M1 Carbine (U.S Carbine Cal. .30 M1)

[Charly2020!]

I came across the following beauty; it is in impeccable condition. Here are some details:

Manufacturer: Ingram Manufacturing Div. General Motors
Manufacture date: 12-44
Caliber: .30 M1

I need your help to determine the following:

1. If you take a close look at pictures 7 and 8 you can see tiny cylindrical component. What is it for?
2. Although the stock is in mint condition, it seems that it was modified from its original design. Why is that?
3. What's the average price for a Carbine Cal. 30 M1 in MINT condition such as this one?

 

[hps1]

Nice carbine. American Rifleman article on Inland carbines:

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2014/12/16/inland-manufacturings-1945-m1-carbine/

That loop was the base for front sling swivel as issued. They have also checkered stock and filled the cutout for the oiler (small cylinder) which secured sling at butt end of stock and added conventional sling swivels.

Might want to look under barrel inside stock to see if it is an original GI or reproduction:

In one of its early press releases, Inland wrote,"[T]hese carbines are so precisely copied from the original specifications that the company marks the underside of the barrel and the inside of the stock of these current models to prevent potential fraudsters from passing these new carbines as mint WWII originals... ."

Regards,
hps

 

[funnelcake]

As above - you’ll need an original stock/hand guard, front barrel band, and sling/oiler to maximize value. Figure $250-300 bucks all in, but the rifle will potentially be worth ~$500 bucks more.

Almost all Carbines were rebuilt & are mix-masters. Value is maximized by correct, war-era parts.

 

[fpgt72]

What the others posted....the stock will need to be replaced because of the checkering.

Inland is one of the more common flavors, Jukebox company, IBM did not get made in the numbers....then there is the UN-Quality.

Anymore any GI carbine (well almost any) will fetch right at $1000....with more hard to find features adding to the value.

You have a good starting point there, just needs a few easy things.

 

[lemaymiami]

All of your questions revolve around the carbine's value.. but you also might want to check it out for function... The visible mods to the stock look fairly competently done - and more than a few carbines were "sporterized" years ago when they were really cheap to pick up and there were tons of cheap surplus ammo widely available... Yes with a few replacement parts (and a some money spent) you might end up with something that fetches a good price - but don't overlook it's also a great fun rifle for range time and other possibilities.

Along with being a good candidate for restoration - that particular carbine might just be a great shooter...

 

[hps1]

In 2013, a brand-new, privately owned gun manufacturing company was organized under the name of Inland Mfg., LLC. Although this company has no formal ties to General Motors,.........

It should come as no surprise, considering the company's name and location, that the first two rifle models off the production line are replicas of the M1 Carbine, including what the company calls a 1945 version of the fixed-stock M1.........

In one of its early press releases, Inland wrote,"[T]hese carbines are so precisely copied from the original specifications that the company marks the underside of the barrel and the inside of the stock of these current models to prevent potential fraudsters from passing these new carbines as mint WWII originals... ."

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2014/12/16/inland-manufacturings-1945-m1-carbine/

Regards,
hps

 

[MosinT53Hunter]

Mint condition is a relative thing. Yours is in great condition but the stock does little to increase the value. Anything sporterized diminishes the value to collectors. If it was in stock USGI, could be looking values in around 1-2 grand, give or take. With current stock configuration, hmm...700 to 900, and that's a guess on my part. For me, a carbine is ment to be shot, and not stored away hoping its going to be more valuable in the foreseeable future.

 

[fpgt72]

Mint condition is a relative thing. Yours is in great condition but the stock does little to increase the value. Anything sporterized diminishes the value to collectors. If it was in stock USGI, could be looking values in around 1-2 grand, give or take. With current stock configuration, hmm...700 to 900, and that's a guess on my part. For me, a carbine is ment to be shot, and not stored away hoping its going to be more valuable in the foreseeable future.

Very true....

I would add that I think in the current market the only people looking at a GI carbine are going to want a GI CARBINE.....no mods to it at all. And if your rifle passes the smell test and is the "real deal" the first thing a buyer is going to do is start adding up in his mind what it is going to take to get it back to original.....then pad it by X% and shoot you that number....and when you are taken aback by it that buyer will say....well the stock has been modded....we are missing this, that new stock is going to run $X....bla bla bla.

In 2020 I think if you are a carbine buyer you are pretty much looking at "real" guns, not the modern or even older commercial versions of them. They just don't really have the draw the "military" versions do.....and really with the cost of ammo, the casual shooter is still going to stay away.....I know I load for it, and most folk that shoot them often do as well.

 

[Speedo66]

If you don't reload, the ammo is no more expense than .38Spl. if you get a decent price on it. You can usually find it online for under $20, and that's a box of 50, not 20 like most rifle cartridges. AIM Surplus for one always seems to have them for less than $20 a box. They also have good prices on 15 and 30 round Korean mags, which are excellent.

If you're not looking to flip it, that's a nice stock which will serve you well. Wait for good deals on the missing stock parts and accumulate them. I wouldn't wait too long as prices are constantly going up on all Carbine parts it seems.

That stock is probably aftermarket.

 

[CoalTrain49]

All of your questions revolve around the carbine's value.. but you also might want to check it out for function... The visible mods to the stock look fairly competently done - and more than a few carbines were "sporterized" years ago when they were really cheap to pick up and there were tons of cheap surplus ammo widely available... Yes with a few replacement parts (and a some money spent) you might end up with something that fetches a good price - but don't overlook it's also a great fun rifle for range time and other possibilities.

Along with being a good candidate for restoration - that particular carbine might just be a great shooter...

Muzzle wear gauge would be a good place to start to know if the barrel has any life left in it. People who buy those carbines always want to know how far the gauge goes into the bore. I've had 2 Inlands. The first one was a dog in the shootability dept. I sold that one and bought one with a good amount of life left in the barrel. That one shoots pretty well, maybe 3-4 MOA which is all you can expect.

Looking at that one I would say it's value is in the fun factor, not the collector factor. If the muzzle came up 1.5 or less I would say $700 tops as a shooter. The stock and the barrel band will need to be replaced for any collector value. Probably not worth the investment IMHO.

Also, replacement barrels are available but they won't be USGI unless you want to pay double.

 

[fpgt72]

If you don't reload, the ammo is no more expense than .38Spl. if you get a decent price on it. You can usually find it online for under $20, and that's a box of 50, not 20 like most rifle cartridges. AIM Surplus for one always seems to have them for less than $20 a box. They also have good prices on 15 and 30 round Korean mags, which are excellent.

If you're not looking to flip it, that's a nice stock which will serve you well. Wait for good deals on the missing stock parts and accumulate them. I wouldn't wait too long as prices are constantly going up on all Carbine parts it seems.

That stock is probably aftermarket.

I have not bought factory ammo for it in years....guess some people have stepped up.....under $20 for a box of ????50????? that is almost as cheap as shooting 22mag.....heck it is cheaper.

 

[someguy2800]

If it looked to be in good mechanical shape I’d be a buyer at $700. If not for the stock it would easily be a $1000+ gun.

 

[carbine85]

A Carbine with the correct stock with cartouches and a handguard that is a close match makes a big difference in value. Your Carbine has a modified type 3 bayonet barrel band that also needs to be replaced. With that said it's worth $375 - $450 as is. A lot of people will pay more. The correct parts will cost you $200 + or -.
Is the barrel import marked? Blue Sky import marks decrease the value more than some of the others.

 

[carbine85]

I just went back and looked at the barrel band. It's fine, not sure what I was looking at.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

Around here that gun would have $650-750 on the tag at a local gunshop or show. If restored to original condition using GI parts, close to a grand.

 

[CoalTrain49]

A Carbine with the correct stock with cartouches and a handguard that is a close match makes a big difference in value. Your Carbine has a modified type 3 bayonet barrel band that also needs to be replaced. With that said it's worth $375 - $450 as is. A lot of people will pay more. The correct parts will cost you $200 + or -.
Is the barrel import marked? Blue Sky import marks decrease the value more than some of the others.

Like just about everybody.

 

[CapnMac]

Around here that gun would have $650-750 on the tag at a local gunshop or show.

Been seeing closer to $1100, even with a checkered stock, for metal in that clean a shape.

 

[Charly2020!]

Thank you y'all.

So this carbine was last used in 1965! Since then, it has been stored. Although the stock has been sporterized, the original owner told me that the other parts were not replaced at all. Furthermore, he confirmed that it was fired 5 times at the most. So perhaps, this carbine has not even fired more than 500 rounds.

What I would like to do know, is try to find the right GI stock. If Anyone has a good and reliable site to purchase it, please do share it.

 

[MosinT53Hunter]

Thank you y'all.

So this carbine was last used in 1965! Since then, it has been stored. Although the stock has been sporterized, the original owner told me that the other parts were not replaced at all. Furthermore, he confirmed that it was fired 5 times at the most. So perhaps, this carbine has not even fired more than 500 rounds.

What I would like to do know, is try to find the right GI stock. If Anyone has a good and reliable site to purchase it, please do share it.

Numrich is a good place to start.

 

[CoalTrain49]

Thank you y'all.

So this carbine was last used in 1965! Since then, it has been stored. Although the stock has been sporterized, the original owner told me that the other parts were not replaced at all. Furthermore, he confirmed that it was fired 5 times at the most. So perhaps, this carbine has not even fired more than 500 rounds.

What I would like to do know, is try to find the right GI stock. If Anyone has a good and reliable site to purchase it, please do share it.

Look here.

http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=257379

 

[lionking]

Others have said what needs to be said, I just want to focus on the term "mint" for a moment. This example is not mint, it was issued to the military, maybe have been overhauled at a government arsenal, and some owner altered it after the fact.

Lots of sellers name their surplus guns as "mint" when selling them, all those SKS , Mosin, MAS, and such didn't become available to public being mint, they were serviced, made over and then sold to the public. You may have a SKS that is mint from AFTER being overhauled and the seller calls it that but it isn't mint as still being as is never issued and never used from original factory. It would be like getting a used 1966 Ford Mustang, rebuilding the engine and giving it a new paint job and selling it as "mint".

Real true mint surplus guns can be found sometimes but they are going to bring a huge premium in collector value.

 

[MosinT53Hunter]

Others have said what needs to be said, I just want to focus on the term "mint" for a moment. This example is not mint, it was issued to the military, maybe have been overhauled at a government arsenal, and some owner altered it after the fact.

Lots of sellers name their surplus guns as "mint" when selling them, all those SKS , Mosin, MAS, and such didn't become available to public being mint, they were serviced, made over and then sold to the public. You may have a SKS that is mint from AFTER being overhauled and the seller calls it that but it isn't mint as still being as is never issued and never used from original factory. It would be like getting a used 1966 Ford Mustang, rebuilding the engine and giving it a new paint job and selling it as "mint".

Real true mint surplus guns can be found sometimes but they are going to bring a huge premium in collector value.

Also to be noted, don't take the word of the former owners of what matches or not. Check all the parts by hand to know exactly what you claim to be is true. Just my two cents.

 

[fpgt72]

A Carbine with the correct stock with cartouches and a handguard that is a close match makes a big difference in value. Your Carbine has a modified type 3 bayonet barrel band that also needs to be replaced. With that said it's worth $375 - $450 as is. A lot of people will pay more. The correct parts will cost you $200 + or -.
Is the barrel import marked? Blue Sky import marks decrease the value more than some of the others.

I would disagree on the blue sky.

At one time this was correct, however in the past few years people have learned.....I guess it is the internet....that these rifles be they a garand or carbine, have korean war written all over them.

They are generally in rougher shape due to the hard life they have lived.....this can mean something to collectors looking for that special item.

 

[fpgt72]

Others have said what needs to be said, I just want to focus on the term "mint" for a moment. This example is not mint, it was issued to the military, maybe have been overhauled at a government arsenal, and some owner altered it after the fact.

Lots of sellers name their surplus guns as "mint" when selling them, all those SKS , Mosin, MAS, and such didn't become available to public being mint, they were serviced, made over and then sold to the public. You may have a SKS that is mint from AFTER being overhauled and the seller calls it that but it isn't mint as still being as is never issued and never used from original factory. It would be like getting a used 1966 Ford Mustang, rebuilding the engine and giving it a new paint job and selling it as "mint".

Real true mint surplus guns can be found sometimes but they are going to bring a huge premium in collector value.

IMHO the term "mint" gets used way too often.....it is a bit of a gray area.

It reminds me a bit of coins when I played in that area....grading coins I always felt was a black art....or perhaps a shady art. I never really saw the difference between a 95% and a 85%....I just could not see the imperfections, wear, whatever without it being shown to me. So in looking at items I just had to take it at face value.

IMHO there is NO mint military arm unless it is something like garand #1 or something like that. These are items that got made very fast, to pretty loose standards (measured against other guns)....they are to be rugged, work, and that is just it. Now if you want to go into the "un-issued" that is another bag of worms, and I hate that term as well.....how the hell do you know if it was unissued......did you happen to be in Chile in 1899 when that mauser got to the country...did you follow it through its time there.....nope. All you can do is look at the item and say.....that is darn nice. Unless you unwrap it from its factory packaging (and again IMHO you are stupid if you do this) you have no clue.

Just call it a darn nice example.

 

[lemaymiami]

Forgot to mention... the CMP ... http://forums.thecmp.org/index.php is just about your best resource for all things carbine.
Go here for history and a very good breakdown of all the manufacturers of carbines over the years - both the G.I. versions and the after war commercial ones.... http://www.m1carbinesinc.com/
This site also has great into on carbines of all kinds from collectors mostly... http://www.milsurps.com/

These three sites are where I learned what little I know about carbines back when I was wanting one of my own - for the exact same purpose those old war babies were designed for... -I don't collect anything at all....