Does anyone else think the 20 gauge is underappreciated/underrated?

[Jason_W]

I'm biased as I was given a 20 ga. 870 express for my 11th birthday and in the decades since, it's taken more game than all of the other guns I've owned combined.

I've found that it can do about 90 percent of what a 12 gauge can, but with ammo that takes up significantly less space and with guns that are often lighter and sleeker. I don't think I've ever missed a game bid with my 20 that I would have hit with a 12.

Granted, if I ever had to hunt deer with buckshot I'd want a 12 or even a 10 since the 20 gauge's bore diameter makes the largest practical shot size #1 buck. Similarly, If I was a hunter of large waterfowl I'd want something bigger.

For most other applications, however, it seems like the target won't know the difference between a 20 and a 12. Home defense: What's the ultimate effect of 20 #2 buck pellets and 9 #00 pellets placed where they need to be? Upland game: That's all about having a good even pattern and a gun that fits well. Deer: The 12 has a definite advantage in terms of energy with slugs, but again, with a well placed slug, a deer won't know the difference between the two.

The big problem is factory support. The 20 gauge is as ignored and dismissed by ammo makers as it is by the hunting and shooting public, which limits options in both firearms and ammo. Trying to find factory loaded lead-free slugs (as will soon be mandated state wide in California for hunting), for instance is problematic. I don't think Ddupleks makes a slug for the 20 anymore.Thankfully handloading is somewhat of a solution for this.

Still, it would be nice if manufacturers paid a little more attention to the 20 gauge.

 

[George P]

You could also learn to reload, especially for any unique ones.

 

[Mn Fats]

I don't think its under appreciated. Plenty of offerings out there for the 20 Ga. What's the most popular shotgun chambering behind 12 Ga? Its 20 ga.

Now that poor 16 Ga I love so much, THAT'S under appreciated.

 

[Crawdad1]

I agree and its a great upland game gun. But if you're only going to have one shotgun which a lot of people do most would choose a 12 gauge.

There's nothing a 12 gauge can't do.

 

[22250Rem]

Never owned a 20 ga. in my life and in my younger days when "bigger is better" my shotguns were all in 12 ga. except for the old 16 ga. that was my dad's. But over the years I began to notice that the 20 ga. was indeed pretty darn useful and practical. In my area I don't see the 20 ga. as being ignored and dismissed by ammo makers and the general shooting public. I'd bet that it's one of those regional things depending on what part of the country we are looking at. There are plenty of 20 ga. guns & ammo available around here. The longer 20 ga. magnum stuff is, IMHO, one of the primary reasons for the decline of the 16 ga.. For deer hunting in slug zones a 20 ga. sabot slug is as good as it gets. The deer can't tell the difference and I've come to regard my fully rifled 12 ga. 870 as "overkill". If I had to replace my slug gun today I'd be looking at a Savage 220... A fully rifled 20 ga. bolt action slug gun. Buddy of mine has one and I've seen 20 ga. sabots cleanly take large deer easily at about 100 yds.. I've also seen other 220's at the range printing very small groups at 100 yds.. All this with less recoil than my 12 ga. What's not to like? Shot sporting clays last summer with my 12 ga. Browning Citori alongside another friends 20 ga. Beretta and I don't feel that my 12 offered that much advantage over the 20 as all the other 20 ga. shooters don't seem to be very handicapped either. Modern 20 ga. stuff is so good that as previously mentioned, the decline of 16 ga. stuff was primarily due to how good the 20 ga. stuff has become. Luckily I still get 16 ga. ammo around here and there but 20 ga. is as common as 12 ga. in this part of the country.

 

[Fiv3r]

I never had a 20 gauge growing up. It was a very popular first shotgun for kids, but my parents were into shooting or hunting, so I never got one
I will say that as someone who doesn't really need a full power 12 gauge to punch holes in paper, the 20 makes sense. I'm a pretty beefy guy, but I don't enough recoil fr recoil sake like some do.

I've been kicking around getting a Shockwave for fun, but after watching Hickok's son's review on the 20, it might make more sense in a gun designed to be fired without a shoulder stock. The mini shells in 12g are fine, but I have never seen them on the shelves. 20 is everywhere. Is it a second place to 12g? Of course. However, instead of 10 different facing of 12, there are ONLY 5 of 20...not exactly hen's teeth.

16 has always intrigued me. My granddad filled the stew pot for decades with and old Stevens bolt in 16.

 

[expat_alaska]

There are plenty of 20 ga. guns & ammo available around here. The longer 20 ga. magnum stuff is, IMHO, one of the primary reasons for the decline of the 16 ga. For deer hunting in slug zones a 20 ga. sabot slug is as good as it gets. The deer can't tell the difference and I've come to regard my fully rifled 12 ga. 870 as "overkill". Modern 20 ga. stuff is so good that as previously mentioned, the decline of 16 ga. stuff was primarily due to how good the 20 ga. stuff has become. Luckily I still get 16 ga. ammo around here and there but 20 ga. is as common as 12 ga. in this part of the country.

Time to reminisce. As a young teen I hunted pheasant and ruffed grouse (partridge/"pats" in the local vernacular) in Michigan with a Springfield Arms (Chicopee Falls, Mass, later bought out by Savage/Stevens) single-shot break-open 20 gauge 26" mod choke. No recoil pad, light to carry all day (even for me back then), and I took nearly as many birds as the adults with their pump, auto, and O/U guns in the mid 60's. In my first 2 years with the adults my basic job was to go into the "cedar swamps" with hip boots (as they referred to it) to flush out birds in lieu of a dog. Basic training. When you only have one shot you learn early to make it count.

My Dad acquired an A.H. Fox Sterlingworth SxS double-trigger 20 gauge 26" Mod/IC chokes hard buttplate that weighed barely over 5 lbs. Very nice to carry but it would beat the crap out of your cheek, which brings me to my next point.

Much perceived recoil can be attributed to the stock configuration. The Fox 20 had a drop at the heel of over 3" with a very thin comb. The Springfield Arms 20 was about 2-3/4" and had a fat comb, which was much more comfortable to shoot.

My favorite upland bird/skeet gun in the late 60's-early 70's was an 870 12 gauge 26" vent rib IC choke with an unbelievable 2-1/2" drop. Good cheek weld and one could see all of the top of the rib.

At the same time my Dad had a Win Model 12 28" FC field grade made in 1932, inherited when my Grandpa died. He reblued it courtesy of Herter's Belgian Blue solution (hot tank) with me in 1969 and had a birdseye maple buttstock and fore-end from E.C. Bishop/Warsaw, MO for it. Came back home on leave from the USAF in 1972 on opening day of pheasant season in Nebraska and used it. Not gloating, but it was the longest shot I ever made on a pheasant kill at 60+ paces. I was using his Remington Express high brass/high base 1-1/8 oz 7-1/2 shot. We brought it back to the road at the end of the cornfield where the farmer/owners were acting as "blockers" and they pronounced it as so shot up that it was not fit to eat. We got the bird home and I must have picked shot out of the carcass for at least 1/2 hour. My mother made "pheasant under glass". It was good, but it was not a pretty photo dinner.

For upland birds or close-in waterfowl the 16 gauge is more than adequate, and back in the day the Win 12 was lighter than the 12 gauge version.

All guns above were 2-3/4".

Over the years we did not rely upon game birds to fill the larder, but pheasant, grouse, quail, ducks, geese, and (once) brant added to the variation of taste. Even in Alaska we shot spruce grouse with a .22 pistol or rifle when they were picking up gravel for their crops. The first year birds had light-colored breasts but the second year birds had darker meat. We stewed them all. Very good at camp with rice and gravy.

I am 65 and not in great health. I have not been bird hunting in over 2 decades, but I still remember how much fun it was back in the day.

Sorry to be so wordy. Thanks for putting up with me.

Jim

 

[Jason_W]

Time to reminisce. As a young teen I hunted pheasant and ruffed grouse (partridge/"pats" in the local vernacular) in Michigan with a Springfield Arms (Chicopee Falls, Mass, later bought out by Savage/Stevens) single-shot break-open 20 gauge 26" mod choke. No recoil pad, light to carry all day (even for me back then), and I took nearly as many birds as the adults with their pump, auto, and O/U guns in the mid 60's. In my first 2 years with the adults my basic job was to go into the "cedar swamps" with hip boots (as they referred to it) to flush out birds in lieu of a dog. Basic training. When you only have one shot you learn early to make it count.

My Dad acquired an A.H. Fox Sterlingworth SxS double-trigger 20 gauge 26" Mod/IC chokes hard buttplate that weighed barely over 5 lbs. Very nice to carry but it would beat the crap out of your cheek, which brings me to my next point.

Much perceived recoil can be attributed to the stock configuration. The Fox 20 had a drop at the heel of over 3" with a very thin comb. The Springfield Arms 20 was about 2-3/4" and had a fat comb, which was much more comfortable to shoot.

My favorite upland bird/skeet gun in the late 60's-early 70's was an 870 12 gauge 26" vent rib IC choke with an unbelievable 2-1/2" drop. Good cheek weld and one could see all of the top of the rib.

At the same time my Dad had a Win Model 12 28" FC field grade made in 1932, inherited when my Grandpa died. He reblued it courtesy of Herter's Belgian Blue solution (hot tank) with me in 1969 and had a birdseye maple buttstock and fore-end from E.C. Bishop/Warsaw, MO for it. Came back home on leave from the USAF in 1972 on opening day of pheasant season in Nebraska and used it. Not gloating, but it was the longest shot I ever made on a pheasant kill at 60+ paces. I was using his Remington Express high brass/high base 1-1/8 oz 7-1/2 shot. We brought it back to the road at the end of the cornfield where the farmer/owners were acting as "blockers" and they pronounced it as so shot up that it was not fit to eat. We got the bird home and I must have picked shot out of the carcass for at least 1/2 hour. My mother made "pheasant under glass". It was good, but it was not a pretty photo dinner.

For upland birds or close-in waterfowl the 16 gauge is more than adequate, and back in the day the Win 12 was lighter than the 12 gauge version.

All guns above were 2-3/4".

We did not rely upon game birds to fill the larder, but pheasant, grouse, quail, ducks, geese, and (once) brant added to the variation of taste. Even in Alaska we shot spruce grouse with a .22 pistol or rifle when they were picking up gravel for their crops. The first year birds had light-colored breasts but the second year birds had darker meat. We stewed them all. Very good at camp with rice and gravy.

I am 65 and not in great health. I have not been bird hunting in over 2 decades, but I still remember how much fun it was back in the day.

Sorry to be so wordy. Thanks for putting up with me.

Jim

We called them partridge in Vermont as well (usually pronounced "patridge" by the old timers). Spruce grouse were protected there and I'm not sure how that species hasn't gone extinct. I walked up to one and poked it with my finger once just to see if I could. Even by bird standards they're not the brightest bulbs.Woodcock were the other upland bird we had available back home. I consider them inedible, but it's all a matter of taste. Bacon wrapped grouse breasts on the grill, however . . . I get a little homesick thinking about that.

 

[Armored farmer]

I have plenty of love for the 20ga.

LC Smith 20ga sxs. The first shotgun i ever fired.

 

[DDDWho]

This 16 ga. Model 12 Winchester is my most cherished possession. It is built on a 20 ga. frame. My Uncle gave it to me while he was still living some 40+ years ago. Since then I've carried it hundreds of miles upland game hunting killing truck loads of pheasant and quail with it. It still looks almost new as both my Uncle and I kept guns cleaned and oiled. It has lasted 2 lifetimes so far and still has a few left in it. I grew up with a 20 ga. single barrel of my Dad's. There is little difference between gauges except the amount of shot different gauges are able to put in the air.

 

[WestKentucky]

I have nearly sold off all my shotguns because they don't get used much. I have a 870 12ga on permanent loan from a family member. I have a Mossberg 600CT 20ga that I earned as a teenager by mowing my grandfather's lawn. I have on permanent loan a bolt action 410 that was my grandmother's. Of the 3, I have not shot the 870 a single time in the 6 years I have had it. I have not shot the 410 more than a dozen times in my life. That 20ga is worn ragged but keeps on going. The only thing I can honestly say I would buy in a scattergun that I would use is a light 20 3" O/U with choke tubes. I want a tubed gun so that if I need to, I can shoot heavy loads at turkey or slugs for deer.

Deer, Turkey, rabbit, squirrel, dove, quail, pheasant, home defense, games...yeah I think the 20 is a great gun. In my book I prefer 20, with a close runner up in the 16. If the 16 were better supported in ammo, and was built on a true 16ga frame to reduce weight rather than use a 12 frame I would probably flip that preference. If i run across a 16 double before a 20 double I might have to start reloading plastic hulls.

 

[M1key]

Never shot one much when I was younger. Now the wife and I are grandparents. We keep the 870Y in the closet for whatever. Not underappreciated by me. Now, I wish I could find me a nice 28 gauge...and appropriate shells for it.

M

 

[expat_alaska]

We called them partridge in Vermont as well (usually pronounced "patridge" by the old timers). Spruce grouse were protected there and I'm not sure how that species hasn't gone extinct. I walked up to one and poked it with my finger once just to see if I could. Even by bird standards they're not the brightest bulbs.Woodcock were the other upland bird we had available back home. I consider them inedible, but it's all a matter of taste. Bacon wrapped grouse breasts on the grill, however . . . I get a little homesick thinking about that.

Jason, you and I could have been neighbors. I agree with everything you have stated. We did not hunt woodcock as it was an extra $2 for a Migratory Bird (duck) Stamp to do so, and the darned things were so small that there was very little to eat, and a kid the adults used to send me into the swamps with hip boots just to see if I could flush them out.

On a moose hunt long ago in Alaska in the Mat-Su Valley, in the afternoon late sun we came upon a male spruce grouse (red cheek flare feathers) about 10' away on a gravel cul-de-sac in a new subdivision that was being built. My buddy had a .22 revolver and aimed for the head. Evidently, the click of the trigger/hammer fall caused the bird to duck and he shot over it. We could see where the shot went into the gravel. Same thing happened on the next shot. On the 3rd shot Craig got wise and shot about an inch lower and the bird ducked right into a head shot. I know that sounds absurd but that is what spruce grouse are like. I am sure you will concur.

Never had bacon wrapped grouse. I am sure it was excellent.

I am sure we are digressing from the OP's thread.

Sorry.

Jim

 

[expat_alaska]

This 16 ga. Model 12 Winchester is my most cherished possession. It is built on a 20 ga. frame. My Uncle gave it to me while he was still living some 40+ years ago. Since then I've carried it hundreds of miles upland game hunting killing truck loads of pheasant and quail with it. It still looks almost new as both my Uncle and I kept guns cleaned and oiled. It has lasted 2 lifetimes so far and still has a few left in it. I grew up with a 20 ga. single barrel of my Dad's. There is little difference between gauges except the amount of shot different gauges are able to put in the air.

View attachment 777058

That looks almost exactly like my Dad's 16 gauge before he got done with his "refinishing". Thanks for the pic!

Jim

 

[Sistema1927]

I was just thinking the other day that I need to get a 20 ga upland game gun.

 

[JohnKSa]

A good friend of mine did two of the Argentina dove shooting excursions, one with a .20ga and the other with a 12ga. His take on the two was that he made more and better hits with the 20ga because over the several days of the shoot, it didn't beat him up nearly as badly.

 

[Fine Figure of a Man]

One of these days I'm going to buy a nice old side by side 20.
Wanted one for a long time.

 

[TarDevil]

OH... this makes me miss my old Fox 16 ga.

 

[expat_alaska]

Now, I wish I could find me a nice 28 gauge...and appropriate shells for it.

I had the opportunity to shoot a Rem 1100 28 gauge at skeet in a practice round in the NSSA tournament in Elkhorn Nebraska in 1970 when it was held at Roberts Shooting Park when I worked there. I guess it might be good for close range quail hunting, but I failed badly with it (not the gun's fault). Shells are spendy these days when you can find them, and then buy a case of them.

Good luck in your endevors, sir.

Jim

 

[kudu]

Learned to shoot on Grandpa's 20 gauge H&R single shot, Dad bought me a Remington 100 LT20 when I was 14 for my first shotgun modified choke vent rib. Pretty gun and still is although it has a few battle scars. Ran my first 25 and 50 straight on the skeet range with that gun modified choke and all. Always have a soft spot for 20 gauge and shoot more 20 gauge shells than 12 gauge. I would shoot more 28 gauge if they were a bit more affordable because I truly love the 28 but it is not as versatile as a 20.

I believe I have 8 or so 20 gauge shotguns, the original LT20, 2 870 pumps, tube set in my Beretta skeet gun, an SKB SxS, a Savage-Stevens pump, and 3, maybe 4 single shots. About 3 more average wise than the other gauges.

Nothing wrong with a 20 gauge, yes a 12 is more popular and can be loaded down to 20 gauge loading, which I do for target shells, but for 99% of the things I do with a shotgun I can do with a 20. 12 has the advantage in heavy payload for waterfowl, but I rarely hunt anymore, and if I did I can break out my Ithaca 10 gauge and look down my nose at the folks with them little 12 gauge shotguns.

 

[bikerdoc]

Have one for the grandkids to use.

 

[jmr40]

I started with one and have used it a lot, but I no longer have much use for a 20.

I've found that it can do about 90 percent of what a 12 gauge can,

I've found that a 12 will do 100% of what a 20 will do with less recoil, less cost, and better patterns. Pick any shot weight available in a 20 and the same load is available in a 12. Since a 12 will usually weigh 1/4-1 lb more the 12 will recoil less. Since the shot column will be shorter you'll get better patterns and 12 ga ammo in most loadings is cheaper.

Just because heavier loads are available for the 12 doesn't mean we have to always use them. But if needed the option is there to do a lot more than is possible with a 20. Especially when steel shot starts to be required.

True, the 20 ga guns do tend to be lighter and trimmer. If someone doesn't mind the added recoil of a featherweight 20 then that is an asset. But I find 7-7.5 lbs in a shotgun to be a good balance for ease of carrying and ease of shooting regardless of the diameter of the barrel. There is no shortage of options in 12 ga in that weight range.

 

[Crawdad1]

Jason the OP is really facing it being in California. The steel shot requirements really changed everything in shotguns and who knows where that is going to end up.

 

[Deus Machina]

Nowadays? Sure, they can do everything the 16 gauge was preferred for way back when, and probably the 12s of the day. They'll do most anything a good shooter could need, with the right load. I'd be happy with one with the correct shells for just about any situation.
Heck, when I was shopping for a shotgun a month ago, I almost bought a really interesting Western Field 20. But I don't use a shotgun nearly enough to specialize one, it was missing most of its finish, and there was 12-gauge 870 right next to it in near-perfect condition for only $25 more.
But with the variety of loads out there now--and modern recoil pads--12s can do everything the 20 and 16 could, and continue on into the heavier range to make up for some less experienced shooters (me) and probably cheaper.
As decent as a good 20 is, unlike rifles, shotguns actually can drop in a heavier shot load and more open choke to remain just as effective with a larger pattern and slightly make up for a shortcoming on the shooter's part.

 

[Picher]

I have a 12 gauge 1100 Special Field with a 21" barrel and I've found it nice to carry and deadly on birds. That said, I prefer to carry a 20 ga O/U in the fields these days. I've had four 20's, including a Weatherby O/U that my son now owns, a Franchi O/U that points like my finger, and a newer addition, a beautiful new/old Beretta ONYX that shoots great. We road-hunt and walk grouse/woodcock in the North Maine Woods and it's handy to use O/Us when getting out of the truck to shoot roadside birds. I just like 20's and never feel under-gunned, but tend to use high-brass #6s a lot.