. While driving you have to watch not only what your doing, but what is going on around you. It’s no different in this situation, officers should have had better awareness of the guys hands and when he went to a position to retrieve a weapon they should have been alert enough to get the drop on him. No different in seeing a hand reach for a gun than it is seeing a deer run out of the woods towards the road, or in seeing that a person walks into a gas station with a hood on, pocket bulging and looking down. You see what’s happening and your awareness will guide your actions to maintain your safety. Parents grow an odd extension of this in knowing what’s going on around
their kids and keeping them safe, just as partners should (and often do) in law enforcement.

Yes indeed!! I preach situational awareness all the time for DRIVING. And any fool that uses a cell phone while driving especially text messaging should never be able to own a firearm or drivers license. And any gun owners that do text messaging at all while driving but then advocate safe gun handling is the biggest hypocrite that I have ever known. Put your stupid cell phone away while driving!

 

[Walkalong]

So what do you take away from this video.

It's hard to fight crazy. They would have had to be on much higher alert than they were to keep him from drawing and shooting them both the way they were set up when he draws a pistol. They were caught completely unaware. Like posted, situational awareness. Yes, it looked harmless, but they were obviously dealing with a crazy man. It's hard to fight crazy. Wrong place, wrong time. But if they had been more alert and concerned about the man, they may have been able to react in time to save them selves.

 

[jmorris]

For myself, is as a civilian is to be aware. Avoid confrontations at all cost.

Has worked in my life. With just about everything.

 

[jmorris]

For myself, is as a civilian is to be aware. Avoid confrontations at all cost.

Has worked in my life. With just about everything.

Can’t work for LEO, that’s their job. Even a lot of military has moved to police vs elimination of threat role, over the years.

 

[paulsj]

Wearing bulletproof vests would have helped.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

Yes, this man was obviously for lack of a better word, "Crazy". I would guess he might have issues in his life that needed some kind of therapy. That combined with neighbors that most likely did in fact make his life miserable. Combined with alcohol, he went over the top.
One thing that worries me when I Carry in my vehicle is road rage--I will make a separate post..

 

[paulsj]

Yes, this man was obviously for lack of a better word, "Crazy". I would guess he might have issues in his life that needed some kind of therapy. That combined with neighbors that most likely did in fact make his life miserable. Combined with alcohol, he went over the top.
One thing that worries me when I Carry in my vehicle is road rage--I will make a separate post..

I would have saved them by offering them leave of absence so they could work with dietician to loose weight. Where I'm from physical fitness is prerequisite to being in law enforcement. Good physical fitness means better agility, heath,.....and being able to wear body armor. Two main reasons for their demise is easy availability of fireams and not wearing body armor.

 

[Milt1]

I'm hoping that better police tactics will result from this horrible shooting. Perhaps if the two officers were not facing the shooter side by side but rather one in front and one in back may have resulted in a different outcome.

 

[JohnKSa]

He wasn't so tough when he was injured, and has the gaul to plee for mercy, fully expecting them to grant it and take him to the hospital.

It is very irritating. He even kept shooting for awhile after being hit initially, trying to kill some more people until he felt he couldn't go on any longer.

The same guy who will murder someone in cold blood (or try to) without showing any mercy at all will immediately beg for mercy when things don't go their way. In the neighborhood where I used to live, a guy came into a gunshop, got the proprietor to turn around for something on the shelf and then stuck a bayonet into his back. Then he came around the counter and pressed the attack, badly slicing the owner's arm and nearly amputating some of his fingers. The owner managed to draw his Walther PPK and emptied it into the guy from the floor as the attacker stood over him preparing to finish him off. Before he died, the man begged the owner to stop shooting him. I've always been struck the incongruity of the man's actions and his apparent belief that he deserved mercy after doing his absolute level best to kill another person in a completely unprovoked attack.

But from what I have seen in dashcam/bodycam/security cam videos of shootings, it's pretty common.

 

[george29]

FBI chief called it "The Ferguson Effect".

Cops are more afraid due to litigation and social media and are slower on the draw. As it is, action almost always beats reaction.

Too much mental illness and self entitlement in the world, it's going to get worse.

 

[blue32]

Even with your gun out, its not fast enough. I went to a lot of domestics expecting a scenario that follows. I've been lucky so far.

 

[jmorris]

One thing talking to a guy outside with two officers present with no visual firearm.

Another thing to call in, “blood on the driveway, female’s visible inside, unresponsive, we’re about to force entry.” and not have an entry team.

Again different “clips” from different views that don’t show the whole picture. Not near as misleading at the OP video though, from what they did provide.

Other ways to handle that situation.