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Electronic Scale

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I keep toying with the idea of getting this one. I had a different electronic scale years ago, but got so aggravated with it I bounced it off of a tile floor and threw it in the trash.

http://www.amazon.com/My-Weigh-GemPro-250-50gX0-001g/dp/B004C3I3AA

Too funny. It just so happens that my Hornady electronic scale ended up on the floor last night and now it is more consistent than it ever has been! I could seldom get the same reading every time from the same throw of powder. Now, it shows the same thing every single time....

some funny looking error message :).

In the market for a different one now that displays numbers instead of an error message. Hopefully, the new one will work a little better. Do they make one that is shockproof? (Just kidding)

H1
 
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I have 3 scales - a Pact BBKII & a Cabela's XT1500 & a beam scale.

The Pact took a dive several years ago & they had it for over 6 months before they shipped it back.
I got too impatient & bought the Cabela's scale.

My beam is a Lyman/Ohaus.
It measures 1/10th of a grain heavier than the 2 electronic scales.

I think all of the $100+ scales are gonna be ok.

I just wouldn't trust the $30 scales.
My guns, fingers, eyes, etc are too precious to me.
 
So if you use check weights which is closer the beam or the digital?

One thing about a digital if it only reads .1 gr differences (DS750 for example)
it will round to that .1
For example the DS750 will say 4.55 is 4.5 or 4.6.
The GEM20 will read 4.55


Both my digitals are less than $100 I trust them because they seem to weigh the check weights correctly. (and agree with my other scales)
Just because a scale is more expensive does not mean it is more accurate or more consistent.


Trust is an individual thing so what I trust may not be what someone else would trust.

I had a girlfriend one time that was really expensive and I thought I could trust, turns out I shouldn't have, maybe a less expensive model might have been a better deal........:D
 
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Dudedog said:
Both my digitals are less than $100 I trust them because they seem to weigh the check weights correctly. (and agree with my other scales)

Just because a scale is more expensive does not mean it is more accurate or more consistent.
That was the primary objective of the "digital scale myth busting" thread - to determine whether cheap $20 digital scales were accurate enough for reloading.

Thanks to the participation of THR members and their honesty instead of hype, we not only busted the myth that "cheap digital scales cannot be trusted" but proved that $20 Gemini-20 digital scale was more accurate than the old bench rest standby of Ohaus/RCBS 10-10 and other digital scales costing much more.

Just because a digital scale is brand X and costs hundreds of dollars more does not mean it will read more accurately or more consistently.

I believe ultimately it's the check weights in the powder charge range used that will prove whether any scale is accurate and consistent - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=9596742#post9596742

UPDATE:

The Gemini-20 digital scale, Ohaus check weight set and the American Weigh Scales check weight sets were delivered today.

To my surprise, the American Weigh Scales check weight sets included 1 mg (.015 gr) weight when it was advertised that 10 mg (.15 gr) weight was the lowest weight. As many suggested, I ditched the batteries that came with the scale and inserted two fresh AAA Duracell batteries. After calibrating with two 10 gram calibration weights that came with the scale, I was ready to do some weighing.

To eliminate the influence of air movement, air conditioning was turned off, reloading room door closed and bench leveled. All readings were taken with the cover applied over the pan. I also only handled the check weights and pan with the supplied twizzers.

- The 10 mg (.15 gr) check weight showed .010 g consistently but when I changed the mode from gram to grains, it showed .14 gr to .16 gr (was the scale expressing its .02 gr accuracy?).

- 1/4"x1/4" pieces of 20 lb copy paper showed .06 gr consistently and 2 pieces showed .12 gr.

- The 1 mg (.015 gr) weight would not register no matter what. I finally gave up and accepted defeat that the scale was not going to detect the .015 gr check weight.

I really was hoping the scale would read the 1 mg check weight so I recalibrated the scale a few times with no success, the 1 mg check weight would not register. At least, 1/4"x1/4" pieces of paper weighed consistently.

Then I weighed the 10 mg (.15 gr) check weight on the Ohaus 10-10 scale. It consistently showed slightly higher than .1 gr. When I placed one piece of 1/4"x1/4" paper, it detected and showed between two .1 gr lines. Two pieces showed around 1 gr with the pointer never below the .1 gr line.

Summary:

Pros:
- Low price ($20)
- Lower [higher] resolution than Ohaus 10-10
- Convenient pan cover

Cons:
- Small pan (holds about 35 gr of W231/HP-38 and 30 gr of Unique)
- Small round platform (slightly less than 3/4") will not accomodate a regular pan from 10-10/5-0-5 due to ridged ring around the platform
- Gap between round platform and the scale top will allow debri to fall in


Conclusion - It's always nice to have check weights. Since the scale read the .15 gr check weight between .14 - .16 gr, I would say reading of .06 gr for 1/4"x1/4" pieces of 20 lb copy paper may be close enough to express that two pieces of paper should weigh at or more than .1 gr. So if your digital scale cannot detect two pieces of 1/4"x1/4" copy paper and you want to load max charge loads, I would likely suggest you get a beam scale that can consistently weigh .1 gr.

I will keep the Gemini-20 digital scale in my reloading room but away from the bench so it can be stored without batteries in a location that is free from shock and vibration of bench work. I will continue to keep the Ohaus 10-10 on the bench at eye level and use it to verify powder measure charges. I will also keep my FA DS-750 with flat square platform that will readily accommodate the 10-10 pan to do quick spot verification of charges and weighing of bullets/rifle cases.

Why was I concerned with .1 gr accuracy when my typical pistol charges run 3.5 - 6.0 gr? Because I load near-max/max loads with WSF. I have always trusted beam scales and check weights down to .5 gr but being able to verify accuracy down to .15 gr with check weights puts my heart more at ease.

I thank all those who participated and contributed to this thread. It allowed me to satisfy one nagging aspect of reloading that digital scales (even cheaper ones) can be accurate enough for reloading, but they need to be verified with known weights like check weights.
 
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Keep your old balance scale handy...

A couple of years ago I bought a cheap FA unit. I use check weights each time I load. Works like a charm. However, I live in Sacramento, CA and load in the garage. Day time highs are seldom below the mid 50’s, and that is only for Dec and Jan. When it gets 100+ in the summer you wait until it cools down at night and then load.

The other day I loaded when the temp was around 50F and my FA scale was giving me wildly varying readings with a ball powder that normally meters very well. So I hauled out my old RCBS balance scale and the world was right again. It pays to have a backup with just about anything.
 
Digital scales are not only affected by temperature extremes (outside of 60-95F) but also by battery charge.

I use my digital scales indoors and have fully charged rechargeable or fresh alkaline batteries on hand when batteries run down and inconsistent readings show.
 
I have a Pact scale about 7 years old
It stopped working properly a while back
Now I let it warm up for an hour & it is back working like new.
My 5-0-5 wanders after 40 or so faithful years
I replaced it with Chinese 5-0-5--works good but reads very slowly compared to the old one
 
I got my initial set of check weights in grains from MidwayUSA for around $30 - http://www.midwayusa.com/product/493216/rcbs-standard-scale-check-weights-605-grains

But the problem with most reloading aluminum check weight set is that they only go down to .5 gr when I wanted to verify accuracy down to .1 gr.

So I ordered the aluminum OIML M2 class check weight set from Amazon which went down to 10 mg (.15 gr). As many reviews reported, the set also included 1 mg (.015 gr) weight which is not advertised. For $10, this is a good set to verify weights below .5 gr - http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003STEJAC/ref=pdp_new_dp_review

After some research, I ordered the stainless steel Ohaus ASTM Class 6 check weight set from Zoro which includes down to 1 mg (.015 gr) weight for $53 and free shipping (20% off on $100+ orders for Cyber Monday) - http://www.zoro.com/ohaus-calibration-weight-set-500-to-1mg-80850110/i/G0843236/
 
I have the Amazon set and it is in grams and mg but it's no big deal to make a chart showing the weight in grains.
My digitals will toggle between grains and grams.
(Gem20 and Frankford DS750)
 
So I ordered the aluminum OIML M2 class check weight set from Amazon which went down to 10 mg (.15 gr). As many reviews reported, the set also included 1 mg (.015 gr) weight which is not advertised. For $10, this is a good set to verify weights below .5 gr - http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003STEJAC/ref=pdp_new_dp_review

Thanks I ordering a set to keep my Gemini-20 honest. I have been using a 1 gram test weight at work and so far my Gem-20 has been within .XXgr. I love how fast it is and they fact that I can tare out my case before periodic load checks.
 
You can tare a digital scale.

You can use any type of pan on it, just tare the new pan's weight, it zeros to that pan.

You can place a piece of brass, any brass, tare it, then charge it with powder. The scale then tells you how much the powder weighs. No dumping the powder in the balance beam pan, waiting for the beam to settle, then having to pour it back into the case. Did all the powder drop free of the brass? Is there some sticking to the inside where there might be some lube to stick to?

Sorting boolits when casting for weight is very fast. Not having to wait for a beam to settle, then guessing how much over or under each one is.

Weighing anything of unknown weight is as simple as placing it on the scale. No moving weights around. Want to know if your snail mail letter is under the weight for one first class stamp?
 
This controversy has come up many times, and will continue to be talked about. There are those that just don't trust electronics to measure powder or anything else. That's fine, but what are you doing on a computer then? Or heating up some coffee/nuking before logging on here?

I think digital scales have gotten a bad rep. because of the cheap junk that's on the market. Pay some money, get a good one, then begin to reap the benefits I listed above.

I bought a RCBS powder pro scale back in '98,(made for RCBS by pact, green), it still is working just fine. About 4 years later I bought the dispenser (gray) that pairs up through an infrared port to precisely measure to the tenth of a grain. Both work just fine. I used to check the accuracy of the digital with my Ohaus beam scale, it was always spot on. Now I simply use a set of check weights to verify calibration. I don't even have a balance beam anymore.
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Well, I broke down and ordered the Gem Pro 250. Hopefully this will go better than my last time with an electronic scale. :)
 
Got a question...

First, BDS,

That synopsis of your previous findings was great. It confirmed what I felt about my cheap digital. Mainly that both it and 0.1 grains are accurate enough for safe reloading, especially since I load to the lower end of the range.

But this string does raise a question. I was wondering about the need or value is for confirming down to 0.1 grains with a check weight. I always use my RCBS check weights to make sure the scale is reading properly at both 0 and 5.0 grains since most of my loads are around 5 grains. If I do have a heavier load I check at 0, 5, and 10 grains. Can't think of any time I've gone over 10 grains.

I especially am not sure why I would do it with the balance scale. Poise movement is linear and if the graduations are equally spaced a check with weights on the low and high side of the load should be pretty good confirmation.

Am I missing something?
 
I bought this inexpensive digital scale on Dec 4, of 2014. It's the only scale I use anymore.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GGGJUSA?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00

I have been very happy with it. It measures accurately and repeatably to .01gr.

The FA scale that I replaced with the DB Power one was a not very good. It drifted pretty badly. The two scales are in completely different leagues as far as quality goes even though they can be found for around the same cost.
 
refuse2bafool said:
That synopsis of your previous findings was great. It confirmed what I felt about my cheap digital. Mainly that both it and 0.1 grains are accurate enough for safe reloading, especially since I load to the lower end of the range.
Thank you. I was glad we were able to put facts over many myths we have been reading on the internet for good.

I was wondering about the need or value is for confirming down to 0.1 grains with a check weight. I always use my RCBS check weights to make sure the scale is reading properly at both 0 and 5.0 grains since most of my loads are around 5 grains.
For most pistol loading, verifying accuracy around 5.0 grains IMO is good enough. My quest for .1 gr verification was to put to rest the argument that cheap digital scales were not accurate or consistent enough for reloading. On the myth busting thread, we determined FA DS-750 was accurate to +/- .1 gr under 1 grain and spot on for 2-5 grain charges and Gemini-20 was consistently accurate below 1 grain to 5 grains.

I especially am not sure why I would do it with the balance scale. Poise movement is linear and if the graduations are equally spaced a check with weights on the low and high side of the load should be pretty good confirmation.
Precisely. While I trust both of my digital scales, I always double check initial powder charges on one of two Ohaus 10-10 scales. Both scales have consistently been spot on with check weights from 1-5 grains.

Mad Chemist said:
I bought this inexpensive digital scale on Dec 4, of 2014. It's the only scale I use anymore.
It measures accurately and repeatably to .01gr.
Gemini-20 also advertises .001 gram (.015 gr) resolution but I found it really reads with .02 gr resolution (perhaps circuitry has improved on newer models).

But at $10, I will be willing to order the scale and run it through the paces and add to the digital scale myth busting thread.
 
Thanks to BDS for calling out that $9.99 check weight set from Amazon, I ordered it and it came in today. I have always been very happy with my Gemini-20 and love tareing it with the empty case and just reading from there. I run the calibration often but it now is a nice feeling to check it to known weights knowing that it is very accurate.

100mg (1.5432gr) I measured 104mg (1.62gr)
200mg (3.0864gr) I measured 203mg (3.12gr)
500mg (7.7161gr) I measured 501mg (7.74gr)
1000mg (15.4324gr) I measured 1007mg (15.56gr)

Those are great number for my needs and I feel even better about my Gemini-20 than ever.
 
I have the little FA pocket scale, it has been working pretty good for me though it does have sudden .3 g shifts that I notice when I put the empty pan back on the scale. It doesn't do it very often so I just tare it and move on.

I'm impressed enough by this cheapy that I'll be opening the wallet further for a more precise unit in the future.

I also have a set of Lyman check weights I use to check the scale at the start of a session.

Oh yeah, I still have my Lyman 505 beam, I like to seek its opinion just to keep everything honest.
 
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