How to find guns registered in one's name

[45_auto]

"remember the second doesn't allow restriction of firearms ownership under any circumstances, as written." Emphasis now added by me at this time.

Seems that a few people disagree with you.

Justice Stevens in dissent:

When each word in the text is given full effect, the Amendment is most naturally read to secure to the people a right to use and possess arms in conjunction with service in a well-regulated militia. So far as appears, no more than that was contemplated by its drafters or is encompassed within its terms. Even if the meaning of the text were genuinely susceptible to more than one interpretation, the burden would remain on those advocating a departure from the purpose identified in the preamble and from settled law to come forward with persuasive new arguments or evidence. The textual analysis offered by respondent and embraced by the Court falls far short of sustaining that heavy burden. And the Court’s emphatic reliance on the claim “that the Second Amendment … codified a pre-existing right,” ante, at 19 [refers to page 19 of the opinion], is of course beside the point because the right to keep and bear arms for service in a state militia was also a pre-existing right.

 

[GarySTL]

I once received a call from the FBI asking if I owned a S&W 15 serial # xxx. I said I owned one at one time but didn't know the #. The agent assured me that was the #.
I said I'd traded it to a dealer for a model 19 about 3 years back. He asked if I had the name of the buyer, as I'd written a check for the difference I was able to provide the information on the dealer. He was happy about that as the gun had been recovered after a bank robbery in Kentucky. I asked how long it had taken to trace the gun to me and he said about two days.
If I'd sold to a private party they might have been out of luck.

 

[Sam1911]

Now you know right well that no self-respecting freedom loving American should ever quote Justice Stevens on ANYTHING.

 

[Jlr2267]

That's one of the reasons I like C&R's and why I have a FFL03. If the buyer or seller will not give me the information I need for my bound book (and let me copy it down) then there is no deal.

You don't need an FFL to do that...

 

[Sunray]

"...the late and unlamented Canadian firearms registration scheme...." Only the 'long gun' registry is gone. Those being hunting rifles and shotguns. Doesn't apply to handguns or long guns declared inherently evil. FAL's, for example.
"...Indiana don't have no steenking registration..." No State run registry, but your State Police can get ATF records. Been telling you guys for years the ATF forms are defacto registration.

 

[Sam1911]

No State run registry, but your State Police can get ATF records. Been telling you guys for years the ATF forms are defacto registration.

Actually, they can't. Or at least not directly. As I pointed out before, if the police find a gun and want to trace IT, they can sometimes trace it down the chain to the point of asking a specific gun shop who bought it. They can't call up the ATF and find out anything about a gun, or about a gun owner. They can't go somewhere and see what guns you have, or what guns are registered to you, or if you even own any guns at all.

If it be a registration, it doesn't fit almost any of the definitions of one that we'd recognize.

 

[breakingcontact]

Many of these opinions expressed here...recording everything, bills of sale, selling to dealers and not individuals are the complete opposite attitudes and behaviors or every gun owning Texan I personally know.

 

[CB900F]

45-Auto;

Of course some judicial members disagree with me, witness the state of the second as it exists as per the law today rather than when it was written. I may have to obey the present restrictions, but I don't happen to have to believe that those restrictions are proper law. I am, so far, allowed to work to rescind what I quite firmly believe is the corruption of the second for base political purpose. Refer to the state of New York's infamous Sullivan Act as a case in point.

900F

 

[Jim Watson]

You think?
We read accounts of dealers complaining about high-handed batmen wanting to photograph their bound books. How many do you think just knuckle under and contribute to the database?
The System isn't perfect, but they are working on it as funding and fako made up bureaucratic regulations allow.

A face to face deal for cash in a parking lot seems to be about the only loophole left. If your transaction wasn't with a stool pigeon.

 

[huntsman]

I have no problem with breaking the 4473 chain whenever I can do so. If you won't sell to me privately because I won't provide you with a driver's license number, so what?

+100 there seems to be some in the gun community who are all too willing to play volunteer cop.

 

[easy]

CA AG has a form for that:
Automated Firearms System (AFS) Request for Firearm Records (BOF 053)

AFS is reputed to be incomplete and at times inaccurate.

True that. Had one of those letters at one time. Showed all handguns that had ever had my name on them. Still showed my name on stolen and sold handguns. So the database is inaccurate. No longer live in CA.

 

[Twiki357]

Center fire. CA has been registering handguns since well before I bought my first one in 1958. If you go to the CA DOJ website, there is a form that you can print or download and print to request that info. Check the link in the Librarian’s post # 25. There is no charge (Or at least there wasn’t a few years ago) to get a printout, but you do have to provide proof of identity by a photocopy of your DL or ?. I can’t speak to recent handgun purchases, but, at least older records, are VERY inaccurate.

I requested a printout in 2010 of the handguns that I had purchased when I was misfortunate enough to live in CA. Two guns were not on the list; one on the list that I never heard of, and one of two that were stolen in 1986 still showed as in my possession.

 

[rope2feet]

AFS Request for CA

I have heard that if LE ever has cause to search your residence and does NOT find all the firearms on the AFS list, you can have major problems trying to explain.

Some folks advise obtaining your list to see what is registered in your name and then cross checking with your inventory. If you no longer own a firearm but it is still on the list, you can send proof of sale to the AG and they will remove that firearm from your list.

 

[CB900F]

Fella's;

And it's my belief, due to experience, that a bureaucrat will always sacrifice you to preserve his comfort regardless of circumstances or reason. He or she may not be correct and accurate, but that's most assuredly your problem.

900F

 

[Librarian]

I have heard that if LE ever has cause to search your residence and does NOT find all the firearms on the AFS list, you can have major problems trying to explain.

That's possible.

I think there is already enough evidence that AFS has problems - for example, the folks trying to do the Armed Prohibited Persons enforcement are having difficulty getting warrants, so are reduced to knocking and asking - that ultimately one would prevail in court.

But it might be costly in time and treasure to do that, so maintaining your own records of dispositions seems prudent.

 

[Agsalaska]

Fella's;


I have no problem with breaking the 4473 chain whenever I can do so. If you won't sell to me privately because I won't provide you with a driver's license number, so what? The next guy will get my money and we'll both be happy and supporting the idea of the second amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America as written IMHO. Remember, the second doesn't allow restriction of firearms ownership under any circumstances, as written. And it effectively says that that wide open right shall not be fooled with either. Or, Wyatt Earp in Dodge City Kansas was a Federal felon.

900F

Wanting a bill of sale for a private transaction has absolutely nothing to do with the 2nd amendment of the constitution of the United States. None.

 

[TennJed]

CA must be different from NY in that regard. Handgun owners in NY have paperwork in their possession that lists all handguns currently registered to them. You have to carry it, along with your permit, when you're carrying a handgun. I'm supposed to contact the sheriff's office when I sell a handgun, in order to get it "off my permit." I always do that ASAP, for obvious reasons.

No one could register a gun in my name unless they got a hold of my permit and could alter the picture to resemble themselves before they go in to register the gun.

wow, just wow. Thank god for Mississippi. Having to carry a list of my guns around with me like I am a school kid is absurd

 

[1SOW]

Short story:

My son bought an XD 45 pistol from a private party. No paperwork needed or used.
About 5-6 years ago his house was broken into and the pistol was stolen. He of course reported the theft to the local police who asked for and got the pistol's serial number.

"Last week" he recieved a call from ATF to come pick up his XD. He did so.

As said above , if any entry into the system is made, it's available to all authorized to use it.

 

[happygeek]

I wrote this a while back:

Any idea if they solve many crimes using that? Everything I've seen says Canada's now defunct registry helped once or twice. If a full on registry did that, I have to wonder about an incomplete one like 4473s.

Yup the same way it was done with Lee Harvey Oswald's rifle, using normal, pre-computer business records: manufacturer/importer to seller to buyer, before the GCA added an extra layer of paperwork to harass gun buyers.

Yep. I'd never heard much about the 1938 law, probably since the 68 GCA replaced it. After Googling and reading it (https://homicide.northwestern.edu/docs_fk/homicide/laws/national_firearms_act_of_1938.pdf) the 68 GCA made even less sense to me.

 

[toivo]

Having to carry a list of my guns around with me like I am a school kid is absurd

Tell me about it. And every time I buy a new handgun or take off one that I sold, I pay the state $5 for the "amendment" of my permit.

 

[CB900F]

Agsalaska;

We obviously have differing philosophies. My point was that, as written, the second allows for no restrictions upon a citizen of this country's right to possess a firearm. I find that refusing to buy a firearm with a bill of sale requirement attached as part of the deal is in the spirit of the second. You apparently don't see the correlation, or don't believe it's relevant. So be it, I simply don't agree with you.

900F

 

[Sam1911]

I find that refusing to buy a firearm with a bill of sale requirement attached as part of the deal is in the spirit of the second.

You could say pretty much anything you choose to do is "in the spirit of" the 2nd Amendment, but refusing to use a bill of sale is a pretty tangential effort.

Bills of sale are used commonly for any sort of transaction where goods are exchanged for money and have nothing at all to do with government restrictions on or regulation of the keeping and bearing of arms.

 

[Sam1911]

Any idea if they solve many crimes using that?

There are several descriptions of how it has been used in this very thread. Read post 8.

So sure, it does get used in some criminal cases. Whether or not many (or any) couldn't have been solved without it would be harder to say.

Occasionally that info is used to return guns to their rightful owners, too. (As noted later in the thread.)

 

[45_auto]

Now you know right well that no self-respecting freedom loving American should ever quote Justice Stevens on ANYTHING.

Not saying that I agree with him. Just pointing out that there is a good possibility that the majority of the American voters (as evidenced by the last presidential election) DO agree with Stevens that the Second Amendment (just like the First Amendment and all the rest) DOES allow for certain restrictions as written.

 

[Jim Watson]

There are several descriptions of how it has been used in this very thread. Read post 8.

I don't think tracing Bremer's gun actually solved anything, considering that police and SS jumped on Bremer on the spot and had him and the Charter Arms in hand immediately.
More like going to show preparation and premeditiation.