Glock RONI or HERA kit?

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UT PROSIM

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does anyone have any expericence with them? i saw the RONI at a local gun store and seemed pretty neat but i want more info from people who have used them and arnt trying to sell it to me, before i take the next step at getting a sbr.
What are the pros and cons for the two? is it worth the $400 + tax stamp?
thanks for the help
Pat
 
To me neither kit is worth it. There are other toys I'd rather have for $1K. A $270 sub 2000 satisfies my pistol caliber carbine desires and still leaves me with pistol to boot.

If the question is the just one of you think it is cool and want to know if it is a quality item then that is a different question.

I would however get one of the cool magpul folding flash light glock carbine kits if it came to market. That thing was just too cool to resist.
 
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Niche market for a reason - they've only got a very limited use. If you want something short, limited range, but uses pistol magazines and ammo, they're just the ticket. If you're just looking for something to spend your money on, or if you're just looking for a neat pistol-cal SBR, I would say that going with either a SBR AR-15 with a 9mm upper or a SBR UZI, M11/9 (Masterpiece Arms offers good starting points) or similar would be a much better idea in terms of overall utility.
 
If you already own a Glock...or two or three...these kits would make sense. I have played with a Roni...wasn't real impressed with the quality. Too much plastic for me. My biggest objection lies in the charging system. Plastic ridges fit into the slide serrations to pull the slide back and I can see those things just not holding up under hard use. I have looked at the HERA GCC as well and while it is, I think, a better design I would prefer the HERA Triar II. http://www.guns.com.mt/products.php/TRIARII Just remember your Glock will have to become a NFA firearm meaning you will need a permit to take it out of state

Of course another choice would be a Mech Tech carbine conversion. You can buy a complete Glock lower for around $250 or use a lower you already own. The Mech Tech offers a wide variety of options as well, stocks, rails, sights, etc.

I do have a question as I am not sure on this point. Can the Mech Tech conversion become the NFA receiver rather than the Glock receiver?
 
I handled the original HERA at one of the Silencer Shoots. It was a solid piece of gear. No experience with the RONI.
 
this would be a range toy for the most part. In terms of usefulness i really dont have a true use for almost all of my weapons except my hunting rifles/ shotguns and a handgun or two. the rest of them are just a hobby for me. the biggest thing that is keeping me from getting a sbr is the restrictions in transporting it (im in the army and move a lot) and the price for it, to just be something fun (thats why the roni and hera were appealing). But my parents do live in VA and this is where i keep most of my guns.
 
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I do have a question as I am not sure on this point. Can the Mech Tech conversion become the NFA receiver rather than the Glock receiver?

No; the receiver is the handgun frame. If the carbine upper was able to be called the receiver, then it couldn't be mailed freely to end-users, as it would be a firearm (Title I) requiring a FFL to receive. You really don't want to send a letter asking for an opinion and end up changing precedent. ;)

UT PROSIM, in light of the military job and moving around the country, for now I'd say avoid NFA. You'd have to leave it in a locked container to which no one except you had the key/combination in VA when moving around.
 
Uhh what is hard about buying a safe kepping it at your parents house, tell them whats in it and the laws with it and your fine. NFA is to much fun to wait tell you get out I wish I would have got in to it the day I turned 21

Ohh and both glocks look fun, I did a AR SBR I love it I would look into one if your thinking NFA.
 
Uhh what is hard about buying a safe kepping it at your parents house, tell them whats in it and the laws with it and your fine.

It is my understanding you are required to keep control of your NFA items at all times. Now there are probably ways to do this and keep it at your parents house. Maybe not though, I think there is an issue about leaving it in the sole care of someone else. I haven't researched what will fulfill this requirement and what will violate it. Something worth looking into. Just sticking it in a safe they can access and leaving might well be a problem, additional measures might make it okay, such as a trigger lock etc. As I said I have not done any legal research on this issue but it is something to look into.
 
you could go the trust route and then just put them on the trust with you
That wouldn't be legal in a trust. Only the grantor of the trust, the one person (or married couple) can legally possess the NFA items registered to them. Period. People who use a cut and paste trust form and add a bunch of folks to the list of names are breaking the law.
 
A few questions:

Only the grantor of the trust, the one person (or married couple) can legally possess the NFA items registered to them

Is the item registered to/owned by the trust with legal title being transferred to trustees? If there are multiple trustees do they not have legal title?

Are you saying trust beneficiaries cannot have possession of the item or are you saying trustees cannot or what?

I am having a hard time imagining that a trustee to a trust cannot have possession of an item in the trust, is that what you are saying?

People who use a cut and paste trust form and add a bunch of folks to the list of names are breaking the law.

Again adding people as what? trustees? beneficiaries?

Also are you saying a trust that posses NFA items cannot have multiple grantors?

I am a little confused by your statement as to what you are trying to say exactly.

Oh and as always when discussing the law, citation?
 
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PTK Quote:
Originally Posted by wildman6809
you could go the trust route and then just put them on the trust with you
That wouldn't be legal in a trust. Only the grantor of the trust, the one person (or married couple) can legally possess the NFA items registered to them. Period. People who use a cut and paste trust form and add a bunch of folks to the list of names are breaking the law.
Wrong.

Mitsy Barajas (Texas attorney who has done hundreds of NFA trusts
http://www.nfa-trusts.com/faq.html
Will I be the only one able to use the firearms?
No, with a trust you can name multiple individuals as trustees, and they can use and store the items independently.


Sean Cody (another Texas attorney who has done hundreds of NFA trusts)
http://www.texasnfatrust.com/products.htm
2. What are the benefits of the Texas NFA Trust over the Corporate and individual form of ownership?.........e. The ability of anyone who is a trustee to be able to lawfully possess the weapons.
 
A living revocable trust is generally set up as follows:

A grantor, the creator of the trust, names himself as first trustee and a spouse if applicable is also named as trustee if desired. There is only one grantor, of course, and there can only BE one grantor as that is the founder of the trust itself.

As for who can legally possess such items as NFA items registered to the trust, only the current trustees can do so - if the current trustee is still alive, the successor trustee cannot legally possess the trust's assets, period. Beneficiaries don't ever have legal right to possess anything in the trust until the first trustee and all successors are dead or incapacitated (dictated by state laws).

In the case of virtually all trusts, there is ONE and only one trustee and MANY beneficiaries - this is where a lot of folks get confused and think of the trust funds and whatnot they've heard of with "lots of people on them", not knowing the folks receiving cash when the trustee(s) expire are the beneficiaries. ;)

I've seen trusts with half a dozen grantors and current trustees, which are blatantly illegal as far as a revocable living trust goes. As the trust itself can only legally be established by one person or entity, of course there can be only one grantor.

To sum up, a trust has the creator (grantor), first trustee (one person), successor trustees (each one person as well), and a list of beneficiaries (as many folks as you'd like). Generally for a NFA trust, the grantor is the first trustee, the spouse or a family member is the successor trustee, and the kids or friends are beneficiaries. Only the current trustee, NONE of the successors unless of course the current trustee is incapacitated, and never the beneficiaries until all trustees are dead/incapacitated may legally possess the trust's assets. The only way a married couple can both legally possess the NFA items at the same time is by making a joint trust wherein both are grantors and first trustees. The rest stays pretty much the same.

As for a citation - go look it up. I'm generalizing based on the various state laws I've dealt with, but this is the generally accepted guidelines for a trust in these USA. ;)

dogtown tom, I find that website highly suspect based on opinions from the BATFE, rejection of various F1s and F4s with trusts naming half a dozen current trustees, etc. The only reason I can think of is that perhaps in Texas, the laws really are that different for a RLT. Again, based on what I've personally seen from the BATFE, what I've seen friends have happen (items were seized due to improper trusts having been approved and then someone decided to actually READ them), and from opinion letters released from the BATFE, I wouldn't take the chance and bet against the generally accepted guidelines for the format of a RLT. If you want multiple people legally able to possess the NFA items, form an LLC or similar. :)

Of course, then again, by a strict reading of that website and your posted quotes, a married couple is "multiple people", so..... ;)
 
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Q: If an individual is changing his or her State of residence and the individual’s application to transport the NFA firearm cannot be approved because of a prohibition in the new State, what options does a lawful possessor have?
NFA firearms may be left in a safe deposit box in his or her former State of residence. Also, the firearm could be left or stored in the former State of residence at the house of a friend or relative in a locked room or container to which only the registered owner has a key. The friend or relative should be supplied with a copy of the registration forms and a letter from the owner authorizing storage of the firearm at that location.

From ATF's web site http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/national-firearms-act-firearms.html#alternate-storage

Like I said before go get a SAFE then buy all the crazy NFA stuff you can afford

Have fun
 
PTK ....dogtown tom, I find that website highly suspect based on opinions from the BATFE, rejection of various F1s and F4s with trusts naming half a dozen current trustees, etc. The only reason I can think of is that perhaps in Texas, the laws really are that different for a RLT. Again, based on what I've personally seen from the BATFE, what I've seen friends have happen (items were seized due to improper trusts having been approved and then someone decided to actually READ them), and from opinion letters released from the BATFE, I wouldn't take the chance and bet against the generally accepted guidelines for the format of a RLT. If you want multiple people legally able to possess the NFA items, form an LLC or similar.
Same in Pennsylvania: http://www.pafirearmslawyer.com/Pennsylvania_Gun_Lawyer/Gun_Trusts.html
 
Fine by me, I'll stick with what both the BATFE and various lawyers that were legally retained whilst answering me said. ;)
 
Thank you for clarifying, your first post was not only incomprehensible because of the lack of terminology in some parts it also said something different than what your second post said (grantor vs trustee being able to have posses). As to the rest if I get time I'll post more later.
 
Never seen these kits before. What will they think of next. Hahaha.

I have a G22 myself but if I wanted a pistol caly carbine, just something to buy if I could spend as much as $2k, I would totally go for the Kriss-V 45ACP. That things i too darn tight not to own if at all possible.
 
I looked long and hard at these... and then bought the G19 frame Sub2000. For not much more than the cost of the tax stamp I got a 16" barrel carbine that fits in my laptop case and uses the same mags. I had one of the 33rnd mags for the Glock pistol, decided it was a cool range toy but not really practical, and have bought a stack of them for the Sub2000. Added a single-point sling and it's a blast! The only thing it really needs is a good rail and a red dot sight on a quick release mount.

John
 
A grantor, the creator of the trust, names himself as first trustee and a spouse if applicable is also named as trustee if desired.

A grantor can name any number of people apart from herself or her spouse as a trustee. She may often name herself because she wants to retain control but there is no requirement she name herself.

In the case of virtually all trusts, there is ONE and only one trustee and MANY beneficiaries

I haven't done an empirical study but there are a good number of trusts that have more than one trustee. A trust certainly can have more than one trustee, co-trustees. It is the trustee(s) that can posses the NFA item, and there can be more than one trustee. I'd posit that who is named a trustee is often closely correlated with the intentions of the grantor.
 
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