I guess I’ll find out. I just ordered 500 125-grain LSWC bullets for 9mm target loads. They cut holes nearly as well as full wadcutters and hopefully will cycle in my 9mm pistols and rifle. I’ll start with Lyman cast data for a 125-grain conical nose and see what happens.
How to Load LSWC For 9mm
- Thread starter DMW1116
- Start date
CoalCrackerAl
Member
I haven't loaded SWC'S in 9mm. But have in 45 acp 200 grain. They worked great.
Bill M
Member
I've been using an MP 135gr mold with good results, my alloy casts about 132gr.
Finding the right OAL is about the only obstacle. My Kimber needs them far shorter than the Glock to chamber properly.
They (MBC 125 coated SWC) have fed fine in the two pistols and my Ruger carbine, solid accuracy.
They (MBC 125 coated SWC) have fed fine in the two pistols and my Ruger carbine, solid accuracy.
LiveLife
Member
No need for "guessing".
If you compare and transpose SWC shape over "stepped" RN, you will notice length, angle and flat tip width/meplat is same as RN profile with non-contact areas of RN added to the base to length it. So like loading "stepped" RN or 45ACP SWC, there should be about "thumbnail" thickness of shoulder above the case mouth to reliably feed and chamber from the magazine.
And since elongated bullet base will bulge the case neck more, if finished rounds won't fully chamber, try using thinner case wall brass like Blazer/FC/Speer - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...nd-bullet-setback.830072/page-3#post-10713822
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CoalCrackerAl
Member
The COAL listed in the Cast Bullet Manual are 1.069" for the bullet I intend to use. I don't think I'll have COAL issues, but the Canik Mete has the shortest chamber of the 9mms I shoot. It still fits with 147 grain RMR Heavy Match Winners seated at 1.145", but I don't think it will go much more. The others don't even care. The 1.069" COAL is considerably shorter than what I normally load in either HMW or 125-grain cast lead round nose. I might even go so far as to say uncomfortably short.
243winxb
Member
The bulge at the bullets base, when loaded in some brands of brass, may be an issue. As said.
Like this.
Like this.
LiveLife
Member
Why "uncomfortable"?
Are you concerned about deeper seating depth increasing pressure?
You understand that we must first determine Max/Working OAL using the plunk test/function test BEFORE we conduct powder work up?
If we are talking about "plunk test", as long as round drops into chamber freely and turn without hitting the rifling, we are good. Based on your posts, Canik Mete looks to have leade length between M&P Shield and Tactical Kinetics barrels and should be workable unless forward part of chamber is really tight to rub with case neck bulge as @243winxb posted - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...grain-projectiles.910788/page-2#post-12423914
If you are concerned about pressure increase, adjust your powder charge. If my working OAL/bullet seating depth is deeper than published, I consider adjusting my start/max charges by .2-.3 gr.
Since your posts mentioned HS-6, let's use that powder for calculations referencing Hodgdon's load data for 124 gr Lead CN - https://hodgdonreloading.com/rldc/
NOTE - Look and compare the bullet base of Cone Nose to SWC bullet base. Yes, SWC bullet base is longer.
- 9mm 125 gr Lead CN HS-6 COL 1.125" Start 5.9 gr (1,023 fps) - Max 6.6 gr (1,124 fps)
Then once I have reliable slide cycling and spent case extraction/ejection, I would incrementally increase powder charge by 0.1 gr and work up towards "adjusted" max charge of 6.0-6.3 gr while looking for accuracy trends. But my experience with HS-6 has been accuracy is optimized towards near max/max load data.
But of course, it's your fingers on the line, not mine so do whatever makes you less "uncomfortable".
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eddiememphis
Member
That's basically the issue. I generally don't seat bullets that deep in 9mm, but many cast loads, particularly in the Lyman manual, are in the sub-1.1" range for COAL. I pushed some of the Acme Green 125s down to 1.06" to get them to cycle when I was looking for a 9mm "Quiet" load. They cycled and were accurate, but I couldn't get the noise reduction I wanted. The case mouth ALMOST came up onto the ogive of the bullet. They cycled fine and dropped brass in front of my rear foot, so I don't know why it gives me the heeby-jeebys to seat bullets that deep, (as the manual I was using showed). I am in fact using the MBC SWC, so that difference is nice to see between a LCN and the SWC. My current plan is to leave about 1/32" of the body above the case rim, but I'll have to see once I get them in hand. Oddly, the Lyman data gives W231 as the highest velocity. I just got a new can, so that's likely where I'll start. HS-6 might work too. I have a high demand for both, using them in 38 Special, 9mm, and 357 Magnum. Maybe I'll get lucky and that lonely can of Silhouette will work better.Why "uncomfortable"?
Are you concerned about deeper seating depth increasing pressure?
You understand that we must first determine Max/Working OAL using the plunk test/function test BEFORE we conduct powder work up?
If we are talking about "plunk test", as long as round drops into chamber freely and turn without hitting the rifling, we are good. Based on your posts, Canik Mete looks to have leade length between M&P Shield and Tactical Kinetics barrels and should be workable unless forward part of chamber is really tight to rub with case neck bulge as @243winxb posted - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...grain-projectiles.910788/page-2#post-12423914
If you are concerned about pressure increase, adjust your powder charge. If my working OAL/bullet seating depth is deeper than published, I consider adjusting my start/max charges by .2-.3 gr.
Since your posts mentioned HS-6, let's use that powder for calculations referencing Hodgdon's load data for 124 gr Lead CN - https://hodgdonreloading.com/rldc/
NOTE - Look and compare the bullet base of Cone Nose to SWC bullet base. Yes, SWC bullet base is longer.
Let's say your working COL/OAL comes out to be 1.069" or even shorter 1.045", I would reduce my "initial" start charge for powder work up down to 5.6 gr. Heck, if you are really concerned using shorter 1.045" OAL, reduce it further like 5.0 gr until slide barely cycles and then work up from there.
- 9mm 125 gr Lead CN HS-6 COL 1.125" Start 5.9 gr (1,023 fps) - Max 6.6 gr (1,124 fps)
Then once I have reliable slide cycling and spent case extraction/ejection, I would incrementally increase powder charge by 0.1 gr and work up towards "adjusted" max charge of 6.0-6.3 gr while looking for accuracy trends. But my experience with HS-6 has been accuracy is optimized towards near max/max load data.
But of course, it's your fingers on the line, not mine so do whatever makes you less "uncomfortable".
I don't think that will be a problem, but I'll keep an eye out for it. I see that bulge in several cases when loading the 147-grain Heavy Match Winners. None have been an issue so far, so maybe these will be ok too.
I loaded my coated MBC 125’s to 1.055” and the sweet spot for me was 3.6 grains W231.
I would start at 3.2.
With a can I would think HS-6 would be louder than W231, more powder, more noise. W231 is also cleaner.
I would start at 3.2.
With a can I would think HS-6 would be louder than W231, more powder, more noise. W231 is also cleaner.
I have found HS-6 extremely accurate in my Canik with heavy bullets and in some 357 Magnum loads. I only have that one 9mm load with it, but it's one I use a lot for target shooting. That said, W231 is my generally preferred powder for 9mm and 38 Special. Those RMR HMW just shoot so well with HS-6 I couldn't leave it. 8 shots in 1.5 inches from 25 yards over a range of charge weights made me take notice.
LiveLife
Member
Hodgdon load data for 125 gr Lead CN with W231/HP-38 for comparison - https://hodgdonreloading.com/rldc/
- 9mm 125 gr Lead CN W231/HP-38 COL 1.125" Start 3.9 gr (1,009 fps) - Max 4.4 gr (1,086 fps)
After some consideration I think I’ll start with Lyman’s 120 grain data. That goes from 2.9 grains up to 4.3 with a COAL of 1.110” using W231. Should I have chambering issues I can seat deeper and keep trying. The lighter bullets have a wider charge range for testing purposes, and the max is only 0.1 grain difference between the two.
LiveLife
Member
I have the bullets in hand now and they look very much like the ones in the Lyman manual. I’ll still use the 2.9-4.3 range of W231 and 1.110” just for flexibility’s sake.
I've had great success with Missouri Bullet's 9mm 125 gr LSWC seated to 1.120 using 4.4 gr of Unique. I've not chrono'd it but QL say V~1100 fps, & with zero leading in several Sig's, a BHP and the Springfield Hi Power. Accuracy is better than what I've achieved with J bullets. Offhand, Weaver Stance groups from 10 yds are 1" or less when I'm having a "good eyes" day. Blue Dot works well too, as does BE-86.
I seat mine as far out as possible as limited by magazine size and the "drop" test to see if it'll chamber. All of the above chambered and were reliable with the Sigs, and HP's with OAL's of 1.110"- 1.120".
These are my loads, safe in my guns, you should work up to them if interested paying attention to pressure indications and AFTER consulting a GOOD, CURRENT loading manual. Best Regards, Rod
I seat mine as far out as possible as limited by magazine size and the "drop" test to see if it'll chamber. All of the above chambered and were reliable with the Sigs, and HP's with OAL's of 1.110"- 1.120".
These are my loads, safe in my guns, you should work up to them if interested paying attention to pressure indications and AFTER consulting a GOOD, CURRENT loading manual. Best Regards, Rod
I’ve loaded lots of them without incident. The shoulder generally has a bit of a rounded edge, and you don’t have to drive them as fast since they’re unjacketed lead. I’d use them again if I fell into them.
This is sort of unusual as far as loading goes, but W231 has the highest velocity in the Lyman Cast Bullet Manual. I've also found it to be accurate with cast bullets in handgun and rifle calibers, which means I have quite a few loads that use it. If that doesn't work, I'll try some other powders, but I don't anticipate a need to do so. I'm not terribly concerned with velocity. I've found W231 to be a good all-around powder for handguns where accuracy is the primary goal. If the velocity is up near the top, it's a bonus. A back-up powder is a good idea, so I may try CFE-Pistol or Silhouette.
GeoDudeFlorida
Member
- Joined
- Dec 1, 2020
- Messages
- 11,263
Try 244 also. It’s not as versatile as 231 or as energetic but it is consistent and works well with heavy bullets (142gr) in 9mm.
Saw some competition when I went to get some SPMP but didn’t bite. My pistols like heavy bullets anyway. My M&P9 likes 124-125 grain fare.
will depend on the gun but here I used to shoot keith 165 SWCs in a luger and it ran better than the crap 380 in a 9mm case they did back in the 70s and 80s before 9mm as SAMMI
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