Lead Poisoning --Valuable Health Information

[GaryL]

I had a heavy metal test done last spring. It was less than $100. My lead levels were a little high. The test was done using DMSA as the chelator to pull heavy metals from body tissues. The Dr. put me on a chelation therapy using DMSA, 2 days on DMSA (5 100mg capsules/day - 1 capsule every 4 hrs), 7 days off, for 10 weeks. Since then I've found DMSA can be purchased via the internet.

DMSA is a sulpher bearing compound that binds with heavy metals. It's perfectly safe to take, but will make you feel a little 'toxic' at first because it pulls out the accumulated heavy metals and your system has to deal with them. The only knock I have on DMSA is that is does unbalance the digestive system slightly, so it's important to do it in cycles 5-10 weeks of therapy followed by a month or so off. It also chelates out beneficial minerals, which need to be replaced with supplements. Some internet vendors will say it's safe to take every day, and it probably is, but I personally would not.

Searching for information can be frustating, as there is conflicting research, especially since mercury amalgums are considered "safe and effective", and there is an industry desiring to keep it that way, and a large number of natural/alternative practitioners stating otherwise. I have little interest in that debate, but some time ago I read an extensive research paper documenting research done with DMSA on autism patients with high heavy metal test results. Unfortuanely, I can't find it now, but it compared a number of chelation therapies for removing heavy metals from the body, and referenced other research about the impact of various therapies on the body.

There are a number of links that can be googled, but here is a short article that is interesting:

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0091-6765(200006)108:6<575:ACOPMM>2.0.CO;2-Y

And another with a decent explanation of DMSA therapy. (My thoughts about the Zapper this guy promotes are similiar to other "electrical" health systems first promoted over a 100 yrs ago, and I think they will share the same future)
http://zap.intergate.ca/dmsa.html

Here are my initial test results:

 

[MikePGS]

Is it possible that since the metal stays in your system for so long that one could gather lead poisoning over a long term?

Yes. If your exposed to a significant quantity at once, you will have acute symptoms, just a sudden onset of symptoms. If you slowly accumulate lead (your body takes roughly 3-4 weeks to purge it from your system... i forget exactly how long) your symptoms might be more subtle. Someone said that you can only ingest lead, which is incorrect. While its true that ingestion is the most common form of lead poisoning, inhalation (which of course is possible if shooting lead primers in a poorly ventilated area) is the second most common form, and you actually absorb it more readily through inhalation than ingestion.

 

[Uncle Don]

I think my lead exposure is from my tumbler. I tumble inside and don't deprime before I tumble. I am going to move my tumbler outside for the remainder of this year and see if that works out at my next test. because my levels are still low enough, I'm going to try one variable at a time.

I think you are exactly correct - except that the exposure comes from pouring it into a sifter, not the actual tumbling (as long as the lid is on).

I've been very educated on lead in the past year or so. As an full time instructor, I have to admit that I took little concern and when I got it tested, it was 36. Doc told me to chew three TUMS a day, take an iron tablet and wash my hands well with cold water, not warm or hot. Additionally I bought a product called "D-Lead" hand soap (do a google search) and using that, my level came down to 19 within a fairly short time period. I continue this regiment and hopefully, the next test will be lower yet. I was told that 40 is the magic number where they start getting pretty concerned and at 50, they want you to find another line of work away from lead exposure. I squeaked by the first time and am now pretty confident I've got the right regiment.

 

[joneb]

I loaded 50rnds of .38spl with Fiocchi leadless primers and they all went Bang. The only difference I noticed is that the primer pockets were cleaner.

 

[silverlance]

gary, thank you for posting your results. Lead, Antimony, and Mercury. No coincidence - the three biggest heavy metal offenders in ammunition.

here is what I do to reduce the chance of contamination:

1. tumble outdoors. my machine stays outdoors, right outside my side door. if it gets stolen or destroyed by the elements, oh well. i turn it on from inside the house (the cable runs under the door to the outside), and turn it off from the inside. i wait about 10 minutes for the dust to settle before going out there. when i have to pour out the media, I wear an OSHA respirator (they are about $2-3 each). You can reuse this respirator many times becuase I only use it when I pull out cases. It is enough to keep the dust out. I put a spent dryer sheet in there each time I get one from the laundry, and I change the media out after 350 cases have been tumbled. Treat the media as toxic contaminant and bag it up properly.

2. I deprime with a dedicated lee handpress. the spent primers are dropped direction from the press into a low walled tub with about an inch of water inside. this reduced the chance of inhaling primer powders (yuck). the primer pocket holes are also cleaned out over this tub. I wear a separate OHSA respirator mask for this step as well. by the way, respirators are basically heavily upgraded dust masks, but make sure they are OHSA approved.

3. I dont use cast bullets. i'm too careless, i might forget and poke my eyes or lick a finger. if you're careful, this probably doesn't apply to you. I use FMJ or perhaps SP, and I make sure to wash my hands after handling.

4. when i shoot, i shoot exclusively outdoors without cover or with top cover only (like a canopy). i shot a couple of times in an indoor range. i woudl leave each time with a creepy sweet taste in my mouth - that's lead. i tried to ask about lead danger at that range, but the guys just laughed it off. oh, by the way.. don't EVER sweep up brass either to gather brass or "clean up" at indoor ranges. there is a TON of lead dust on the floor of most indoor ranges and you along with everyone else will inhale it. my buddy kept trying to sweep up because he felt like he owned the establishment a tidy range. it was a poorly thought out idea. it is a different story at the outdoor ranges.

5. don't shoot prone at public range lines. at private ranges, put down some ground cover so you aren't snorting up dust off the concrete.

6. when cleaning guns, i flush them out with windex outdoors. (corrosive primers). i wear latex gloves. if nothing else, solvents and clp are carcinogenic I am sure. I make sure there is adequate ventilation. and lastly, i use a Ransom Mat so that all the mess, oil, etc is on that mat which is then wiped off at the end.

IMHO, two of the biggest risky behaviors are: 1. tumbling your brass on your bench, a foot or two away from your head, indoors; 2. cleaning guns and not cleaning the work surface afterwards - or not wearing gloves while handling contaminated chemicals.

finally, if indoor shooting or heavily covered outdoor shooting are your only options, WEAR A RESPIRATOR WHILE SHOOTING. sure you will look funny as hell and people might make comments, but the reason why they are not worried about inhaling lead fumes may be because they are already brain damaged.
YMMV, but i've been doing this.

 

[Cavalier Knight]

I also used this link and bought a hand soap called D-Lead. I went from 36 to 19 in three months and am sold on this soap.

I added a link to this product on my site as well under lead poison.

 

[Evocatii]

Article - Lead Exposure from Indoor Firing Ranges Among Students on Shooting Teams

I had found an article on a government website that was in regard to an Alaskan school shooting team that was found to have elevated levels. It is a quick read and gives some insight into the discussion.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5423a1.htm

 

[js2013]

After reading this thread I went to Lowe's and picked up a couple of Lead Test kits. They're about $4. They're simple to use and one kit can be used to test several different areas. I used then to check out my reloading station and an indoor range I frequent. It was an eye opener.

 

[glockman19]

Lead Poisoning

Symptoms
Lead poisoning usually does not cause noticeable symptoms. Most lead poisoning comes from low levels of exposure over a long period of time. The major organ systems affected are the central nervous system, gastrointestinal (digestive) tract, and the renal system (urinary tract).

Chronic lead exposure may cause the following symptoms.

General physical symptoms in children and adults (usually seen when lead poisoning levels are severe)
Stomachaches, cramping, constipation, or diarrhea
Nausea, vomiting
Persistent, unexplained fatigue
Headache
Muscle weakness
Higher rates of tooth decay
Children with chronic low blood lead levels who may not have obvious symptoms of lead poisoning may show slightly lower intelligence and be smaller in size than children their age who do not have low to moderate levels of lead poisoning. A recent study showed that declines in IQ can even be seen in children with blood lead concentrations below 10 micrograms of lead per deciliter of blood (10 µg/dL), the level of concern defined by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the World Health Organization. 11 Chronic exposure to lead may also cause behavioral problems in these children.

Behavioral symptoms in children
Irritability or aggressiveness
Hyperactivity, being easily distracted, impulsiveness
Learning difficulties
Lethargy or less interest in play
Loss of appetite
Behavioral symptoms in adults
Unexplained changes in mood or personality
Changes in sleep patterns
Inability to concentrate
Decreased sex drive
Memory loss
Irritability
Neurological symptoms (caused by effects of lead on the nervous system)
Poor coordination
Weakness in hands and feet
Headaches
Convulsions
Paralysis
Coma
Diagnosing lead poisoning can be difficult because many other conditions cause similar symptoms.

Severe symptoms of acute lead poisoning can include seizures, unconsciousness, paralysis, or swelling in the brain. However, exposure to such a high level of lead is not common. 1 If you experience these symptoms, seek emergency medical care.

Treatment Overview
Treatment for lead poisoning begins with removing the sources of lead and providing balanced nutrition. These measures are usually sufficient to limit exposure to lead and reduce lead levels in the body.

Old paint chips and dirt are the most common sources of lead in the home. Lead-based paint and the dust and dirt that come from its decomposition should be removed by professionals. In the workplace, removal of sources usually involves removing lead dust that is in the air, as well as making sure adults don't bring contaminated dust or dirt into the home on clothes worn for work.

Balanced nutrition includes adequate amounts of vitamins and minerals such as iron, calcium, and vitamin C. A person who eats a balanced, nutritious diet absorbs less lead than a person whose diet is inadequate.

If removing the source of lead and balancing nutrition do not reduce lead levels, or if the blood lead level is very high, chelation therapy may be used. Chelation therapy is a process that rapidly reduces the amount of lead stored in the body. Drugs called chelating agents cause metals like lead to bind to them, and then they are eliminated from the body through urine. Because chelating agents increase the absorption of lead and other metals, it is essential that sources of lead exposure be removed before a person is treated.

Prevention, primarily through screening of both children and adults, is the most effective means of reducing or eliminating the effects of lead poisoning. Damage from lead poisoning, especially to the central nervous system, is often incurable and may not improve with treatment.

Medications
Chelating agents are used for severe lead poisoning. Chelating agents are medications that bind with lead in blood and both soft and bony tissues and eliminate it quickly from the body, usually through the urine.

The use of chelating agents for lead poisoning is still being studied, and there is no single treatment or drug of choice. In general, drug treatment is recommended when blood lead levels are above 45 micrograms per deciliter (µg/dL) or when there are symptoms of lead poisoning, especially lead encephalopathy.

There is disagreement over whether chelation therapy is needed for children with blood lead levels between 25 µg/dL and 44 µg/dL—one study showed no benefit to the child. 15 Reducing or removing environmental lead sources, correcting iron deficiency, and improving nutrition may be enough to lower lead levels in the blood. The decision to use chelating agents depends on how long the child has been exposed to lead, how high the blood lead level is, what the symptoms are, and whether the blood lead level remains high even after the source of lead is removed or reduced and nutrition is improved.

In theory, chelating agents prevent further damage by reducing blood lead levels rapidly. Damage to the blood may repair itself if blood lead levels are lowered. Kidney damage may also heal, unless it has been too extensive. Chelation therapy may not reverse central nervous system (brain and spinal cord) damage that has already occurred.

Medication Choices
Chelating agents are chemicals that bind with lead for the treatment of lead poisoning.

What To Think About
Chelating agents increase absorption of lead and other metals. A person exposed to lead while taking a chelating agent may absorb more of the lead, thus defeating the purpose of the therapy and possibly doing even more harm. Therefore, it is essential that lead sources be removed from your environment before treatment. (This may require that treatment be administered in a hospital.) Do not return home or to the workplace until lead sources have been removed.

Iron deficiency also increases lead absorption. Iron deficiency cannot be treated at the same time as chelation therapy because the chelating drug will bind to iron and remove it as well. Iron deficiency must be treated either before or after chelation therapy.

Chelation therapy does reduce blood lead levels and may slow down problems with kidney function associated with lead poisoning. 16 However, it does not appear to improve cognitive damage or other neurological problems already caused by the lead poisoning. 15 If chelation therapy is necessary, it is best to consult with a doctor experienced with this treatment.

 

[bl4ckd0g]

I always wash my spent/found casings a few times w/ Tri-Sodium Phosphate and rinse them off two or three times. Then I dry and tumble. Usually just need a half or full teaspoon per gallon of water.

TSP is an industrial detergent to control lead dust and kill mold/mildew, yet it is gentle enough for use on laundry. It is necessary however to use rubber gloves with TSP as it will remove the oils from your skin.

I use it everyday on my found range brass and it occasionally gives me clean primer anvils when I decap.

 

[AussieMike]

G'day All,

Just wanted to add to this thread because I didn't see mentioned one point I think is really important.

I'm a medical researcher from Australia and did a lot of work on lead poisonning especially in children. Published a number of peer reviewed articles in Australia's national medical jpurnal ( and, no, Australia is not a third world country and our medical research output, on a per capita basis exceeds the US and UK).

The important point is that children:
- absorb more of the lead that they are exposed to compared to adults;
- are much, much more sensitive to the effects of lead because it affects the developing brain - risk greatest from 9 months to 4-5 years.

Children can with lower levels of exposure have reduced IQ, hearing problems etc as listed earlier in this post and with very high levels of exposure can start having convulsions, go into a coma and die. One or two children die each year from lead poisonning in Oz.

If you have a high lead level, or if your children may be exposed because of where you tumble, cast, reload, dispose of dross from casting etc get their blood lead levels checked.

A child with a blood lead level of 25mcg/dl will, on average, lose 5-10 IQ points (much more if they are also iron deficient) but WILL NOT SHOW ANY SYMPTOMS.

Dogs and cats may also be effected.

BTW I'ved lurked on this board for several years but don't really have much to post as I'm a handgun collector but not a shooter. Our laws here allow me to buy handguns (after high level background check and demonstrating a very high level of security of my storage area - simply having a safe is not nearly enough) but I am not allowed to possess ammo for the guns, or to load or shoot them. I love my nineteenth century Colt SAAs and Webleys though.

Regards,

mike

 

[Uncle Don]

That is incredibly interesting and helpful information AussieMike - thank you for posting it.

 

[tclover]

I had been casting for several yrs. No adverse effects and so far nothing in blood stream. I did however give it just last week. Figured I have enough bullets(shoot outdoors) to last me until total ban arrives.......
I still reload and shoot just use jacketed stuff now

 

[davinci]

Ok, three months later and we haven't heard back from the fella who started this discussion.

Did you get a second test yet? Have you changed your habits at all?

 

[ARTJR338WM]

What ever happened to the Nycad line of HG ammo? I think S&W use to sell it? not sure, but it was a all lead bullet incapsulated in nylon for use at indoor ranges. If I recall it also got pretty good revies as a self defense round.

 

[PC40]

I think it was spelled "Nyclad" as in "Nylon Clad". I remember them too. I think it was S&W but are they in the ammo business now? Could it have gone the way of the so-called "armor-piercing" Teflon coated bullet - if there was a Teflon coated bullet...?

I still have some moly-lubed bullet loads left over from before switching to plated/jacketed. I shot 50 the other night and didn't see much if any leading in my Kimber, I take that as a good sign as far as exposure, but after these are gone it's strictly copper covered. These same loads left heavy deposits in a Taurus revolver.

Don't recall it being mentioned, but cleaning firearms is another possible means of exposure. (Oops, yes it has been mentioned!)

My lead level as checked 6 weeks ago was 25.9 mcg/dl! Not as bad as some of the other folks here, but still elevated. It may have been higher because I had started being more careful in the weeks prior to the test. I get tested again in February. I'm continuously trying to improve.

 

[rodregier]

+1 on using a respirator mask when shooting indoors. I started it around here, many of the IPSC crowd have adopted the practice. Seems weird at first, but you get used to it. I'm using a cartridge half-face mask w/HEPA filters. It also helps with the smoke particulates too.

I've read and been told that decades ago, they shot without hearing protection on ranges. No-one intelligent today would even dream of shooting w/o hearing protection.

 

[snuffy]

After having read this and the thread on TFL, I got tested last July while at my veterans clinic. The results didn't come with the other numbers, so I asked today what my #'s where. 5.0!

Considering how much lead I am in contact with, casting, loading those boolits, and shooting, I'm good to go. I do have access to an indoor range, but do most of my shooting outdoors. I do NOT have any type of ventilation for my casting pot. I'm careful about washing my hands and keepin the lead away from food.

So to me, this is much to do about almost nothing!

 

[actionflies]

After 3 months of not shooting, sold all my lead bullets and resupplying with Ranier and FMJ (ouch!) bullets, taking 1000mg of vitamin C daily. I went in for my blood test and will get the result in 2 weeks. I am nervous and hope for the best.

 

[SHTFmilitia]

Good Thread!!
Thanks for the read, and learning since i am just getting into reloading soon when my press arrives.

 

[snuffy]

Actionflies, I'm sure sorry you had to restrict your shooting. When faced with a possible health concern, we do what is needed to rectify it. Here's hoping the lead levels have dropped for you.

 

[Aged In Oak]

This is a great thread,with lots of helpful info! I started wondering about this because even though I shoot infrequently (due to schedule), I pretty much have to use an indoor range because all the outdoor ones are much farther away [grumble]. That said, I have a couple questions:

1) Does anyone know a good source for lead-free primers? I've checked a couple places like Midway but they don't seem to carry them, and I haven't found them locally either.

2) Regarding bullet choices, I know plated bullets like those from Rainier or TMJs are supposed to be much safer for handling and do a good job eliminating vaporization when shooting. Are the moly-coated lead bullets like those from Precision as good at that? I know what the manufacturer website says, but I thought I'd see if anyone could say for sure.

 

[actionflies]

The price of Ranier and Berry's plated bullet have gone up and if not more than bulk Win or Rem jacketed bullet. With the plated bullet, you need to use lead bullet data or the plating will break if velocity is too high. It makes no sense to buy plated bullet when I can buy FMJ bullet. Go to Cabelas website and price them out and you'll see no reason to buy plated bullet. For lead free primers, it's out there but more expensive.

 

[Aged In Oak]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I had thought that because most FMJs have an exposed lead base, they don't do much to solve the lead vaporization problem, as compared to a plated or total metal jacket bullet which covers the whole projectile.

 

[actionflies]

Aged In Oak, you are correct but I think the exposure of FMJ is a lot less than lead bullet. I believe you will get expose to lead by just shooting and controlling the exposure is up to you and the environment that you shoot in.