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Illinois Members, vote yes for a Constitutional Convention in November

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Jeff White, May 8, 2008.

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  1. Mr_Rogers

    Mr_Rogers Member

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    Jeff,
    There is a sister forum for politics called "armedpolitesociety".

    Joke, go easy on other posts.;););););)
     
  2. Jeff White

    Jeff White Moderator Staff Member

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    Non-partisan topics where there is a clear RKBA issue as there is in removing the line Subject to the police power from Illinois' RKBA in the present constitution is on topic in legal.

    Discussions of candidates are not on topic.

    Jeff
     
  3. Mr_Rogers

    Mr_Rogers Member

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    Repeat Jeff, just joking. Good luck with the Chicago project. You know, as a city, I think Chicago is a great town but it just has this feeling of malice from everyone in uniform from the police to the TSA screeners at the airport.
     
  4. Soybomb

    Soybomb Member

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    Bump as a reminder when voting
     
  5. damien

    damien Member

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    I'm going to vote for it. This is my thinking. Things may get better. WHOPEE!!!! :D Things may get worse or stay the same. :cuss: Then I move to Arizona. Either way I win by voting for the con-con. The situation is not going to improve by doing nothing.

    Of course, I am single, so this might be more of an option for me than others.
     
  6. BikerNut

    BikerNut Member

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    Illinois State Rifle Association Says NO!

    And I tend to believe they are right...

    ---------------------------------------------

    Illinois State Rifle Association Urges Hunters and Sportsmen to Oppose Constitutional Convention
    SPRINGFIELD, Ill., Sept. 22 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- The following was released today by the Illinois State Rifle Association (ISRA):

    The ISRA is urging state hunters, sportsmen and gun owners to vote "NO" this November on a ballot initiative to hold a state constitutional convention. The ISRA believes that holding a constitutional convention would open the door to significant changes in the state constitution and thus imperil the rights of law-abiding gun owners.

    "The delegate count in a constitutional convention would certainly be stacked in Chicago's favor," commented ISRA Executive Director, Richard Pearson. "Consequently, Mayor Daley would have carte blanche to craft the Illinois Constitution to his liking. Daley has said in the past that, if it were up to him, nobody would be allowed to own a gun. You can bet that if Daley is given the opportunity to meddle with the state constitution, he would seek that end."

    "We understand that a lot of law-abiding gun owners feel that a constitutional convention would provide an opportunity to correct deficiencies in Section 22," continued Pearson. "Under ideal circumstances, that opportunity would exist. However, as long as the Chicago Machine is in charge of the process, that just isn't going to happen."

    The ISRA is the state's leading advocate of safe, lawful and responsible firearms ownership. Since 1903, the ISRA has represented the interests of over 1.5 million law-abiding Illinois gun owners.

    This press release was posted on PRnewswire.

    Posted Wed Sep 24 10:05:38 CDT 2008
     
  7. Soybomb

    Soybomb Member

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    I think the ISRA is misguided
    Daley and chicago can already do whatever they please, we have no effective protection for the rkba through the state constiution. How can you get worse than that?
     
  8. Gunsby_Blazen

    Gunsby_Blazen Member

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    Vote no, we could lose more gun rights!!

    do we really want those guys who are in charge NOW to redraft our constitution? come on, the fellers in Springfield are not too likely to include any kind of pro gun anything. inst it more safe to not allow them to redraft it? We dont need those...D.... to be deciding our constitution.
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2008
  9. Matt-J2

    Matt-J2 Member

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    Soybomb, they could literally remove the 'not' from the wording, rather than the backdoor way they're doing it now.

    Ok, maybe more like slightly-to-the-side door.
     
  10. Jeff White

    Jeff White Moderator Staff Member

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    Everyone in the sick, criminal Illinois political establishment is aginst the constitutional convention. The Secretary of State even wrote the wording on the ballot which was overturned in court as being biased against a Constitutional Convention.

    That alone is reason enough to vote for it.

    Richard Pearson is wrong about this issue. It can't get any worse. As it is now, we have no (as in none, nada, non-existent) constitutional protection for RKBA in the state of Illinois. IT CAN'T GET ANY WORSE THEN IT IS

    Disgust and anger at the political establishment in this state has never been higher. Now is precisely the time to have a constitutional convention. I intend to run for delegate if we get the con con.

    It's our best change for meaningful change in this state.

    Jeff
     
  11. Gunsby_Blazen

    Gunsby_Blazen Member

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    Jeff, you seem to know alot about this.
    is there any place i can read up on this? As an Illinois citizen, i would like to be informed. On fox news radio, they are beating it to me to vote no. i figured they are a pretty conservative organization who would be out for upholding good American values. anyway, i would like to know more about this, what are the topics to be covered and what is likely to change?
     
  12. Birdhunter1

    Birdhunter1 Member

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    Jeff I whole heartedly agree with ya that our state needs major change, a new contitution woudl fix alot of things and i applaud you for caring and trying to get people to vote to change the constitution. However I do not see this as a feasible way to get the change this state needs because you can guarnatee the ones who make the decisions will stack the deck in such a way as to favor those in power, namely, Cook county and that dickhead mayor they have! A new constitution in this state guarnatees nothing, puts everything on the chopping block, and the "change" we will get will make the Rod Blagojevich administration's "change" seem like a blip on the radar.

    On another note the ISRA and the NRA both oppose it, on the other side of the political arena my union, IUOE #399 also opposes it. Now for these three organizations to agree on anything in the political world then it would either have to be plain ol common sense good or just plain sucks for everybody involved. In this particular case they both say it is not a good choice.

    Again I applaud you for getting others interested, but I will not be voting or encouraging folks to vote in favor of this.
     
  13. Jeff White

    Jeff White Moderator Staff Member

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    What is a feasible way to change things? We have been in terrible shape since 1971 when the current constitution was written. All feasible attempts at change have failed. Both parties are as corrupt as any crime family you can name. Tell me, what other option do you propose?

    Jeff
     
  14. Soybomb

    Soybomb Member

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    So? Is saying "I will not rob you, unless I decide to rob you" any better than saying "I will rob you?"

    What is "everything"? What is actually working well in the state? I agree that it no guarantee but isn't a chance better than the status quo? And from the strictly rkba perspective it can't get any worse.
     
  15. Birdhunter1

    Birdhunter1 Member

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    I'm not disagreeing the state of IL has major faults, but I do not think that the con-con will make it any better. Chicago politics is in control of IL in a bad way, and if they get their chance to change the constitution do you honestly think that it will be for the better for those who aren't in the circle?

    I think a new consitutional convention could work, and I would like to see the change. But only if the delegates would be based on one per county and not by a population of people like the IL house or senate. Now do you think the people of Chicago, or the politicians in charge, will let the rest of the state have that much power over them? Should Perry, Jackson and Lake County IL have the same amount of voting power in the drafting of a new constitution? Yes they should, but do you think the population of Cook or Lake Counties will give up that much power they have over smaller counties like Pope or Alexander? I don't think it will happen that way at all.

    Honestly where is the cow and a lantern when you need it? I read on here earlier it woudl be nice if Il was split at Springfield, but I woudl have to say that wouldn't be fair to those folks in the Chicago end of the state as they'd get the screws put to them even worse, like it or not those folks need the rest of us to balance against the Chicago machine as much as we need them. I don't have an answer on what would be the best solution, but I do not see this as a good solution. We can't get the legislature to pass a recall amendment and we can't get them to vote for concealed carry, so you think when redrafting the constitution of this great state that we will fair any better?
     
  16. Matt-J2

    Matt-J2 Member

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    It's pretty clear that yes, it's better. Course, the options are green poop in one hand and brown poop in the other, but it's pretty clear that green poop is better, for us and the environment.


    PS.- It's a joke. Shhh, don't tell the others.
     
  17. Onmilo

    Onmilo Member

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    Let's see, vote yes on a convention where the lawmakers could rewrite the Illinois constitution to,,,,,,
    1. Eliminate ALL private ownership of firearms in the state.
    2. Eliminate Judicial process for lawmakers accused of crimes, or better yet, absolve them entirely of any responsibility for crimes they may commit.
    3. Change the location of the State Capitol from Springfield to Chicago.
    And the list goes on and on.

    Yeah, I am voting NO on this issue tomarrow.
     
  18. Jeff White

    Jeff White Moderator Staff Member

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    The lawmakers aren't going to write the new constitution. Delegates will be elected. They can already eliminate private ownership of firearms in the stae with the stroke of a pen. What do you think, Subject only to the police power means means? It means that the state's police power trumps any right to keep and bear arms that's recognized in Section 22.

    http://www.wjbdradio.com/index.php?f=news_single&id=14312
    No one who is against it it, has yet to come up with an alternative to fix things. Come on all you naysayers, put up or shut up, what's the alternative?

    Jeff
     
  19. Rifleman 173

    Rifleman 173 Member

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    You do NOT want a Con-Con. The Chicago Democrats are just hoping and praying that we agree to a Con-Con so that they can change things to their liking. Vote No or AGAINST a Constitutional Convention or face ruination.
     
  20. Birdhunter1

    Birdhunter1 Member

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    The alternative is vote folks out of office, plain and simple, will it happen to the ones who need to be ousted prolly not but I don't feel drafting a new constitution is the answer.

    Jeff I wish I knew you and could actually engage in a conversation with you on this one as I think we'd each have a better argument (of course 100% civil) than we can type out on here. Regardless of the outcomes of this election season I will continue to do my best to promote 2nd amendment issues as I have no doubt you will, good luck tomorrow with your local elections and state races and I'll be back in a couple days to catch the other end of this one. The race for our state rep should go with our incumbent winning, who is a very pro gun republican who realy dislikes Rod and his cronies, hope all yours go well too.
     
  21. Soybomb

    Soybomb Member

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    Which can already be done in the legislature so... Everything that could happen, could already happen now. I just don't see the justification. I do always see a lot of threads where people express the sentiment that nothing will change (regarding rkba) without some serious shakeups. When the opportunity for a shakeup comes though people want the status quo even when it offers them absolutely nothing. We fight back against magazine cap bills and awb's every year. Lets go on the offensive and try to secure some protection for our rights. They're coming after the rkba this next session even if you vote down the concon.

    What chicago democrats can you show me that are lobbying for it? It seems like most of the established illinois machine is saying no which of course makes me think its all the better an idea.

    http://www.southtownstar.com/news/miller/1244842,102808miller.article makes some good points I think
     
  22. Marcus84

    Marcus84 Member

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    "SECTION 22. RIGHT TO ARMS
    Subject only to the police power, the right of the
    individual citizen to keep and bear arms shall not be
    infringed."

    If Heller gets incorporated would the bold part be voided?
     
  23. DKSuddeth

    DKSuddeth Member

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    News flash to you people I used to share state residence with. You have no gun rights in reality. You only have the ability to ask permission to buy and keep guns. Your state supreme court decided that the only thing 1-22 does is protect against an absolute ban on ALL firearms. That means that if they wanted to, nobody would be able to own anything except a single shot .22 rifle.

    Even if the convention ultimately concluded with no RKBA article, at least you'd have a finality and could make a choice as to what to do with your life.
     
  24. Nanook
    • Contributing Member

    Nanook Contributing Member

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    If the past is any indication, any elected politicians who are unseated will be given cushy jobs by those still in office.

    Like delegates to the Constitutional Convention. Where they will do their masters' bidding.

    I'm skeptical, to say the least.
     
  25. damien

    damien Member

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    Done did it. MISSHUN ACCOMPLISHED. Let's see how it turns out tonight.
     
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