Help with Rifle Action and Caliber

[DFW1911]

Okay, I did a search on this and not much came up, so I guess everybody already knows the answers to the following questions

First, I'm not much of a rifle guy. I have some bolt actions, some lever, and some semi-auto. Calibers range from 5.56 to .30-06. I don't have any side-by-side rifles yet, but I've never needed to shoot an elephant

Here's my question: is one type of action "stronger" than others, thereby allowing it to shoot more powerful rounds OR are the action and caliber matched more as function of which caliber works well with a certain type of action?

As an example, if I wanted a .338 I could find one in bolt action without any problem, but not in lever action. Why?

We can replace the .338 with something like a .458 and same thing, right? If so, can we draw a conclusion that lever actions are limited to "less powerful" cartridges?

I hope this makes sense.

Thanks for the help,
DFW1911

 

[JesseL]

There are quite few variations of lever action locking mechanisms, and they're not all created equal.

Something like a toggle link Winchester '73 can only handle low pressure handgun rounds, while a Browning BLR (which is essentially a lever operated bolt action) can handle some of the highest pressure magnum rounds out there.

 

[highorder]

Here's my question: is one type of action "stronger" than others, thereby allowing it to shoot more powerful rounds OR are the action and caliber matched more as function of which caliber works well with a certain type of action?

yes to both

rimmed rounds are more suited to single shot and lever guns, though not exclusive. The same applies to rimless rounds and bolt action and semi auto rifles, once again, not exclusively.


+1 on Jesse's info on the BLR. it really is a lever actuated bolt action.

 

[Shawnee]

+1 for the Broening BLR.

Comes in several calibers that are more than powerful enough for anything that walks on this continent and it's a fine rifle too.

 

[Slamfire]

Here's my question: is one type of action "stronger" than others, thereby allowing it to shoot more powerful rounds OR are the action and caliber matched more as function of which caliber works well with a certain type of action?

Action design is a very interesting topic to me. And the answer is yes.

I view action strength as how well an action supports the cartridge case. The first thing to fail is the cartridge, it is brass, it will burst before steel.

All actions have a bit of the cartridge case head sticking out. You have to put the extractor someplace. Actions that minimize the amount of unsupported cartridge are “stronger” than actions which provide less support. The Mauser 98 action is particulary good in this respect. The Arisaka was even a bit better. The M1903, M1917, and M70, allow more unsupported case head than a M98. The case is more likely to burst, in an overpressure situation in those actions, than a M98. Of course at some point, given enough pressure, the cartridge will also burst in a M98.

Another, important factor is action flex. And this is why traditional lever actions are “weaker” than forward locking bolt actions.

The cartridge case will withstand about .006” of stretch without rupture. (rule of thumb) Beyond that, it will rupture at some point.

Steel compresses. Under a load of 4000 pounds, the total amount of compression is about .0001” inches per inch on a one inch square column of steel. I did my calculations based on the data at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young's_modulus

Just based on the material properties, an action is going to flex depending on the distance between the bolt face and the action lugs. A rear locking bolt is going to flex more than a front locking bolt. Flexible actions are more likely to allow a case to stretch too much, particularly in overpressure situations, exposing thin sections of the case. Which can rupture if pressures are too high.

Most traditional lever actions are rear lockers.

Action design is a compromise. The strongest action probably would be a single shot mechanism but those are slow to reload. When you start cutting holes in things, to fit a bolt, locking lugs, magazine, action design becomes a real art of balancing contradictory issues and desires.

Take a look at Stuart Ottenson’s two books on the The Bolt Action. The first book is the best.

 

[highlander 5]

Many years ago,a gun writer converted a Browning semi auto from 7mm Rem mag to 458 win mag took quite a bit of tinkering to get it to work but in the it did but didn't reduce recoil much. It was either George Nonte or Jack Lott I can't
remember which. I tend myself to favor single shots Browning,Ruger Sharps,but I do have bolt actions and semi autos. Not that excited about lever guns but the current crop of pump actions(Colt Lightning Clones) make my heart skip a beat

 

[KBintheSLC]

First, I'm not much of a rifle guy. I have some bolt actions, some lever, and some semi-auto. Calibers range from 5.56 to .30-06.

You sound like a rifle guy to me.

As an example, if I wanted a .338 I could find one in bolt action without any problem, but not in lever action. Why?

Not sure why, but I tend to prefer a bolt over a lever. I think that most hunters do as well. Maybe thats why. I like the simplicity of the bolt action. Ole reliable.

 

[highorder]

thats a great post, Slamfire.

All actions have a bit of the cartridge case head sticking out. You have to put the extractor someplace.

the first thing that came to mind after reading that was a singular exception. (edit: you were probably refering to bolt and lever actions, weren't ya?) The T/C Encore. The captive extractor in those guns allows for maximum support of the case head, allowing for easy fireforming of wildcat brass.

 

[DFW1911]

Thanks, all, for your replies. Slamfire, I really learned A LOT by reading your posting, it cleared up quite a bit for me.

I have checked out the Browning BLR and yep, it's available in calibers I would have considered to be "bolt action only" prior to your recommendations.

Again, thank you all very much. I look forward to what others have to say as I try to gain some more knowledge on this subject.

Take care,
DFW1911

 

[Slamfire]

I really did not answer your question about how cartridges and actions are matched. But I hope by understanding a bit about cartridge support and action rigidity, you can see how they are inter related.

You can use a less rigid action on cartridges of lower pressure. Some of those actions are very compact and fast loading, so you get some advantages, for some trade offs.

I am glad if I was of help, to all.