dogtown tom
Member
Federal law allows ANYONE to ship a firearm. (Your state law may differ)
Below is what is allowed by Federal law, not necessarily what the carrier allows and that is addressed by USPS regulations or by the common carriers tariffs or policies. Fail to abide by USPS regulations and you violate federal law and face criminal consequences.
Failing to abide by a common carriers tariffs or policies isn't a crime, but you run the risk of them confiscating your package or refusing to pay for any loss due to damage or theft.
"Nonlicensee" refers to someone who does not possess a Federal Firearms License or FFL.
What is a firearm?
Well, its both the complete firearm and the frame or receiver of a disassembled firearm. It's internet myth that a disassembled firearm magically loses its legal status when field stripped. Whoever promotes or repeats the myth that it is "just machine parts" is a complete and total idiot and should never be consulted about firearms again....because that is contrary to Federal law. (not to mention common sense)
What are "Firearms" under Federal law or ATF regulations may not be identical to how a common carrier (UPS, FedEx) or USPS defines "firearm".
Who can you legally ship to?
All interstate shipments of firearms must be addressed to a licensed firearms dealer (often called an FFL). The exceptions are:
1. when you ship to yourself at an address in another state and
2. the return of a firearm you sent to a manufacturer to be repaired.
There is no such thing as a "family exemption".
If shipping a firearm to yourself only YOU can tender the shipment and only YOU can open the box at the destination. So if you plan to visit Cousin Eddie and ship your gun to his address make sure he does not open the box. To do so becomes an illegal interstate transfer of a firearm.
Federal law allows you to ship a firearm to a resident of the same state (intrastate) as long as you have no reason to believe that the recipient is a prohibited person.
While federal law allows you to ship a firearm directly to a manufacturer for repair and federal law allows for the direct return of that repaired or a replacement firearm of the same kind or type, not all manufacturers are willing to return directly, they'll want to ship to an FFL who will transfer to you.
How do I know the recipient is a licensed dealer? There is no requirement for a nonlicensee (mere mortals) to have an actual copy of the receiving dealers FFL. (When FFL's ship we are required to have a copy of the receiving dealers license before we can ship).
You can verify that the recipient is a bona fide dealer through the ATF FFL eZCheck: https://fflezcheck.atf.gov/FFLEzCheck/ You'll need the first three and last five digits of the receiving dealers FFL number. The result shows the dealers premises address and mailing address. You should verify with the dealer which address is his shipping address.
Be aware that some dealers refuse to accept shipments from nonlicensees as their personal business policy. Usually this is because they are terrified that the package will arrive with an RPG inside and no information as to who shipped it. Although it is not required by law, it is common courtesy to include a copy of your drivers license (for nonlicensees) or a copy of your FFL (for dealers). Dealers are required to record the identity of the person they received the firearm from.....and a DL or FFL makes this easy. If you refuse to comply with the request for a DL or FFL.....then don't ship the gun. As evidenced by recent threads, the dealer may refuse to accept the package or delay the transfer to the buyer until he has the documents he requested.
Newspaper is for dolts
, pros use bubble wrap
When you prepare your firearm for shipment, avoid newspaper like the plague. It crushes easily, provides little protective value and if wadded tightly....weighs a ton and weight adds $$$$ to your shipping costs.
A good rule of thumb is to package the gun as if it were YOUR prized family heirloom. Put yourself in the shoes of the buyer.....who deserves to get the gun as depicted in the auction/WTS forum, etc.
I've received guns wrapped in newspaper, vinyl float tubes, foam mattresses, Saran Wrap, plastic WalMart bags, old socks, baby diapers, bath towels.....obviously the shipper does not know the physical nature of package delivery or they just flat don't care whether the gun arrives in one piece. If your shipment is damaged, USPS/UPS/FedEx will all deny claims if you do not use PROPER packing materials (and newspaper is not one of them).
When packaging your firearm, do so with the expectation that it will be mishandled, abused, dropped repeatedly, stepped on and the like. Protect rifle muzzles as they will poke out the sides of a box. If you shake the box vigorously and the firearm moves? You didn't pack well.
Where do I get cheap packing materials?
Try a gun store. They will have loads of excellent USED packing materials: bubble wrap, packing peanuts, kraft paper, air pillows, etc.
As far as packaging, the only Federal law you need to be aware of is identifying the contents as a "firearm"...........DON'T! This means you cannot mark "Fragile...EXPENSIVE GUN INSIDE" on the outside of the box. It also means you don't ship that Remington 700 in the factory cardboard box that has a giant REMINGTON in big green letters on the outside. (this is secret code for STEAL ME NOW) Simply slide the factory box inside another cardboard box. UPS and FedEx will not accept boxes with paper wrappers, although the USPS will.......but don't do it. Your label can easily be torn off.
Note that shipping to "Bud's Gun Shop" may attract more attention than "BGS Inc". I make it a practice to try and not put anything on the shipping label that helps a thief.
Where do I get a cardboard box big enough to ship a rifle/shotgun?
Again, try a gun store. I throw out cardboard boxes every day and so does every other gun store. I always have extras stored in my garage. If you are shipping a $1,000 rifle or shotgun don't go get all frugal and jam that gun in a box you handmade from fifteen free UPS boxes that you taped together with duct tape......consider spending $10-15 on a plastic Plano or Dosko hard case. Consider removing the barrel from shotguns, as a short box is more rigid than a long box and that is better.
Shorter is better, shorter is cheaper. Boxes that exceed 48" in length incur a penalty from every carrier. Shorter boxes are also more rigid.
Who is better....USPS/FedEx/UPS?
IMO, they are equally awesome and inept. I ship and receive through all three every week.
For the last fourteen years I've used USPS almost exclusively for handguns with zero problems.
So, where can I ship my firearm?
USPS- will accept rifles and shotguns from ANYONE. Handguns and other firearms like frames, receivers, AR lowers are not mailable unless you are a licensed dealer or manufacturer. Even holders of an 03FFL "Collector of Curios & Relics" cannot mail or receive by mail, a firearm other than a rifle or shotgun. Link to USPS regulations on mailing firearms: regulation:https://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub5...9V*MTY3MTMwNDY3MC45LjEuMTY3MTMwNDY4Ny4wLjAuMA..
There is no requirement to notify USPS that you are shipping a rifle or shotgun. There are no forms to give them, you do not need to show them the FFL of the receiving dealer. You are not required to notify USPS that you are mailing a rifle or shotgun.
The ONLY persons REQUIRED to notify USPS that they are shipping a firearms are licensed dealers and manufacturers....and then only when shipping a handgun (and handguns are defined differently by USPS...basically any firearm that can be concealed on the person). If you are not a dealer and are asked to sign a Form 1508......don't do it! You would be falsifying a Federal document and the USPS clerk who asked you to do so is an idiot.
UPS- As of September, 2022, UPS no longer accepts firearm shipments from nonlicensees and requires dealers to enroll in their FFL Shipping Program.
UPS Firearm Shipping: https://www.ups.com/us/en/support/s...egulated-items/prohibited-items/firearms.page
You cannot ship firearms from a UPS Store, or other third party retailer. If the clerk says "No problem!"......well it is. It violates the carriers tariff. If you choose to ignore UPS policies expect to get nada on any insurance claim for loss, damage or theft. UPS may also seize or confiscate your firearm.
FedEx- As of September, 2021, FedEx no longer accepts firearm shipments from nonlicensees and requires dealers to enroll in their FFL Shipping Program.
FedEx Firearm Shipping:https://www.fedex.com/content/dam/fedex/us-united-states/services/Service_Guide_2021.pdf
You can no longer ship firearms from a FedEx Office location, or other third party retailer. If the clerk says "No problem!"......well it is. It violates the carriers tariff. If you choose to ignore FedEx policies expect to get nada on any insurance claim for loss, damage or theft. FedEx may also seize or confiscate your firearm.
It's in a box, what do I do now?
If it's a rifle or shotgun, go to USPS.com
You'll need to know the weight, box dimensions and destination zip code to get a price.
You can then:
Take it to your local post office and pay at the counter OR..............better yet, pay for and print a shipping label from home. This is CHEAPER than doing it at the post office. It is also less hassle and less hassle is a good thing.
My recommendations for shipping a rifle or shotgun:
USPS- ALWAYS go Priority Mail with Insurance for FULL VALUE and Adult Signature on Delivery. "Parcel Post" is cheaper but takes MUCH longer to get to the destination........the longer its in transit, the more opportunity to get lost, damaged or stolen. To me it isn't worth the small difference in price.
As no notification is EVER required at USPS.....they are the option with the smallest hassle factor.
As far as insurance....it protects you the seller from any claim for loss, damage or theft. If the firearm doesn't arrive as advertised, buyer gets his $$$ back. A claim can be filed by sender or recipient.
Shipping a Handgun (or firearms other than rifles or shotguns)
You have two choices, ignore FedEx/UPS and risk them keeping your firearm or have a licensed dealer mail it USPS or ship through FedEx/UPS for you.
Handguns that will fit in a USPS Priority Mail medium Flat Rate Box with $1000 worth of insurance and Adult Signature on Delivery ships for less than $44. Thats about half the cost of FedEx Overnight or UPS Next Day. If the dealer tacks on a reasonable fee (I charge $10) then you pay about half of what you would pay if you did it yourself......and the receiving dealer won't pitch a hissy fit because you forgot to enclose your drivers license.
I prefer Adult Signature vs Signature Confirmation or Delivery Confirmation.
Remember, what USPS considers a "handgun" is not the same as ATF. If you want to mail a firearm through USPS it better be either a rifle or shotgun. Nothing else.
No silencers, AR lowers, frames, receivers, barreled actions and no "pistol grip only" shotguns......all classified by USPS as handguns and only mailable by a licensed dealer, manufacturer or certain LE on official business.
Third Party Firearm shippers
Bud's Gun Shop operates a service called "Ship My Gun". You fill out a shipping label at shipmygun.com and they provide you with a shipping label from UPS or FedEx. I have no doubt UPS/FedEx tariffs prohibit this. The actual "shipper" is the person who tenders or delivers a firearm to a carrier, not who pays for or prints the shipping label.
If the above isn't enough......
Regarding the ATF FAQ's https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/may-nonlicensee-ship-firearm-common-or-contract-carrier It's wrong. ATF knows its wrong. ATF will not correct it. If you read the citations to federal law below that FAQ answer youll see that notification to a common carrier is only required when shipping INTERSTATE to another nonlicensee. And that's already a federal crime.
03FFL Collector of Curios & Relics
Can only mail handguns meeting the definition of "antique" via the USPS. Meaning pre1898 only.
My gun, that I own is in another state, can my friend, mother, brother or someone there ship it to me?
No.
While you "own" it, you don't currently possess it. The firearm would have to be shipped to an FFL in your state.
Below is what is allowed by Federal law, not necessarily what the carrier allows and that is addressed by USPS regulations or by the common carriers tariffs or policies. Fail to abide by USPS regulations and you violate federal law and face criminal consequences.
Failing to abide by a common carriers tariffs or policies isn't a crime, but you run the risk of them confiscating your package or refusing to pay for any loss due to damage or theft.
"Nonlicensee" refers to someone who does not possess a Federal Firearms License or FFL.
What is a firearm?
Well, its both the complete firearm and the frame or receiver of a disassembled firearm. It's internet myth that a disassembled firearm magically loses its legal status when field stripped. Whoever promotes or repeats the myth that it is "just machine parts" is a complete and total idiot and should never be consulted about firearms again....because that is contrary to Federal law. (not to mention common sense)
What are "Firearms" under Federal law or ATF regulations may not be identical to how a common carrier (UPS, FedEx) or USPS defines "firearm".
Who can you legally ship to?
All interstate shipments of firearms must be addressed to a licensed firearms dealer (often called an FFL). The exceptions are:
1. when you ship to yourself at an address in another state and
2. the return of a firearm you sent to a manufacturer to be repaired.
There is no such thing as a "family exemption".
If shipping a firearm to yourself only YOU can tender the shipment and only YOU can open the box at the destination. So if you plan to visit Cousin Eddie and ship your gun to his address make sure he does not open the box. To do so becomes an illegal interstate transfer of a firearm.
Federal law allows you to ship a firearm to a resident of the same state (intrastate) as long as you have no reason to believe that the recipient is a prohibited person.
While federal law allows you to ship a firearm directly to a manufacturer for repair and federal law allows for the direct return of that repaired or a replacement firearm of the same kind or type, not all manufacturers are willing to return directly, they'll want to ship to an FFL who will transfer to you.
How do I know the recipient is a licensed dealer? There is no requirement for a nonlicensee (mere mortals) to have an actual copy of the receiving dealers FFL. (When FFL's ship we are required to have a copy of the receiving dealers license before we can ship).
You can verify that the recipient is a bona fide dealer through the ATF FFL eZCheck: https://fflezcheck.atf.gov/FFLEzCheck/ You'll need the first three and last five digits of the receiving dealers FFL number. The result shows the dealers premises address and mailing address. You should verify with the dealer which address is his shipping address.
Be aware that some dealers refuse to accept shipments from nonlicensees as their personal business policy. Usually this is because they are terrified that the package will arrive with an RPG inside and no information as to who shipped it. Although it is not required by law, it is common courtesy to include a copy of your drivers license (for nonlicensees) or a copy of your FFL (for dealers). Dealers are required to record the identity of the person they received the firearm from.....and a DL or FFL makes this easy. If you refuse to comply with the request for a DL or FFL.....then don't ship the gun. As evidenced by recent threads, the dealer may refuse to accept the package or delay the transfer to the buyer until he has the documents he requested.
Newspaper is for dolts
, pros use bubble wrapWhen you prepare your firearm for shipment, avoid newspaper like the plague. It crushes easily, provides little protective value and if wadded tightly....weighs a ton and weight adds $$$$ to your shipping costs.
A good rule of thumb is to package the gun as if it were YOUR prized family heirloom. Put yourself in the shoes of the buyer.....who deserves to get the gun as depicted in the auction/WTS forum, etc.
I've received guns wrapped in newspaper, vinyl float tubes, foam mattresses, Saran Wrap, plastic WalMart bags, old socks, baby diapers, bath towels.....obviously the shipper does not know the physical nature of package delivery or they just flat don't care whether the gun arrives in one piece. If your shipment is damaged, USPS/UPS/FedEx will all deny claims if you do not use PROPER packing materials (and newspaper is not one of them
).When packaging your firearm, do so with the expectation that it will be mishandled, abused, dropped repeatedly, stepped on and the like. Protect rifle muzzles as they will poke out the sides of a box. If you shake the box vigorously and the firearm moves? You didn't pack well.
Where do I get cheap packing materials?
Try a gun store. They will have loads of excellent USED packing materials: bubble wrap, packing peanuts, kraft paper, air pillows, etc.
As far as packaging, the only Federal law you need to be aware of is identifying the contents as a "firearm"...........DON'T! This means you cannot mark "Fragile...EXPENSIVE GUN INSIDE" on the outside of the box. It also means you don't ship that Remington 700 in the factory cardboard box that has a giant REMINGTON in big green letters on the outside. (this is secret code for STEAL ME NOW) Simply slide the factory box inside another cardboard box. UPS and FedEx will not accept boxes with paper wrappers, although the USPS will.......but don't do it. Your label can easily be torn off.
Note that shipping to "Bud's Gun Shop" may attract more attention than "BGS Inc". I make it a practice to try and not put anything on the shipping label that helps a thief.
Where do I get a cardboard box big enough to ship a rifle/shotgun?
Again, try a gun store. I throw out cardboard boxes every day and so does every other gun store. I always have extras stored in my garage. If you are shipping a $1,000 rifle or shotgun don't go get all frugal and jam that gun in a box you handmade from fifteen free UPS boxes that you taped together with duct tape......consider spending $10-15 on a plastic Plano or Dosko hard case. Consider removing the barrel from shotguns, as a short box is more rigid than a long box and that is better.
Shorter is better, shorter is cheaper. Boxes that exceed 48" in length incur a penalty from every carrier. Shorter boxes are also more rigid.
Who is better....USPS/FedEx/UPS?
IMO, they are equally awesome and inept. I ship and receive through all three every week.
For the last fourteen years I've used USPS almost exclusively for handguns with zero problems.
So, where can I ship my firearm?
USPS- will accept rifles and shotguns from ANYONE. Handguns and other firearms like frames, receivers, AR lowers are not mailable unless you are a licensed dealer or manufacturer. Even holders of an 03FFL "Collector of Curios & Relics" cannot mail or receive by mail, a firearm other than a rifle or shotgun. Link to USPS regulations on mailing firearms: regulation:https://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub5...9V*MTY3MTMwNDY3MC45LjEuMTY3MTMwNDY4Ny4wLjAuMA..
There is no requirement to notify USPS that you are shipping a rifle or shotgun. There are no forms to give them, you do not need to show them the FFL of the receiving dealer. You are not required to notify USPS that you are mailing a rifle or shotgun.
The ONLY persons REQUIRED to notify USPS that they are shipping a firearms are licensed dealers and manufacturers....and then only when shipping a handgun (and handguns are defined differently by USPS...basically any firearm that can be concealed on the person). If you are not a dealer and are asked to sign a Form 1508......don't do it! You would be falsifying a Federal document and the USPS clerk who asked you to do so is an idiot.
UPS- As of September, 2022, UPS no longer accepts firearm shipments from nonlicensees and requires dealers to enroll in their FFL Shipping Program.
UPS Firearm Shipping: https://www.ups.com/us/en/support/s...egulated-items/prohibited-items/firearms.page
You cannot ship firearms from a UPS Store, or other third party retailer. If the clerk says "No problem!"......well it is. It violates the carriers tariff. If you choose to ignore UPS policies expect to get nada on any insurance claim for loss, damage or theft. UPS may also seize or confiscate your firearm.
FedEx- As of September, 2021, FedEx no longer accepts firearm shipments from nonlicensees and requires dealers to enroll in their FFL Shipping Program.
FedEx Firearm Shipping:https://www.fedex.com/content/dam/fedex/us-united-states/services/Service_Guide_2021.pdf
You can no longer ship firearms from a FedEx Office location, or other third party retailer. If the clerk says "No problem!"......well it is. It violates the carriers tariff. If you choose to ignore FedEx policies expect to get nada on any insurance claim for loss, damage or theft. FedEx may also seize or confiscate your firearm.
It's in a box, what do I do now?
If it's a rifle or shotgun, go to USPS.com
You'll need to know the weight, box dimensions and destination zip code to get a price.
You can then:
Take it to your local post office and pay at the counter OR..............better yet, pay for and print a shipping label from home. This is CHEAPER than doing it at the post office. It is also less hassle and less hassle is a good thing.
My recommendations for shipping a rifle or shotgun:
USPS- ALWAYS go Priority Mail with Insurance for FULL VALUE and Adult Signature on Delivery. "Parcel Post" is cheaper but takes MUCH longer to get to the destination........the longer its in transit, the more opportunity to get lost, damaged or stolen. To me it isn't worth the small difference in price.
As no notification is EVER required at USPS.....they are the option with the smallest hassle factor.
As far as insurance....it protects you the seller from any claim for loss, damage or theft. If the firearm doesn't arrive as advertised, buyer gets his $$$ back. A claim can be filed by sender or recipient.
Shipping a Handgun (or firearms other than rifles or shotguns)
You have two choices, ignore FedEx/UPS and risk them keeping your firearm or have a licensed dealer mail it USPS or ship through FedEx/UPS for you.
Handguns that will fit in a USPS Priority Mail medium Flat Rate Box with $1000 worth of insurance and Adult Signature on Delivery ships for less than $44. Thats about half the cost of FedEx Overnight or UPS Next Day. If the dealer tacks on a reasonable fee (I charge $10) then you pay about half of what you would pay if you did it yourself......and the receiving dealer won't pitch a hissy fit because you forgot to enclose your drivers license.
I prefer Adult Signature vs Signature Confirmation or Delivery Confirmation.
Remember, what USPS considers a "handgun" is not the same as ATF. If you want to mail a firearm through USPS it better be either a rifle or shotgun. Nothing else.
No silencers, AR lowers, frames, receivers, barreled actions and no "pistol grip only" shotguns......all classified by USPS as handguns and only mailable by a licensed dealer, manufacturer or certain LE on official business.
Third Party Firearm shippers
Bud's Gun Shop operates a service called "Ship My Gun". You fill out a shipping label at shipmygun.com and they provide you with a shipping label from UPS or FedEx. I have no doubt UPS/FedEx tariffs prohibit this. The actual "shipper" is the person who tenders or delivers a firearm to a carrier, not who pays for or prints the shipping label.
If the above isn't enough......
Regarding the ATF FAQ's https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/may-nonlicensee-ship-firearm-common-or-contract-carrier It's wrong. ATF knows its wrong. ATF will not correct it. If you read the citations to federal law below that FAQ answer youll see that notification to a common carrier is only required when shipping INTERSTATE to another nonlicensee. And that's already a federal crime.
03FFL Collector of Curios & Relics
Can only mail handguns meeting the definition of "antique" via the USPS. Meaning pre1898 only.
My gun, that I own is in another state, can my friend, mother, brother or someone there ship it to me?
No.
While you "own" it, you don't currently possess it. The firearm would have to be shipped to an FFL in your state.
