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Laws & Technicalities, regarding inter-state FFL transfers and taxes...

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Dogtown Tom said:
It is only a straw purchase if he has her pay and complete the 4473 because he is ineligible to purchase a firearm himself.

That is incorrect Dogtown Tom. It is only a straw purchase if he has her pay with his money, and she fills out the 4473 when it is actually him buying the gun. Whether or not the final recipient of the gun is ineligible or not has absolutely no bearing on a straw purchase.
 
NavyLT Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogtown Tom
It is only a straw purchase if he has her pay and complete the 4473 because he is ineligible to purchase a firearm himself.

That is incorrect Dogtown Tom. It is only a straw purchase if he has her pay with his money, and she fills out the 4473 when it is actually him buying the gun. Whether or not the final recipient of the gun is ineligible or not has absolutely no bearing on a straw purchase.


You need to read Page 4 of the Form 4473,"Question 11.a "

Or see:

http://www.dontlie.org/FAQ.cfm

What is a straw purchase?

A straw purchase is an illegal firearm purchase where the actual buyer of the gun, being unable to pass the required federal background check or desiring to not have his or her name associated with the transaction, uses a proxy buyer who can pass the required background check to purchase the firearm for him/her. It is highly illegal and punishable by a $250,000 fine and 10 years in prison.
 
dogtown tom,

You need to read page 165 of the Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide published in 2005 by the BATFE which is the latest version, and the definition of straw purchase has not changed. Especially the bolded and underlined parts below. (BTW, that is page 165 of the paper copy, but page 166 of the pdf file.)

There are two SEPARATE felonies. The straw purchase is purchasing a firearm on behalf of another and lying on the 4473 WHETHER OR NOT that other person is eligible themselves to purchase that firearm.

The second felony, IF the actual purchaser IS prohibited, is providing a firearm to an ineligible person. Two SEPARATE felonies that can occur each one by themselves or can both occur at the same time depending on the act.

But, as CLEARLY spelled out by the ATF on their OFFICIAL .gov website, the eligibility of the actual recipient of the firearm to possess/purchase that firearm is IMMATERIAL to the straw purchase.

Comments?

http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/p53004.pdf

15. STRAW PURCHASES
Questions have arisen concerning the
lawfulness of firearms purchases from
licensees by persons who use a "straw
purchaser" (another person) to acquire
the firearms. Specifically, the actual
buyer uses the straw purchaser to execute
the Form 4473 purporting to show
that the straw purchaser is the actual
purchaser of the firearm. In some instances,
a straw purchaser is used because
the actual purchaser is prohibited
from acquiring the firearm. That is to
say, the actual purchaser is a felon or is
within one of the other prohibited categories
of persons who may not lawfully
acquire firearms or is a resident of a
State other than that in which the licensee's
business premises is located.
Because of his or her disability, the person
uses a straw purchaser who is not
prohibited from purchasing a firearm
from the licensee. In other instances,
neither the straw purchaser nor the actual
purchaser is prohibited from acquiring
the firearm.

In both instances, the straw purchaser
violates Federal law by making
false statements on Form 4473 to the
licensee with respect to the identity of
the actual purchaser of the firearm, as
well as the actual purchaser's residence
address and date of birth. The actual
purchaser who utilized the straw purchaser
to acquire a firearm has unlawfully
aided and abetted or caused the
making of the false statements. The
licensee selling the firearm under these
circumstances also violates Federal law
if the licensee is aware of the false
statements on the form. It is immaterial
that the actual purchaser and the straw
purchaser are residents of the State in
which the licensee's business premises
is located, are not prohibited from receiving
or possessing firearms, and
could have lawfully purchased firearms
from the licensee.

An example of an illegal straw purchase
is as follows: Mr. Smith asks Mr.
Jones to purchase a firearm for Mr.
Smith. Mr. Smith gives Mr. Jones the
money for the firearm. If Mr. Jones fills
out Form 4473, he violates the law by
falsely stating that he is the actual buyer
of the firearm. Mr. Smith also violates
the law because he has unlawfully aided
and abetted or caused the making of
false statements on the form.
Where a person purchases a firearm
with the intent of making a gift of the
firearm to another person, the person
making the purchase is indeed the true
purchaser. There is no straw purchaser
in these instances. In the above example,
if Mr. Jones had bought a firearm
with his own money to give to Mr. Smith
as a birthday present, Mr. Jones could
lawfully have completed Form 4473.
The use of gift certificates would also
not fall within the category of straw purchases.
The person redeeming the gift
certificate would be the actual purchaser
of the firearm and would be properly
reflected as such in the dealer's records.
 
NavyLT: There are two SEPARATE felonies. The straw purchase is purchasing a firearm on behalf of another and lying on the 4473 WHETHER OR NOT that other person is eligible themselves to purchase that firearm.

The second felony, IF the actual purchaser IS prohibited, is providing a firearm to an ineligible person. Two SEPARATE felonies that can occur each one by themselves or can both occur at the same time depending on the act.

Neither of which is the situation as outlined by grndslm.

Earlier you made the statement:

NavyLT: Ummmm...... straw purchase?!? It looks like you are giving your mother the money, and she is putting the gun on her credit card, and then the gun is getting transferred to you?

His mother is NOT mentioned as the one who is the actual purchaser of the firearm. The instance mentioned is not a straw purchase AS HE IS THE ACTUAL PURCHASER AND WILL COMPLETE A FORM 4473- not her.

His mother can even pay for it, complete a 4473 and gift it to him- still not a straw purchase.
 
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