Dodged a bullet with reman ammo...

[Jackal]

I purchased a loose case of reman .223 a couple years ago from American Gun Wrangler, LLC. Well, today just before loading a mag from the freshly opened case, I decided to weigh a random sample of 10 rounds to see how consistent they were. Well, that was a good idea. The first 3 rounds weighed about 170gr, the 4th one weighed 140gr.... Uh oh. Pulled the bullet, no powder.

I sat down and weighed EVERY SINGLE ROUND of that 1,000rd case. I had 6 primer only charges. I'm so very glad I listened to my gut and weighed them. A squib load in my new AR would have been very bad, let alone 6 of them...:banghead:

Now I'm trying to figure out, what propellent they used 30gr of behind a 55gr pill... I'd ask them, but they presumably went out of business, go figure.

 

[rcmodel]

55 + 30.0 ??
I can't even imagine what powder that could be??
Even with a 40 grain bullet??

Boy, they got you coming & going didn't they!!

I would pull them all and salvage the components!!!!

They are not safe to shoot.

rc

 

[Jackal]

Though I'm not very knowledgeable when it comes to reloading, I cant find a single load online that calls for 30gr of anything. Shaking the cases, I cant hear the charges, its like the cases are full.

 

[captain awesome]

could be a slower really dense powder, if it is it might not perform well anyway and you could end up with unburned powder and slower velocities than a more optimal powder. That would be best case scenario, worst; KABOOM. Do you know why they went out of business? perhaps looking into it could shed some light on the subject. While it would pain me to throw away so much powder (which if you pulled these that is exactly what you should do with an unknown) I think RCs suggestion is the safest and best one. I know its not a be all end all place for load info, but when I am looking for loads, the first place I start is the Hodgdon website. I checked their listed loads for 223 and 55 grain bullets, the closest MAX load listed was 27.8 grains. you could also try to work up a safe load for your rifle with the powder. the other option would be to fire one and examine the fired case closely for pressure signs. beyond that I have no further suggestions.
again the first option is your best and safest, the last is the most risky. if I were you I would go with option one.

 

[Lafitte]

Probably wasn't a canister grade powder.

Lafitte

 

[MErl]

Given your story my gut tells me they used whatever powder they could find the cheapest that might possibly work. Surplus WC860 for 50cal stayed very cheap during the panic.

I don't think there is any way to know what was put in there.

 

[joem1945]

Pull the bullets, dump the powder and save the cases. If all those have 30 grains it might be 4 pounds of powder, maybe $100.00. If you rifle and body parts are worth more than $100.00 DUMP THE POWDER!

 

[Sunray]

Phone: (253) 218-4185
3716 Auburn Way N Ste 102, Auburn, WA 98002
[email protected]
http://www.americangunwrangler.com
americangunwrangler.com is owned by Web Management International of Maple Valley, WA. Registration expires next Jan.
There's also one in Missoula, MT.
Says their site is down for maintenance. No BBB rating and not BBB accredited.
Nobody publishes what components they use. Mind you, it's unlikely AGW did the reloading themselves. Likely loaded by Montana Ammunition Company.

 

[ApacheCoTodd]

I'm with the "yank 'em all" crowd above.

Likely, the only concern is not merely the identified zero charge rounds but a general and possibly unsafe level of attention to the re-loading in general.

Pull 'em all and use the scrap powder for something fun then reassemble with "knowns".

Todd.

 

[jerkface11]

Call the manufacturer maybe they will fix it for you.

 

[HankB]

Heaviest load I could find for a 55 grain bullet was 29.4 grains of 760, from an old Sierra manual.

I would NOT shoot any of these reloads. Either discard them entirely, or disassemble and discard the powder.

I understand smokeless powder makes decent lawn fertilizer . . .

 

[Jim K]

I second pulling down the ammo and salvaging bullets and (maybe) cases.

I would advise the manufacturer but wouldn't even try to get them to replace the ammo; they might just send more ammo without powder or the wrong powder or the wrong load. A company that had no QC a couple of years ago MIGHT have changed, but I wouldn't bet my eyes or fingers on it.

Jim

 

[P.B.Walsh]

Lotta bullet pulling hammering. What would be a better idea for large quanity bullet pulling?

 

[TheVision]

A press mounted bullet puller.

 

[jimbeaux82]

Hornady Cam Loc Bullet Puller or RCBS Press Mounted Bullet Puller.

 

[gamestalker]

IMO, the estimated powder charge doesn't the assumption of an incorrect charge for that weight bullet, not at all. My reasoning here is based on inconsistencies of both the brass and the bullets. As an example, and one as recent as yesterday when I was loading some .270 win., shows just how a combined weight variance with regard to brass and bullets could account for the questionable powder charge, and with more than just one or two powders.

Granted, the brass and bullets that apply to .270 win represent heavier class brass and bullet. I would be using .223 for this purpose, but I haven't worked with it recently enough to recall actual observed weights, so I'll basr my hypotheses on a percentage, which should provide a fairly close example.

An average 130 gr. bullet, Speer hot Core in this instance and ofjust two random bullets weighed, with the heaviest weighing 131.9 grs. the lightest was 129.6 grs. I realize that's just 2 bullets, but it gives some idea.

Now brass is a completely different story, that unless it's match grade brass, it will usually have a pretty large variance. I didn't look to see if the OP's reman cartridges were mixed head stamps or not, so that too can make a big difference. Anyway, of only 4 random pieces of brass weighed, two were Winchester, the other 2 were R.P.. All were were trimmed to exact lengths.

The Winchester brass weighed 137.9 grs. and 138.6 grs.
The R.P. brass weighed 146.8 grs. and 147.5 grs..

So just from a very basic comparison of heaviest to lightest weight of brass, we're talking about nearly 10.0 grs. of weight, that alone could account for the possible over charge being considered. Toss in the bullet weight variance, and we're over 10.0 grs.. The powder tables for a 55 gr. bullet are easily within range of published charges with that weight bullet when considering the brass variance alone.

Gs


.

 

[SSN Vet]

If the cases are not identical, the weight of the loaded cartridges can vary quite a bit, even if the bullet and powder charge are identical.

I have, however, found that given identical cases, the weights are very consistent.

but.... even the same brand case, with a slightly different appearing head stamp, can vary in weight 10 gr.

 

[chris in va]

Before you do anything, contact the manufacturer. If that doesn't pan out pull one of the legitimate rounds and weigh the powder charge...and if possible take a close picture of the powder. Inquiring minds want to know!

 

[gamestalker]

That's what I'm saying SSN Vet, variations in brass weight can easily account for what appears to be a powder charge issue.

This is a thread all it's own, which has been discussed a time or two. A lot of folks think that weighing loaded cartridges will shed light on the charge contained within, which initially seems to make sense. Unfortunately, unless we know the weight of the components, especially the brass with bottle necks, we can't know how much of the total weight is actually powder.

Handgun is a whole other nightmare, in which case the powder charge is so small, it's difficult to even know if a case even has a charge, much less how much that charge weighs. Bullet weights alone can vary by that of the suspected powder charge in many instances. Toss into the equation weight variations of brass, and there is no way to know with any certainty what is, or isn't in the cartridge, regarding powder charges.

GS

 

[joem1945]

+1 on the Hornady Cam Loc bullet puller. I've salvaged thousands of bullets and cases with it.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

After I saw someone's AR blow up (upper and lower completely destroyed but no body parts destroyed) due to cheap ammo, I have lost interest in re manufactured or cheap ammo.