Guns as an Investment- Again

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I have told this story before.

I did some work at a lawyers house years ago and he "invested" in gunz.....really winchester lever rifles....going back to henry.

It looked like something out of a museum....really fantastic, said his friends played the stock market, he bought rifles.....and I can kinda get it.....I doubt the rifles will tank in value like stocks did about 10-ish years ago....but you never know when a New Zealand type deal might come.

Again you have to have 20/20 hindsight....what is going to be of value....I remember in the 80's buying a perfect 1966 charger for $1800.....it was just an old car.....what is the difference between a 66 charger and a 66 Grand Prix...both are mid sized (yup that was midsized) sporty......and yet the dodge is much more valued......you have to guess right.....I would not put it in GTO land, perhaps Tempest or LeMans.....the charger was not that super fancy over the Pontiac.......so you do have to guess right.
 
I believe guns can be investments.

But, I certainly wouldn't invest ONLY in guns.

ANYTHING you can "invest in" can go bust on you. Governments can go belly up and their currencies, bonds, whatever can go with them. Private possession of gold bullion can be outlawed. As can guns, high capacity magazines, what have you. Fine whiskies and brandies? Well, we've banned those before too.

Spread the risk. Buy the quality you can afford, especially with guns that you both like and will use. Buy a little bullion. Invest in an IRA. And so on and on.

I certainly wouldn't put all of my eggs so to speak into one investment basket.

If stocks, bonds, IRAs, and currency goes way south then your investments in firearms and ammunition may pay off big time (if you can stay alive).

If your guns never rise in value then maybe your IRA and 401k account did.

Spread the risk.
 
High-end antique firearms do well, but you have to know what you are buying...and where to sell it. Before the Internet, you could make money buying Cowboy-era guns on the East Coast, taking them to the West Coast, and trading them for Civil War guns that would fetch top dollar on the East Coast.

Cartridge guns are a real crapshoot, I would not buy one as an investment.
 
Since 1969 I have bought and sold about 12 German Lugers. Every one sold for 2 to 6 times my cost and I'm sorry I sold every one of them. My wife invested heavily in Beanie Babies and wiped out my profits.
My Bank paid interest of 0.2 % on my savings. That's 2 tenths of 1 percent! How can I go wrong investing in old guns?
That is why I ordered a second M1 Garand from the CMP. Those old rifles will only grow in value. My investment councellor has advised me to stop investing in the wife and offered me a good price for one of my M1's.
 
I don't look at guns as an investment, I buy want I want to own and shoot, BUT I almost always search out good deals so that I'm not upside down as soon as I own it. I keep an Excel sheet of all my gun stuff (and car stuff) so that I, or anyone else, can look at it and know what I have, where it is, what's been done to it in terms of maintenance and modifications, and the current market value.

I didn't buy any gun-related stuff for a number of years, but in the past 7 or so I've gotten back into it as a hobby. This thread caused me to open my Excel file and total up the prices paid vs. the current value. For the past 7 years, the guns and gun paraphernalia (excluding ammo) I've bought are currently worth approximately 28-30% more than I paid for them, on average. That's not a great ROI as investments go, but as I said, I didn't buy gun stuff as an "investment." Nevertheless, it does make me feel more content with spending money on the hobby if I (or an heir) can at least get my money back. That's better than some actual investments have done, and those investments brought me zero fun and enjoyment and social interaction. :)
 
...I remember in the 80's buying a perfect 1966 charger for $1800.....it was just an old car.....what is the difference between a 66 charger and a 66 Grand Prix...both are mid sized (yup that was midsized) sporty......and yet the dodge is much more valued......you have to guess right.....I would not put it in GTO land, perhaps Tempest or LeMans.....the charger was not that super fancy over the Pontiac.......so you do have to guess right.
In terms of the "Charger was not that super fancy over the Pontiac...." Having grown up with all of the old muscle cars, owned several, built them, raced them, had friends and acquaintances with them to the point that I've had wrenching and seat time experience with just about all of them, I can say that the Chrysler Corporation muscle cars were ox carts in the mid/late 1960s compared to Fords and GMs. Just saying the truth from experience. :) The engines and transmissions were okay, but the bodies were years behind the Fords and GMs. (And they were ALL ox carts compared to any semi-modern vehicle.)
 
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Firearms are generally lousy investments. An investment is made at market rates. I bought a very dirty 1911 that needed a barrel link for what I figured was $150 less than what it was worth. And I was right, I made money. But that's like buying a $500 bill for $350. I made money on the purchase price, not an appreciation in value.
The nice thing about firearms is that with care they provide utility, enjoyment in use, and pride of ownership, and retain their value. Some actually appreciate. If you want to make money on firearms, read gunny's post again, learn as much as you can, and stick to what you know. But you're investing in your knowledge rather than the gun.
 
I believe guns can be investments.

But, I certainly wouldn't invest ONLY in guns.

ANYTHING you can "invest in" can go bust on you. Governments can go belly up and their currencies, bonds, whatever can go with them. Private possession of gold bullion can be outlawed. As can guns, high capacity magazines, what have you. Fine whiskies and brandies? Well, we've banned those before too.

Spread the risk. Buy the quality you can afford, especially with guns that you both like and will use. Buy a little bullion. Invest in an IRA. And so on and on.

I certainly wouldn't put all of my eggs so to speak into one investment basket.

If stocks, bonds, IRAs, and currency goes way south then your investments in firearms and ammunition may pay off big time (if you can stay alive).

If your guns never rise in value then maybe your IRA and 401k account did.

Spread the risk.

If the guberment "goes belly up" there are going to be more pressing issues past your investment.
 
Firearms are generally lousy investments. An investment is made at market rates. I bought a very dirty 1911 that needed a barrel link for what I figured was $150 less than what it was worth. And I was right, I made money. But that's like buying a $500 bill for $350. I made money on the purchase price, not an appreciation in value.
The nice thing about firearms is that with care they provide utility, enjoyment in use, and pride of ownership, and retain their value. Some actually appreciate. If you want to make money on firearms, read gunny's post again, learn as much as you can, and stick to what you know. But you're investing in your knowledge rather than the gun.
Knowing what you are buying, when it comes to guns, can make you money. Not knowing what your buying can cost you money.
From left to right.
1916 M91 (Finn Marked), French Berthier, 1903 (1942) , 03A3 (1943). I have $1250 invested in these rifles. All were bought within the last six years. How much do you think they are worth today?
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Even Colt Pythons and Single Action Armies are no match for the stock market.
Yup I’ve done that math many times. And neither are those 1960 corvettes and other highly sought after muscle cars.

I’ve bought some guns cheap enough to make some major money fast enough to have called it a great investment. Mostly due to someone strapped for cash, someone stupid selling, broken guns that fixed easily, and Obama’s gun legislation attempts.
I’ve also lost my rear (mostly just sold for what I paid or dang close) on quite a few guns bought as investments. Those pretty wood bolt actions haven’t done so hot since accuracy caught up on AR15-10 style guns and you can buy a new accurate bolt action for $300.

If a Democrat looks good for president I bet AR’s go back up some. But there’s so many on shelves and so many manufacturers I’d bet they do pretty good bucking a Chrisis this go round.
 
I invest in the second ammendment when buying firearms related stuff. I will do my research and get the best deal possible. All the same my firearms are to use and enjoy. If they increase in value all the better. And yes if l need to l can sell them but that was not my plan from the start. And no panic selling if possible. I can count on one hand all the new firearms l have purchased. I have filled out about 50 4473's total. The rest were private sales/trades and those were the best deals by far. YMMV
 
I invest in the second ammendment when buying firearms related stuff. I will do my research and get the best deal possible. All the same my firearms are to use and enjoy. If they increase in value all the better. And yes if l need to l can sell them but that was not my plan from the start. And no panic selling if possible. I can count on one hand all the new firearms l have purchased. I have filled out about 50 4473's total. The rest were private sales/trades and those were the best deals by far. YMMV
Last month I picked up a like new Glock 19X for $300. The guy needed cash and I had the money in my pocket. And No, the gun's not stolen.
 
Knowing what you are buying, when it comes to guns, can make you money. Not knowing what your buying can cost you money.
From left to right.
1916 M91 (Finn Marked), French Berthier, 1903 (1942) , 03A3 (1943). I have $1250 invested in these rifles. All were bought within the last six years. How much do you think they are worth today?
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I have no idea what they're worth. What were they worth when you bought them?
 
I have no idea what they're worth. What were they worth when you bought them?
1916 M91 (Finn Marked) Paid $325. Was worth $450 when I bought it. Will bring $600 plus today.
French Berthier, Paid $400. Was worth $600, will $900 plus now.
Rem. 1903 (1942) Paid $400, worth $500, will bring $700 to $800 today.
Rem 03A3 (1943). Paid $125. Cost me about $50 out of pocket to restore, Worth $700 to $800 today.
Some could bring more at auction.
 
1916 M91 (Finn Marked) Paid $325. Was worth $450 when I bought it. Will bring $600 plus today.
French Berthier, Paid $400. Was worth $600, will $900 plus now.
Rem. 1903 (1942) Paid $400, worth $500, will bring $700 to $800 today.
Rem 03A3 (1943). Paid $125. Cost me about $50 out of pocket to restore, Worth $700 to $800 today.
Some could bring more at auction.
A 48% increase in value (of the three you listed original value vs current value) is significant and a great return on investment. I agree that some firearms do appreciate in value. I would also suggest that it might not be reasonable to assume that type of appreciation in firearm value. Purchasing at 63% of market value I think is a direct result of your knowledge.
 
From left to right.
1916 M91 (Finn Marked), French Berthier, 1903 (1942) , 03A3 (1943).
I have examples of your rifles mentioned above (although, is your M91 from NEW?), but I've never seen a reasonably complete Berthier of any sort down here along the lower Rio Grande - and I'm mostly trying to find a WWI-era rebuild.
-Just trying to round out the AEF guns.
 
I have examples of your rifles mentioned above (although, is your M91 from NEW?), but I've never seen a reasonably complete Berthier of any sort down here along the lower Rio Grande - and I'm mostly trying to find a WWI-era rebuild.
-Just trying to round out the AEF guns.
The four rifles in the pic are all made by Remington.
The M91 is from the first year of production, 1916, a very hard year to find.
The Berthier is from the French contract that was declined doe to the rifles not meeting French standards, But the actual reason was the war was coming to an end and the French did't want to pay for them. Remington Berthiers are had to find unmolested . Most were made into sporters.
 
If you are looking at returns on investment the stock market is probably the place. But guns can make a nice return also. Sometime! Like the others said, you need to know what you are buying, and buy smart. If we have a political situation or another mass shooting that threatens gun bans then AR's and other assault style weapons will go up. I have seen a few Colt Pythons like I payed $350 for sell for $3000+. The M-1 that I payed less than $100 for has appreciated a good bit. If you had a S&W M-29 before Clint Eastwood made his Dirty Harry movies it would have been worth a lot more after those movies hit the screen. Thats just a few examples. No doubt, I have a few that are worth less than I paid for them. My retirement accounts are in index funds!
 
The only decent gun-related investment I've seen was the 22 rimfire flip around 2012-2013. For everything else I'd rather have a ten year t-bill, which is an awful investment right now. Heck, you could sink $1,000 today into any stock returning 3.25% dividends (reinvested) and do much better in 5 years than most guns for four times that long.
 
The only decent gun-related investment I've seen was the 22 rimfire flip around 2012-2013. For everything else I'd rather have a ten year t-bill, which is an awful investment right now. Heck, you could sink $1,000 today into any stock returning 3.25% dividends (reinvested) and do much better in 5 years than most guns for four times that long.
That is why you should only buy smart if you plan to make money on guns. On just about every new gun, you will loose money if your plan is not to leave it in the box and hold on to it for years. Even waiting several years you profit may not be much.
Buying used guns is where the money is, but you really need to know your guns. Pawn Shops are a great place to buy, but you need to know Pawn Shop Math. Your average pawn shop will lone 1/3 of what they think they can resale an item for, and buy for 1/2 of what they can resale for. Now some will buy for a little more if it’s a fast moving item.
So if a gun is priced at $300, the shop most likely has $100 to $150 tied up in it. If the market value of the gun is $350 and you can get them to sale for $250 to $275, you have already made a profit.
I walked into a shop and saw a Webley MkVI in the case for $350. At the time I knew it was worth approximately $600. I did not get excited and rip out my wallet, I just asked to look at the gun. It was in very good shape, but a little dirty and still in 455 Webley.
I asked for a better price. After a little dickering I walked out the door with the gun for a total of $300. That was a $300 profit in less then 30 minutes. Here’s the gun.
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Now you have to know where to sale if you want to turn your profit into cash. Finding the right buyer is just as important as buying at the right price.
Never be in a rush to sale and never sale when you need money.
 
That is why you should only buy smart if you plan to make money on guns. On just about every new gun, you will loose money if your plan is not to leave it in the box and hold on to it for years. Even waiting several years you profit may not be much.
Buying used guns is where the money is, but you really need to know your guns. Pawn Shops are a great place to buy, but you need to know Pawn Shop Math. Your average pawn shop will lone 1/3 of what they think they can resale an item for, and buy for 1/2 of what they can resale for. Now some will buy for a little more if it’s a fast moving item.
So if a gun is priced at $300, the shop most likely has $100 to $150 tied up in it. If the market value of the gun is $350 and you can get them to sale for $250 to $275, you have already made a profit.
I walked into a shop and saw a Webley MkVI in the case for $350. At the time I knew it was worth approximately $600. I did not get excited and rip out my wallet, I just asked to look at the gun. It was in very good shape, but a little dirty and still in 455 Webley.
I asked for a better price. After a little dickering I walked out the door with the gun for a total of $300. That was a $300 profit in less then 30 minutes. Here’s the gun.
View attachment 851808

Now you have to know where to sale if you want to turn your profit into cash. Finding the right buyer is just as important as buying at the right price.
Never be in a rush to sale and never sale when you need money.


The catch is that the profit comes when you find someone who will pay $600. Chances are good that someone who knows these guns and likes them will also want to pay $300 so they can make an instant profit.
 
The catch is that the profit comes when you find someone who will pay $600. Chances are good that someone who knows these guns and likes them will also want to pay $300 so they can make an instant profit.
Trust me. Just a few phone calls and that Webley would be sold for $600 to $700.
I have a Mexican Mauser that is in very good shape that I paid $305 for about three years ago. I’ve had a guy that keeps trying to buy it from me. His last offer was $700.
 
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