Help w/ Beretta 84FS Cheeta: not easy to rack the pistol’s slide.

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Charly2020!

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I am aware that this is a blowback gun; thus, it has more felt recoil than locked-breech guns AND it is not easy to rack the pistol’s slide.

I have searched for several options, the most logical one is to replace the recoil spring; however, I’m afraid it will have a negative effect on the performance of the firearm.

2nd ask: Has any one seen a “beavertail” protection for this specific firearm? I have small hands and would benefit from having one.
 
<-----Adapted PE specialist for a large school district by day, gun dealer by night.
The teacher in me says "fix the problem".....insufficient hand strength.
Go to the dollar store or WalMart and get one of those cheap hand grip exercisers. Ten minutes a day will do wonders within a month.
Watching TV?......every time a commercial comes on grab it and start squeezing. Most commercial breaks are two minutes or so.
Stopped at a traffic light?.........start squeezing.
Talking on the phone? .........start squeezing.

You can also use Silly Putty, Play Dough, rubber balls. Tennis balls will usually be too rigid.

It's a common problem and I've lost count of the times customers have tried buying a particular gun to address weak grip strength. Changing guns or changing springs MAY work, but improved grip strength WILL work. Another benefit is you'll be ripping lids off pickle jars like Arnold in no time.

Regarding your second question, the 84 has a pretty good sized beavertail as it is. I've never seen any aftermarket replacement....usually larger hands need bigger beavertails......what is the issue?
 
What specifically is failing when you try to rack the slide? Are you losing the grip on the slide? Or are you truly unable to apply enough differential force to the grip and the frame?
 
<-----Adapted PE specialist for a large school district by day, gun dealer by night.
The teacher in me says "fix the problem".....insufficient hand strength.
Go to the dollar store or WalMart and get one of those cheap hand grip exercisers. Ten minutes a day will do wonders within a month.
Watching TV?......every time a commercial comes on grab it and start squeezing. Most commercial breaks are two minutes or so.
Stopped at a traffic light?.........start squeezing.
Talking on the phone? .........start squeezing.

You can also use Silly Putty, Play Dough, rubber balls. Tennis balls will usually be too rigid.

It's a common problem and I've lost count of the times customers have tried buying a particular gun to address weak grip strength. Changing guns or changing springs MAY work, but improved grip strength WILL work. Another benefit is you'll be ripping lids off pickle jars like Arnold in no time.

Regarding your second question, the 84 has a pretty good sized beavertail as it is. I've never seen any aftermarket replacement....usually larger hands need bigger beavertails......what is the issue?

@ATLDave I agree 100% with you. The issue is hand strength. I have already purchased a hand strength device ;)

As for the Beavertail question, it has nothing to do with its coverage area, it has to do with the recoil. Even though, I apply a solid and tight grip, the recoil is much harder than, say, a Browning HiPower. So, I was wondering if there are any after market attachments as there are for Glocks.
 
While you build hand strength, be sure to try both methods of grasping the slide. Some people have more strength in their thumb and can grip better with the "slingshot" grip, while some people have more grip in curling muscles of their fingers and do better with the "overhand" grip.

Since I got into pistol shooting after many years of playing the drums and swinging golf clubs,* I was able to apply a lot of force pinching my thumb against the metacarpal joint (first one out from the hand), so that's what I used from day one. Other people who have handstrength primarily from weightlifting or carrying heavy objects may be able to apply more force squeezing the four fingers against the base of the palm. If you have only been trying one "grip" on the slide, experiment with the other and see if it improves things.

* Both of these activities involving controlling and applying force with a thumb to objects that are, to some degree, pinched in the "crook" of the index finger.
 
I own a couple of Browning BDA's which are essentially the same pistol. I agree, the recoil seems much more pronounced than shooting a Hi Power or other 9mm locked breech design. A large part of that is the blowback action, coupled with a light aluminum frame it seems to recoil more than heavier pistols.
A beavertail will not affect recoil. On pistols with an exposed hammer, the top rear of the frame protects the web of the shooters hand from being struck or pinched by the hammer or by the sharp underneath side of the slide. A shooter with large, fleshy hands may "get bit" while others don't. Shooting techniques that encourage a high hold on the grip may cause the shooter to get bit.

Pistols with strikers or concealed hammers can also bite, but it's the slide that bites. An extended beavertail prevents the shooters hand from being positioned too high.

So, I was wondering if there are any after market attachments as there are for Glocks.
The grip adapter beavertails on Gen 4 Glocks are to accommodate different size hands.....to prevent that slide bite. They do not mitigate recoil.
 
The grip adapter beavertails on Gen 4 Glocks are to accommodate different size hands.....to prevent that slide bite. They do not mitigate recoil.

I think that's mostly right, although beavertails and grip ergos generally do have some impact on how people experience recoil. For one thing, anything that allows or encourages the shooter to get their hand up high on the gun will reduce muzzle flip, which is perhaps the most salient/dramatic aspect of recoil. For another, area of contact can have a significant influence on how much "smack" a gun is perceived to have. If a grip change causes there to be more flesh-to-grip area on the rear of the gun, that can reduce some of the "owie" feeling to the shooter.
 
Sounds like the Beretta is not for you. If you can't rack the slide it isn't a gun, it is a paperweight. Try a S&W Shield EZ .380- it was designed specifically for people with less hand strength.
 
Let’s not get the cart before the horse. Field strip, inspect for problems, reassemble, rack. If it is exceedingly difficult, take 2 rounds out of the magazine and try it again as the top round may be riding the bottom of the slide causing friction. Once you eliminate potential problems hampering the slide manipulation then it’s time to start looking at other stuff. If grip strength is an issue then you can do workouts to improve that.
 
This thread kind of shocked me, I've owned an 84 or a BDA since about 1980, and having a problem working the slide is something I didn't think was a problem. My mother could do it without any real drama and she didn't have much hand strength. Cocking the hammer is about the only thing I can think of to lessen it. The recoil being a problem? Maybe that Cheeta line isn't for the OP.
 
When I got my 84F a couple years ago, I was surprised at how hard it was to draw back the slide.
For me, it was just something to be aware of... didn’t need to buy a hand exerciser or anything.
I just grab the slide a little farther forward, to get a good grip on the slide serrations. As you can see in my photo, the 84 slide serrations are positioned a little further forward on the slide, and when I was grabbing the slide, I was getting too much smooth metal.
As for recoil, that never bothered me, and I shoot Underwood +P XTP’s in mine.
Pachmayr did make rubber grips for the 84, and they can be found on eBay from time to time.
The 84 is, in my opinion, the best 380 combat pistol made.
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Pachmayr did make rubber grips for the 84, and they can be found on eBay from time to time.

I believe the grips show in your photo were in fact made by Farrar, a company later bought by Hogue. These are known as the Indiana State Police grips and they are excellent in every way. Pachmayr may also make after market grips... I'm not sure.
 
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Push AND Pull.
Push the gun forward, pull the slide back. Lots of people only pull on the slide.

I wish I had a dollar for all the folks I have tried to show/explain this to.

Grasp the slide the "weak" hand (over the top) hold it firmly . Now PUSH forward with the "strong" hand.

Much easier than trying to "pull" the slide back. Practice with a empty gun.
 
I believe the grips show in your photo were in fact made by Farrer, a company later bought by Hogue. These are known as the Indiana State Police grips and they are excellent in every way. Pachmayr may also make after market grips... I'm not sure.

yes, those are Farrar ISP grips, which I like very much. Pachmayr did make their Signature grip, wrap around with back strap, rubber grip. They work very well. I have a pair somewhere.
 
The Israelis liked and used many different Beretta models, including the 84, and taught to push forward with the hand the grip is on, and rearward simultaneously, just like Rule 3 explains. The hand on the grip has much more force available.
 
Grasp the slide the "weak" hand (over the top) hold it firmly . .

Whether it's better to pinch between the thumb and the side of the index finger knuckle or, as you suggest, between the base of the palm and the fingertips is variable depending on individual patterns of hand strength.

I can apply more force with the former (I measured it with a scale some years ago). I am not unique in that regard. People should try both.

I agree about pushing with the strong hand helping some people.
 
Confronting the problem of the hard to rack slide on my Beretta 81 I decided to look at the problem from every angle - the first thing that occurred to me was that the actual force required measured in lbs. was very little, in fact it was only a fraction of the effort required to draw my 80 lb bow, which is a similar movement to racking the slide and uses pretty much the same muscles. The actual force required could easily be achieved by a moderately fit 100 lb. person! I tried using different grips and techniques and positions - I found I was the strongest with my 2 arms extended skyward at a 45 degree angle to my body, but this only made it slightly easier to rack and is certainly not a practical posture when one has a gun in their hand. I concluded the problem was not with me but with the gun design.

My Beretta Cheetah is the early B model, so the following factors contributed to the problem : 1 - The blued finish created a very, glossy, slick surface on the slide. 2 - Unlike the later F models the slide serrations extended only half as far (just 1 inch long) and with no second set of serrations at the front of the barrel. 3 - The 81 are 84 series are a double stack design which means the grip is wider than the the slide, making it impossible, using the overhand grip, to achieve solid contact and pressure with the palm of the hand. This is made worse by the fact that protruding even further than the grips are the slide release and safety levers, both with sharp edges. The top of the grip also has a lovely sharp corner. This can all be confirmed by the fact there are cocking aids that fit over the front barrel making it easy for the left or weak hand to get a solid grip and taking the effort out of racking the slide. So the problem is this: the weak small muscle groups of the fingers and thumb trying to grip a very non-ergonomic surface.

Experimenting, I did find a technique that is working for me, but perhaps not for everyone and may raise some protests from a safety standpoint, though I don't see why. Standing with my feet about a foot apart, arms hanging down, gripping the gun with trigger hand, the weak hand with a thumb and the base of the forefinger (slingshot) grip on the slide and barrel pointing down towards a point on the ground to the left of center and out in front about ten inches - sharply thrust down with the right (dominant) arm while keeping the left arm slightly bent at the elbow and concentrating its strength in gripping the barrel. The energy comes from straightening the right arm, but I found an even better effect came from keeping the arms straight the entire time and in a teeter-totter motion sharply dropping the right shoulder while simultaneously raising the left as if the shoulders were fixed to a pivot point at the top of the sternum.

There is one other trick I want to mention, but first a question - Common, I think, to mostly earlier Berettas, at the front of the slide, about a half inch back the slide begins to flare out on both sides of the barrel creating an indentation. I don't know its purpose other than for saving weight where the extra thickness was not needed, But it makes a very grip-able shape for the left hand thumb and fore-finger grip - I found it provided a better gripping area then the slide serrations did, making sure, of course, the fingers stayed clear of the end of the barrel.
 
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Yes, it's got a stiff recoil spring and it's hard to rack the slide if the hammer's not cocked. Don't try to change the gun to make it easier to rack. The consequences of doing so will be reflected in some other undesired behavior. It is the way it is because it's necessary. Either adapt your technique to the gun's characteristics or get a different gun.
 
If you are a large person reading this and you've never shot a Beretta 84...

I have had one for several years. I've never had trouble racking the slide. The recoil is not at all sharp to me. I could shoot it all day, NP.

I'm also a very large person. It has pretty big grips, so even someone my size has no trouble holding onto it. For me it's a nice little belt pistol.

A smaller person might easily have trouble with it. I can see how there might be problems.

However, if you are a larger person and have considered getting a Beretta 84 or 81, don't worry about it. They should be easy and pleasant for you to shoot.

I put Altamont grips on mine, which makes them even easier for me to hold onto. The Israeli surplus 84 is on the left, kind of dinged up. The Italian surplus 81 on the right is in nicer shape.

 
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